Christians : Who mocks Jesus & Mary ?

Discussion in 'Muslim <---> Christian Dialogue' started by muslimhanif, May 11, 2014.

  1. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Peace be upon those who follow true guidance,

    The Judaists spit on Christians in Israel, call the virgin Mary a whore and say Jesus is boiling in excrement in hell in their Talmud (See “Talmud Unmasked” by Rev. Pranthis, “Jewish history, Jewish religion” by Israel Shahak, “Judaism’s Strange Gods”, by Michael Hoffman). Wake up people!

    Last edited: May 11, 2014
  2. Um Ibrahim
    Thinking
    Offline

    Um Ibrahim Alhamdulilah :)

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2009
    Messages:
    651
    Likes Received:
    72
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Somewhere in the U.S...:)
    Home page:
    Ratings Received:
    +214 / 4
    Laa hawla walaa quwata ilaa bilah! Subhanalaah! That was filth...Please don't even post shows like that even to prove a point.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. zaman-gm
    Inspired
    Offline

    zaman-gm Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2013
    Messages:
    532
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +252 / 4
    Pleas delete this video. We do not need this experience of information.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. queenislam
    Fine
    Offline

    queenislam ★★★I LOVE ALLAH★★★

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Messages:
    31,719
    Likes Received:
    341
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Educator.
    Location:
    Will do for now~Alhamdulillah!
    Ratings Received:
    +794 / 12
    Assalamu'alaikum!The reason one SHOULD NOT call upon the Prophet Isa Alaihisalam and his mother Maryam binti Imran as Jesus and Mary as one will confused WHEN others was actually referring to the Christian's and Catholic's god which was actually and TOTALLY different people!!!

    In the holy qur'an Allah swt NEVER once call Nabi Isa alaihisalam as Jesus and Maryam binti Imran as Mary ...some people got confuse when many translation they read say so and they hold on to those names eventually avoiding using all the beautiful prophets name written in the holy qur'an but memorising them similar to the bible...so sad.

    for example in the tahiyat Akhir
    ...‘ala saidina Ibrahiim wa ‘ala aalihi saidina Ibrahiim,
    will the say Ibrahim as Abrahem???
    so why still adopt those foreign names???

    MAJOR MISTAKE

    Muslim/s too SHOULD NOT mention/refer Allah swt as 'HE '
    Get to the FACT that Allah swt is not a HE nor She
    even though this is a grammar thing BUT this can be confusing to the new and young muslim/s.Please, we doesn't want this to happen.Don't be unfair.

    I really hope that many will realise and amend their mistake!!!

    ~May Allah swt help,protect and guide all muslims~Amin!

    ~Wassalam :)
    Last edited: May 11, 2014
  5. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    I pointed out that the video may hurt your sensibility, but this is the reality and the world needs to know, especially since the majority of people in the West ignores these realities primarily because of media disinformation and of the treason of the intellectuals, such as Edward Said said . For anyone who wants to delve into this topic I recommend you to read Israel Shahak.
  6. sister herb
    Sweettooth
    Offline

    sister herb Official TTI Chef

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2006
    Messages:
    7,225
    Likes Received:
    625
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +1,353 / 30
    So there was part where Israelis in TV show mocked basic believes of Christianity. Maybe in somewhere it is reality to make rude jokes about holy things of others (I wonder could they also show similar about Jewish believes). That tells just only lack of respect of others way to believe. The so-called west makes same many times and they call it as humor or "freedom of speech".

    Anyways I agree that kind of video might not send here at all. It may be reality but we don´t need to share it. As well it is reality that in somewhere it is ok (and fun for somebodies) to spread images of prophet Muhammad but we don´t need to spread them as warning label: "this is reality".

