Conversion/Parental blessing

converttobe

New Member
Hi everyone,

I've just joined as a new member -- because I desperately need help.

I have been dating a Muslim girl for 8 months now. She recently told her Father (a university professor) and he has told her that he forbids it.

He has never met me and knows virtually nothing about me (apart from the fact that I am white and I work in publishing company). He refuses to meet me, has put his daughter under virtual house arrest, told her to quit her job and break up with me, called her terrible things, claimed she has shamed the family and Islam, etc.

The great hipocrisy is that he has a son who is married to a white Australian woman (after conversion); they have 2 children.

The knowledge I desperately seek is this: if I am willing to sincerely convert to Islam, is there anything in the Quran that allows my girlfriend's Father to forbid it? Doesn't she have rights to choose who she marries (provided he is Muslim and of good character)?

I feel I need to prove to him that Quranic scripture does not allow his behaviour. And any other suggestions would be welcome.

By the way, they have lived in Singapore for 20 years and come originally from Sri Lanka. My girlfriend is a graphic designer, educated in Australia.

Somebody, please help.

Thank you.
 

Mabsoot

Amir
Staff member
:bismillah:
In the name of Allah most beneficent Most merciful.

Welcome to the website.

I hope you are doing good. It is a good thing that you are sincere in becoming Muslim, to believe in Allah and the Prophet Muhammad as the last and final messenger is the most important and blessed thing that could ever happen to any of us.

Secondly, being white, black or any other race does not make any difference at all. Someone should not object if the person is of good character and a Muslim. This is clearly shown in the Islamic texts.

However, keeping any sort of relationship before marriage, even if it is non-sexual is forbidden in Islam. This is for both Muslim men and women.

So in terms of having a girlfriend/boyfriend it is a sin upon the Muslim. The only way they can meet is if the girl is with her mahram, or male guardian, such as her father or brother. You can meet her as many times as you want under these conditions to get to know her.

If the girls brother dated girls etc he was Islamically wrong. His father also was wrong for allowing it. There is no excuse for allowing sons to do haram (forbidden actions) and keeping girls from doing it. They both should be treated equally by making sure they stick to Islamic guidelines.

The Father is however right to stop his daughter from seeing you. Thats because he is stopping her from doing a sinful action.

But, dont fret!

I think the first step you must take, is to sincerely think about Islam. Dont just become Muslim because of marriage. Make sure that you truly believe that there is one God, Allah who has no partners whatsoever... and that Muhammad:saw: was his slave and final Messenger. Muslims also believe in the other Prophets that are found in the bible such as Jesus and Abraham. For they too had same beliefs as us which was Islam. They were Muslims who believed in Allah without associating any partners to him.

Here are some helpful articles that are really good and which you should read. InshaAllah.

Introductory Articles About Islam

Fundamental Beliefs in Islam Tawheed and Aqeedah

You can find more articles here:
Islamic Articles Library

Some videos:

Learn About Islam Full Video Covering Many Topics

Feature Length film on True Islam

The Mosque - Full Muslim Sermon and Prayers TRANSLATED Also Eid Celebrations


As for the girl's father and his stance against you. If you were a good Muslim and you are of sound character, there is no Islamic reason for him to object to your marriage to his daughter, if she is willing.

Allah says in the Quran:

Do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree between themselves in a lawful manner. (2: 232)

In an Authentic and well known Hadith which can be found in Sahih Muslim:

Abu Huraira (Allah be pleased with him) reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: A woman may be married for four reasons: for her property, her status. her beauty and her religion, so try to get one who is religious, may your hand be besmeared with dust.

Also the Prophet :saw: said:

Idhaa ataakum man tardhauna deenahu wa khuluqahu fa zawwijoohu. Illaa taf'aloo takun fitnatun fiy al-ardhi wa fasaadun kabeerun."
"If someone with whose piety and character you are satisfied with comes to you, marry to him. If you do not do so, there will be trials in the earth and a great deal of evil." At-Tirmidhi and others and it is hassan.

However, like many families in the world, people have their own opinions, prejudices based on their own thinking.. So, in the end perhaps what is needed is for the girl to talk to her parents in a kind way, perhaps the mother is more reasonable .. And for you to show that you are a good, kind and sincere Muslim who loves Islam.

So, perhaps one of the first things to do after becoming Muslim is to talk to the girl's father. What both you and the girl did was Islamically wrong. So you should apologise to the parents of the girl.

