:salam2: I figured out how to multi-quote!
Sorry but according to your own definition of understanding the Qur'aan and Sunnah- you have made 'your' Islaam into an ideology.
No not an ideology but just an interpretation.
When did Allaah or the Messenger of Allaah ever teach us that we must understand the Qur'aan and Sunnah with accordance to 'Logic'.
How can you say otherwise? How can you just randomly accept something if it doesn't make sense to you? How do you know it's the truth then?
Worst of all you are not even using logic in a general sense. Indeed my logic is able to appreciate the stoning of the aduleterer or the adulteress (in an Islaamic state)- and so did the logic of the Messenger of Allaah and so did the logic of the Sahaabah and the righteous predecessors.
I was using my logic, which doesn't appreciate stoning because it's not stated in the Quran as a punishment. I don't understand why you can appreciate a punishment not sanctioned by Allah?
So, throw your logic behind your back and come back to the saved group. The group that has been promised paradise.
How do you know you will get paradise in the afterlife if you don't use your logic to verify that this is a correct religion? That doesn't make sense... well it doesn't make sense to me...
The Messenger of Allaah :saw2: said: “My ummah will split into seventy-three sects, all of whom will be in Hell except one group.” They said: Who are they, O Messenger of Allaah? He said: “(Those who follow) that which I and my companions follow.”[Al-Tirmidhi]
How could our Prophet
tell the future? The Quran states otherwise. (I already provided you with a verse that says otherwise)
Allaah said in Soorah al-Tawbah: 100 "And the first to embrace Islam of the Muhajiroon (those who migrated from Makkah to Al-Madinah) and the Ansar (the citizens of Al-Madinah who helped and gave aid to the Muhajiroon) and also those who followed them exactly (in Faith). Allah is well-pleased with them as they are well-pleased with Him. He has prepared for them Gardens under which rivers flow (Paradise), to dwell therein forever. That is the supreme success."
brother, why did you post this? Can you answer please as I am greatly confused...
Are you a Hadeeth scholar? You simply declare it to be not Saheeh because it contradicts your own logic. So, if an authentic narration does not contradict the Qur'aan according to your logic.. but it contradicts according to my logic- then am I allowed to throw that hadeeth behind my back? Or a third hadeeth may not contradict to both our logic, but it contradicts one of our memeber's logic... can he/she throw that hadeeth away?
Why can't I reject a Hadith if it contradicts with my logic wich i will show? Because I'm not a scholar? Listen brother, My grounds for rejecting Hadith are simple.
-If the narrator has already narrated a false hadith, I disregard it
-If it contradicts with the Quran, I disregard it
-If it contradicts with Muhammad's merciful behaviour, I disregard it
-If it contradicts with another Hadith, then I see which one is false according to above and disregard it
-If the 'isnad' has less then 4 narrators, I disregard it
Why do I have to stand around while our Prophet
is being insulted by these Hadith? Just because I'm not a Hadith scholar? It's the duty for every Muslim to protect our prophet
honour.
So, according to whose logic is this religion based on? Your Logic? My Logic? Or Joe's Logic?
My logic of course. I try and always will try to keep my logic open minded…
The verses refer to the person who commits Zinaa and is unmarried. Zinaa' is used for both fornication and adultery in Islaamic terms.
Nope. Let's look at multipule translations of the verse. Remember that adultery is married intercourse and fornification is unmarried intercourse (the other translation is commentary)
Yusuf Ali: (
The woman and the man guilty of adultery or fornication,- flog each of them with a hundred stripes: Let not compassion move you in their case, in a matter prescribed by Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day: and let a party of the Believers witness their punishment.
Marmaduke Pickthall: (
The adulterer and the adulteress, scourge ye each one of them (with) a hundred stripes. And let not pity for the twain withhold you from obedience to Allah, if ye believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a party of believers witness their punishment.)
Mushin Khan: (
The woman and the man guilty of illegal sexual intercourse, flog each of them with a hundred stripes. Let not pity withhold you in their case, in a punishment prescribed by Allah, if you believe in Allah and the Last Day. And let a party of the believers witness their punishment.)