    If someones are so unciviliazed that they want to insult everything and speciality the religion matters, tell them that Allah knows their acts - don´t spread their filth.
    • Agree Agree x 3
  7. zaman-gm
    Inspired
    Offline

    zaman-gm Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2013
    Messages:
    532
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +252 / 4
    Salam
    May Allah Guide all of us.
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Dear zaman-gm,
    Thanks for your brotherly advice, and āmīn to your invocation.
    Pornography does not aim to inform such as a documentary about the war or about the situation of prisoners in America and Israel does. I'm not saying that the end justifies the means, on the contrary, I mean to say that it is essential to ensure a correct information about what actually happens, and at the same time it is essential to reject evil by the heart, hand and tongue, according to the person's ability, and not suffer it passively. One who watch a pornographic video is because he is satisfied with it, if he is not forced. While who watches a documentary is because he wants to inform himself on a particular issue, and this does not imply satisfaction. A well-known Islamic base states that satisfaction with disbelief is disbelief. Now let me ask you, if someone watches a Islamophobic video (such a video of the Coptic priest Zakaria Botros) with the intent to refute it, where's the satisfaction? Where is the sin in his action? And Allāh knows best. Unfortunately, people in the West are accustomed to regard violence as the norm, and to think about the cruelty with indifference, especially because they are constantly bombarded with images of violence in news reports, television shows, movies, and other media. So I think sometimes you need to convey a strong message to reawaken people's sleeping minds. For example, if you recommended people to read a book which is not a best seller you can be sure that very few of them will read it. And as said the Western thinker George Orwell, "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed: everything else is public relations." May Allah strengthen all of us to spread the Truth and guide us to His obedience.
    Last edited: May 11, 2014
  9. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    I removed the video of Israeli Zionist TV.
    Sorry for having offended your sensibilities.
    Do not forget us in your good invocation.
    Last edited: May 11, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  10. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Wa `Alaykum us-salām,

    Āmīn to your invocation!

    According to your reasoning, even the Names of Allāh should not be translated because they are not mentioned in the Qur’ān. But when a person is addressed to non-Arabs sometimes used to refer to Allāh the Almighty by saying ‘God’ in order to make people understand that Allāh is not a god other than the God of the Revealed Scriptures. The example you mentioned is referred to an act of worship, of course the Qur’ān should be read in Arabic during prayer, but this does not prevent you to translate it in English or in other languages in order to spread Islām to non-Arabic speakers. Translations in these cases are not distortions or alterations, because no one here wants to replace or modify the original text; the purpose is only to provide a key to encrypt the meanings of the original text. In any case, 'translating' always means 'betray' the original meaning of a text, because this is not a unity, but a multiplicity of connections and meanings. As Edward Said said, "A word has a strict meaning understood as an imperative, and with that meaning there also goes a strictly ordained series of resemblances (correspondences) to other words and meanings, which, strictly speaking, play around the first word. This figurative language, otherwise elusive and at the mercy of the virtuosic interpreter, is part of the actual structure of language and part therefore of the collectivity of language users." (Edward Said, The Word, the Text and the Critic, Cambridge, Mass, Harvard University Press, 1983, p.38)

    And Allāh knows best!
    Last edited: May 11, 2014
  11. zaman-gm
    Inspired
    Offline

    zaman-gm Junior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2013
    Messages:
    532
    Likes Received:
    64
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +252 / 4
    'Oh' Brother forgive me. That may not modest that i done by that example. I think u may not take it easily. Sorry for that and pleas keep me in your Dua. Actually i have done a lot's of mistake/sin (Astagfirullah) but when i see a messy thing go about our great Man And Woman of Muslims some time i become little bit emotional. I just try to say that we should not publish something which we don't like that become an publicity of that particular things. In Sha Allah we will reply in good of there mock or Scheme.
    Salam.
  12. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Salām `Alaykum,