You must tell him that you are not going to see his daughter without his knowledge, not see her without a wali (guardian father, or her brothers etc) being present. That you became Muslim for Allah alone and not for anything else.. and that you wish to marry his daughter.

It will be difficult, but you have to have patience and inshaAllah things will work out good. If not, then there are reasons for this and you must move on.

If the man is of financially stable, of good character, is a good Muslim the Wali can not object. The most important thing is Islam. You can however, bypass her father by having another Wali. However, it is highly recommended not to do this as it can give you more problems.

Whether or not you can marry her without her fathers consent is not for me to say. The Prophet :saw: said, that there is no marriage without a Wali. The worst possible thing you could do is to marry her without her parents blessings. It will complicate things and make matters a lot worse for you both. You must also think about the girl's feelings and the pressure and hurt that would be caused to her by seeing her own parents unhappy with these decisions. It will divide her family and may even lead her to be alienated from them.

Last of all, my advice is that you do things according to a correct and sincere intention. After you become Muslim, do the istikhara prayer. Which is a prayer that will help you make the right decisions.

The Prophet :saw: said:

"Actions are (judged) by motives (niyyah), so each man will have what he intended. Thus, he whose migration (hijrah) was to Allah and His Messenger, his migration is to Allah and His Messenger; but he whose migration was for some worldly thing he might gain, or for a wife he might marry, his migration is to that for which he migrated." [Bukhari & Muslim]

So inshaAllah, things will get better for you, as long as you take the necessary steps towards Islam and Allah's love and mercy. Also, the girl too should make great effort in striving for Islam, and ask Allah for forgiveness, because having a boyfriend was haram. What has been done is done, and Allah forgives those who are sincere in asking for forgiveness. You now have to follow the correct avenues according to Islam and Allah will help you both InshaAllah. Also, you got to realise the parents position in this and they are the ones who spent much time and love bringing the girl up. They just want best for her and to protect her. So be wise and careful and think things through from much wider perspective before taking any actions.
 

anna

Junior Member
assalam u alaikum
i just wanted to point out that its allowed for a muslim male to marry a girl from ppl of the book (christians , jews) but i think its not so for a muslim girl isnt it so?
salam.
 

Abul Harith

Active Member
Staff member
alaikom salam Anna,

Yes, you are correct. Allah says in the Quran:

Made lawful to you this day are the good foods. The food of the People of the Scripture is lawful to you and yours is lawful to them. (Lawful to you in marriage) are chaste women from the believers and chaste women from those who were given the Scripture before your time, when you have given their due bridal money, desiring chastity, not committing illegal sexual intercourse, nor taking them as girl-friends. And whosoever denies faith, then fruitless is his work, and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers.
(Al-Ma’idah 5: 5)

Allah also mentions that -

And do not marry the idolatresses till they believe (worship Allah Alone). And indeed a slave woman who believes is better than a (free) idolatress, even though she pleases you. And give not (your daughters) in marriage to the polytheists till they believe (in Allah Alone) and verily, a believing slave is better than a (free) idolater, even though he pleases you. Those (polytheists) invite you to the Fire, but Allah invites (you) to Paradise and Forgiveness by His Leave, and makes His Signs clear to humankind that they may remember. (Al-Baqarah 2: 221).

:wasalam:

Mu2min
 

converttobe

New Member
It seems your point is very crucial. Can you please clarify it since Mabsoot did not mention this in his lengthy (thank you) response?

Are you saying that the Quran forbid converts to marry muslim women? But muslim men are allowed to marry non-muslims?

In other words, Islam does not allow us to marry?

Thank you.
 

anna

Junior Member
hi,
well, i thnk u got me wrong. but i never mentioned nor implied that a muslim girl cant marry a convert(as long as he really is a mulim). the verse clearly says ,
"And give not (your daughters) in marriage to the polytheists till they believe (in Allah Alone) "
u can for sure marry her provided ur a muslim(convert or otherwise)
 

Mabsoot

Amir
Staff member
Muslim Men are allowed to marry from the people of the book, i.e. Christian or Jewish women.

However, this is not something that is encouraged, especially when there are single Muslim women. - We should marry righteous and good Muslim women.

Muslim women are not allowed to marry Christian / Jewish men. Firstly, this is because this is what God has commanded. So the entire wisdom behind such things can not even be grasped by man.

However, we can see that there could be problems such as the man who is the head of the household, having a lot more influence in the family. The children normally would follow the father's religion, and he had a say in their beliefs. etc. If the Muslim woman tries to teach her kids about Islam, he might object to the fact that she teaches them about the Prophet Muhammad, as he does not believe in him.