It doesn't say one or the other. It just says the punishment for illegal intercourse is 100 lashes. Both fornification and adultery are illegeal intercourse so there punishment is 100 lashes.
All the scholars have agreed that the punishment for the Adulterer and the Adulteress is stoning to death.
Why would they say that even though punishment for Adultery is 100 lashes? Because they like to follow the Hadith over the Quran? Because they think the Hadith can abrogate the Quran? Because they were told by previous scholars? Please explain why...
You come to me after 1400 years- indicating that the religion has not been preserved?
The only thing that is preserved in our religion is the Quran. No Hadith. Nothing else.
Are you saying that a group of the followers of the Prophet :saw2: failed to emerge untill after 1400 years? Then, surely the hadeeth has been proven wrong.
Sorry I don't understand what you are trying to convey. The Prophet never wrote down the Hadith for us. Why didn't he if were supposed to follow it? Senseless...
So you have 3 choice here:
1) Accept the fact that you are wrong and accept what the Muslim Ummah was upon for the last 1400 years.
2) Throw away all these narrations too and stick to your distorted image of al-Islaam... and thus pushing you far away from Allaah and increasing you in your pride and stubborness
3) Clearly state that Allaah failed to preserve this religion.
1) You mean stoning? I prefer to follow the Quran over people who throw stones for no justifiable reason when the real punishment is shown in the Quran...
2) This is a pretty reasonable offer. There is just no way you can trust Bhukari and Muslim with all there mistakes. (I am going to post more of his errors soon! working on it!)
3)Why would I ever say such a thing! Allah has promised to save the Quran nothing else! I will never in my life admit that the
CREATOR is wrong!
We only need to follow the Quran and remember that the Hadith is corrupt and when we see each Hadith, we need to take it with a degree of skepticism.
Choice number 1 is best for your hereafter and inshaa'Allaah will lead you to eternal bliss.
Choice number 3 is the worst for you and most definately guarantee you a place in the hell-fire for eternity
Choice number 2 is a slippery slope that may lead you to choice number 3 at a later stage. The choice in itself is heresy and you are most definately deserving to be punished by Allaah in the hereafter- as you have deeply innovated in the religion.
How have I innovated in the religion? I only followed the punishment in the Quran. Please be so kind to explain how I have innovated when I follow a punishment articulated in the Quran.
The authentic sunnah is revelation just like the Qur'aan, as Allaah said in Soorah al-Najm: 3-4
"Nor does he speak from [his own] desires. It is not but a revelation revealed"
They are refering to the Quran not sunnah. How do I know? Because It states later...
(Quran 53:3:
Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire)
(Quran 53:3:
It is not but a revelation revealed,)
(Quran 53:5:
He was taught by one Mighty in Power,)
Was our Prophet
actions and sayings taught to him by "one Mighty in Power"?
Your strict criteria? Mr. Self-Proclaim Hadeeth Scholar... what if a hadeeth fits 'your strict criteria' but not 'my strict criteria'.
Do I throw the hadeeth away? Or do I accept it- because you want all of us to blind follow your logic and intellect?
I want you to use your own logic to decide if a Hadith is accurate or not. Don't just say Bhukari is accurate because he has a isnad. The other 99% of Hadith he rejected also had a isnad.
Random side note:
-don't give Bhukari a infallible status just because he and his students (Muslim and Abu Dawood) said so.
-don't give Abu Dawood a infallible status just because his student (Al-Nasa'i) said so.
-don't give Muslim a infallible status just because his student (Tirmidhi) said so.
-don't give Tirmidhi a infallible status because his student (Ibn Majah) said so.
Have you noticed? Those are the 6 writers of Sunni Islam's 6 major Hadith collections! All students of the previous writer! So they probably didn't verify each others collections as they claim.
With their corrupt hadeeth collection? May I ask- do you even accept any hadeeth from Bukhaari? If yes- you are corrupted too.
Nope I do not unless someone can prove to me one of his Hadith are accurate.
How many hadeeth have you memorized in arabic? 1? How many with it's chain of narrators? 1?
Or actually have you ever seen a chain of narration?
Memorized? No. But I have seen some of his isnad. I believe many of his Hadith are not narrated by 4 people or more (the Quranic standard for proof)