    It's really hard not to get carried away by emotion when it comes to our religion, but it is also true that the best action is to love for the sake of Allāh and to hate for the sake of Allāh. The other day I saw a video showing Shiites insulting the Mother of the Believers ʿĀʾiša (may Allāh be pleased with her), and in that moment I just desired to break their necks. Muslims are weak today, they could not defend themselves, how can you think to attack others? In this time of weakness, the only compulsory Jihād is the one with the tongue and pen, and the first people who deserve to be [verbally] fought are certainly the apostates, those who seek to change our religion and those who mock our religion. Obviously we do not have the authority to apply the death penalty for apostasy, but how can we doubt about the disbelief of those who insult Allāh and his Prophet (blessings and peace of Allāh be upon him), or about the disbelief of those who fight Islām and Muslims day and night with their words and actions? While Allāh said (interpretation of the meaning), “Say [O Muḥammad], Is it Allāh and His verses and His Messenger that you were mocking?". Make no excuse; you have disbelieved after your belief.” Allāh has not admitted any excuse for them, and none of the scholars has admitted any excuse for those who commit one of the Nullifiers of Islām except for the one who commits them due to being coerced, while his heart is firm on belief. We seek refuge with Allāh from all these Nullifiers, and we ask Allāh to preserve us from the things that cause His Anger and Punishment.
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Cariad
    Brooding
    Offline

    Cariad Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2013
    Messages:
    632
    Likes Received:
    66
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +190 / 23
    As usual Sister herb you speak sense.

    As a Christian such videos and points of view do not impact on my person any. I believe People are free to speak their minds. That they wish to make public their derision, disrespect and hatred says more about them than the people who are the object of their ire. I can choose not to listen to them. As I have chosen not to watch any such You tube link. Including Mr Deedat, who made it his life's mission to insult the faith of others. They will be judged for their actions by YHWH, if I were to allow myself to feel anger then I also would be judged.. In the same way that people spreading such unpleasantness will also be judged.

    Nothing is hidden from YHWH.. From the deepest reaches of your heart and soul YHWH knows us better than we know ourselves.

    Peace
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Deedat was too lax towards Jews and Christians, but apparently he knew their Bible better than the majority of them. Many Christians are disbelievers in accordance with their distorted Bible, because if someone insults their parents or their loved ones they do not remain indifferents and do not say that this does not concern them, but of course they feel anger and make complaints for defamation, but if someone insults their religion then there is freedom of expression! This shows that many of those who profess themselves to be Christians are actually Atheists. Of course, this is also true for some of those who claim to be Muslims, although they are a small minority. The root of love and hate is in the heart, and when a person expressly declares not feel any disdain towards those who insult Allāh or one of His Prophets so tells us very plainly that has destroyed this root. Their faith is absent and their deeds will be as dust dispersed. They do not worship nothing but their lowly desires, even if they claim to worship one God, because their words contradict their actions and their false claim.

    Šayḫ Aḥmad Šākir – may Allāh have mercy on him – said, “As for those now ascribed to the Christians and the Jews in Europe, America, and other [countries], then we affirm that they are not the People of the Book, because they disbelieved in their religions, and some of them surely only fake their outward formalities. Most of them are Atheists who do not believe in Allāh, nor in the prophets, and their books and the information in front of us. They have rebelled against every religion and professed in anarchism and dissolution with respect to morals and honours. Thus, marrying their women is not permissible. They have truly lost the description “the People of the Book” in reality." [‘Umdat al-Tafsīr, 1/636]
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
  15. Cariad
    Brooding
    Offline

    Cariad Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2013
    Messages:
    632
    Likes Received:
    66
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +190 / 23
    Mr Deedat, knew nothing of what it means to be a Christian. His refutes were usually based on misinterpretation of the Bible, that and ignoring the rule of context.

    A Christian follows the teachings of the Christ, who taught us that YHWH wished that we love and forgive our enemies. We can do this with a glad heart because Yeshua also taught that YHWH is just, and YHWH will right any wrongs and judge accordingly. Nothing good can be born from anger, anger leads to hatred and indeed often goes hand in hand, both are the preserve of Satan. Opening your mind to Satan puts you in a dangerous place. .. Yeshua also taught that the lot of His followers would be persecution at the hands of those who deny Him. We can easily bear that.. It is a small thing when faced with all eternity after death takes us.