The Muslim man has a lot of obligations in Islam towards his family which the woman does not have the same level of responsibility for. Of course, both husband and wife share responsibilities and care for their families, however the Muslim husband has to do his best to follow what the Quran and Hadith say.

Islam is a complete way of life. It gives us understanding and particular teaching for the way family life should be run. It gives order and most importantly it gives every member of the family Rights. From the Parents, to the husband and Wife all the way to the Children and even grandchildren etc.

If the man is not a Muslim, he will not be believing in the Quran and Sunnah.... so he will not be implementing the best way of living in the family and encorporating the best character... which is only done by emulating the Prophet Muhammad :saw: as best as possible. For he was the kindest, most generous, loving and understanding man ever. He :saw: never hit or was ever abusive to his family.

This is the example, which is obligatory for all Muslim men to follow.

There are other obligations too, which are for him to provide for the family, to make sure his family is happy, to implement the Islamic teachings in the household, such as ensuring his children are good Muslims.

-- If these obligations from husband to wife are not met, i.e. the husband doesnt care about Islam, he does not bother to go and get money for the family....he doesnt care for his children or his wife's needs....... the wife has grounds for divorce.

So, we move onto the rights that Islam gives the woman, which includes divorce. Infact, unlike other beliefs, Islam does not consider it a sin for there to be a divorce. Of course it is not something which is taken lightly, and reconciliation is the best avenue, however, in some situations it is the best thing to do.

-- So i hope you understand now the perfect system that Islam gives to people. Its upto the people to implement it, and in all cases people make mistakes and not every Muslim takes Islam as seriously as they should be doing. Nevertheless, this is the main reason that marrying non-Muslim for the Muslim woman is not allowed.... and why the Prophet :saw: said

Abu Huraira (Allah be pleased with him) reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: A woman may be married for four reasons: for her property, her status. her beauty and her religion, so try to get one who is religious, may your hand be besmeared with dust.

Although, if you are a Muslim, converttobe, then you have nothing to worry about.. Just, i hope that you take your time and become Muslim for Allah.​
 

AishaR

Junior Member
:salam2:

Another thing you MUST remember is the you are reverting for yourself & no one else. You cant just say you revert to be closer to this girl..... It has to be in your heart & what you believe yourself. Has Mabsoot has said there is alot of useful infomation on here for you to read & watch. Please brother take the time to find out about Islam as it can change your life for the better as I found out for myself when I reverted.
Dont get me wrong, it hasnt been hard for me to make some of the changes but the benefits outway the struggle.
Inshallah, you will make the right choice for the right reasons

:wasalam:
 

converttobe

New Member
Thank you everyone for your responses.

My main point was simply to establish whether a Muslim father would object to his daughter marrying a Muslim man of good character (whether convert or born-Muslim) -- based upon Quranic teaching. Now I understand that the Quran sanctions marriage between sincere believers in Allah -- whether the man or the woman is a convert (or revert).

I understand everyone's emphasis on conversion (or reversion) to Islam for the right reasons, i.e. not for marriage, but for the sincere belief in Allah. I understand this and take this very seriously. I do not believe it is right to convert for the sake of marriage, and I do not intend to do so.

I am sure the information on this website will contribute to my understanding and allow me to travel further down that path to Islam.
 

samiha

---------
Staff member
:salam2:
It's a good thing that you take reverting seriously and I hope that Allah guides you to the truth.
:wasalam:
 

Mabsoot

Amir
Staff member
converttobe said:
Thank you everyone for your responses.

My main point was simply to establish whether a Muslim father would object to his daughter marrying a Muslim man of good character (whether convert or born-Muslim) -- based upon Quranic teaching. Now I understand that the Quran sanctions marriage between sincere believers in Allah -- whether the man or the woman is a convert (or revert).

I understand everyone's emphasis on conversion (or reversion) to Islam for the right reasons, i.e. not for marriage, but for the sincere belief in Allah. I understand this and take this very seriously. I do not believe it is right to convert for the sake of marriage, and I do not intend to do so.

I am sure the information on this website will contribute to my understanding and allow me to travel further down that path to Islam.

Thats great converttobe, i ask Allah to help you on your way and make your life in this world easy and remove all your worries and hardships and to give you the greatest gift of all, which is to know your sense of being, your purpose and to have feeling of contentment and satisfaction in paradise by knowing 100% what life was about and ultimately the biggest reward that a Muslim will get in paradise, is to be before God and to see him.