    We are not indifferent to the insults.. We just forgive those who commit insult against us. Because Yeshua also taught that is according to YHWH's will.

    Besides An eye for an eye just makes the whole world blind..

    Peace and blessings to you.
  16. sister herb
    Sweettooth
    Offline

    sister herb Official TTI Chef

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2006
    Messages:
    7,225
    Likes Received:
    625
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +1,353 / 30
    Mr Deedat may know the Bible and its teachings better than majority of the Christians but religion is a lot of more than only that. I believe that many Christians feel deep faith in their hearts (as well muslims and any others too). As we share the same world, one of the most important matters should learn to understand others way to believe as well as respect it.
  17. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    One can forgive only on condition that there is a clear repentance, be indulgent does not mean being stupid or masochist. Hate is the opposite of love, as faith is the opposite of unbelief, and monotheism is the opposite of associationism. So a person can be either monotheist (worshiper of only one God) or associationist (worshiper of something other than the only one God), tertium non datur! And this also according to the logic of your Church Fathers, such as Paul of Tarsus, Augustine of Hippo, Thomas Aquinas, and so on. Ibn Taymiyyah says, “And so anyone who does not worship Allāh, must undoubtedly be worshipping something other than Him: he worships someone other than Him and is therefore an associationist. Among the sons of Ādam there is no third type. There is only monotheist and associationist or those who mix both parts like the distorters of the followers of different religions and the Christians and those who have gone astray who consider themselves to be in Islām.” (Majmū‘ ul-Fatāwā, 14/282, 284) If a person loves the monotheism, then he hates his opposite (i.e. the associationism) and vice versa. Sufyān al-Thawrī said, “If you loved a man for the sake of Allāh and then he innovated an [heretical] innovation in Islām and you did not hate him for it, then you didn’t (really) love him for the sake of Allāh.” (Ḥilyiat ul-Awliyā’, 7/34, by Abū Nu’aym al-Aṣbahānī). May Allāh guide you to the only true religion, away from the contradictions of secularism and modern cultural relativism!
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
  18. Cariad
    Brooding
    Offline

    Cariad Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2013
    Messages:
    632
    Likes Received:
    66
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +190 / 23
    I would respectfully disagree that he understood the Bible teachings better than the majority of Christians.. For sure maybe some. :) as in all religions there are to be found those who proclaim to be pious followers yet are far the opposite. He made many errors.

    I agree 100% that religion is far more than any book.. To say YHWH/ALLAH could be found within the pages of a Book seems a bad idea. Ones faith has to come from the heart, it's love of YHWH that ignites my faith and my longing to serve Him keeps it burning. I think I see this same love in muslims, we may view YHWH differently but He created us all and placed us where we are to be on this earth for this lifetime. We are brothers and sisters in humanity and our goals are not that different.

    Sister Herb, I truly see you as a Muslim in the true sense of the word... I get that from your posts, which are always positive and a joy to read. I thank you for that. :) I also like that you know food... :D

    God Bless and keep you. :)
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  19. muslimhanif
    Offline

    muslimhanif Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2014
    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Ratings Received:
    +16 / 0
    Conjectures and inferences can do nothing against the truth. Mr. Deedat has proven to know your Bible better than you; you didn't bring any evidence to prove the contrary. Humans are superior to animals thanks to the use of reason and speech. Religion is a serious matter, not a sport or a pastime.
    Last edited: May 13, 2014
  20. sister herb
    Sweettooth
    Offline

    sister herb Official TTI Chef

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2006
    Messages:
    7,225
    Likes Received:
    625
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +1,353 / 30
    ^^ I think nobody here hasn´t talk about religion as a fun...

    I remember one lecture I was listening years ago, there speaker was a Finnish historian of comparative religion. He was a Christian but claimed he knew everything about islam and understood it 100 %. I then asked him: "If you really understand it so well, why you are not a muslim?". He might understood islam from the books very well but not deep in his heart.
    • Agree Agree x 2

Share This Page