If you have any other questions feel free to make them.

Bye, maybe we will call you Tobey.. lol cuz of your nicname.
 

converttobe

New Member
Quran 2: 232

I was interested in knowing more about 2: 232 since Mabsoot quoted the following in response to my question:

Do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree between themselves in a lawful manner. (2: 232)

In the University of S. California's online translation http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/002.qmt.html#002.232 the quote comes from guidance specifically concerning divorce:

And when you have divorced women and they have ended their term (of waiting), then do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree among themselves in a lawful manner.

Is it okay to generalise the above by admitting the implication that ALL women should not be prevented from marrying "when they agree among themselves in a lawful manner"?

Are there other verses which refer to this issue?

Sorry to be persistent - but I am still trying to establish whether the father's objections to me are based on his idea that his 30-year-old daughter must do as he says -- when he has NO good reason to object to a man who is turning to Islam and has a good character.

My question boils down to this: are these "Asian family values" or "Islamic values" he is using against me?

Thank you
 

converttobe

New Member
I was interested in knowing more about 2: 232 since Mabsoot quoted the following in response to my question:

Do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree between themselves in a lawful manner. (2: 232)

In the University of S. California's online translation http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/002.qmt.html#002.232 the quote comes from guidance specifically concerning divorce:

And when you have divorced women and they have ended their term (of waiting), then do not prevent them from marrying their husbands when they agree among themselves in a lawful manner.

Is it okay to generalise the above by admitting the implication that ALL women should not be prevented from marrying "when they agree among themselves in a lawful manner"?

Are there other verses which refer to this issue?

Sorry to be persistent - but I am still trying to establish whether the father's objections to me are based on his idea that his 30-year-old daughter must do as he says -- when he has NO good reason to object to a man who is turning to Islam and has a good character.

My question boils down to this: are these "Asian family values" or "Islamic values" he is using against me?

Thank you
 

Somair

New Member
As salaam alaikum,

I hear you, you've got a tough road ahead in regards to her parents but Insha'Allah things will work out great! Obviously the girl has to marry a Muslim guy, but I think above that the girl also needs a mahram's approval (father, or guardian figure) so I guess she would need her father's approval for her to marry you.

I think the whole thing about people objecting about their children marrying Muslims from different backgrounds is a problem. It should never matter whether who we marry is white, black, arab, asian, hispanic, or whatever. But unfortunately we are too tied down to culturalism, nationalism, and regionalism.

I personally think all Muslims should intermarry people from all backgrounds so we can slowly take down the 'us and them' attitude.

This is not to say that her father is necessarily objecting against you because you are white only, it's probably also because they don't see you suitable because of the pre-marital boyfriend/girlfriend relationship. As far as on your side I understand that you didn't know about Islam and so you wouldn't have known that pre-marital communication between the opposite sex and prospective spouses is tightly regulated. Anyways I hope for the best for you, I have a feeling you'll be fine!

walaikum as salaam
 

Nightwind

New Member
a thought to remeber

Converttobe, one thing that you must always remember. Muslims, like anyone else, are still humans subject to our cultural upbrings, beliefs, prejudices. When I came to Islam, Alhamdulillah that I found Islam before I met other Muslims. I made the mistake of innocense though of expecting to find that Muslims would all be better behaved and above the normal troubles I found as a Christian. I was often let down when I found people with the same bad behaviors that I had seen all my life.

Whether the girls father will ever accept you or not is totally upon how clearly and truly he follows the words that Allah and the prophet has bestowed upon us. A good Muslim in a perfect world would accept you if you are sincere and of good character. But this world is not perfect and no Muslim is perfect. Many many Muslims choose to follow their cultures rather than what Allah has ordained for us.

My advice, prepare your own heart first and see Allah through your own eyes. If you are coming to Islam come with a clear vision and heart pure. Then, talk to the girls father. It will not be easy. He already sees you as someone that has led his daughter away from Allah by having a sinful relationship and he is justified in that his daughter, a Muslim, did not tell you that such a relationship is forbidden.Tell him that you did not understand that you were doing wrong and ask him to help you learn how to be the best Muslim that you can be so that you would honor him and serve Allah better. Unless his heart is dead set against you and he has already decided a different direction for his daughter's future, he will have to look at you with different eyes to see who you are and what his daughter has seen in you.

Most of all, pray to Allah that he guide you to the right choice. Istikarah is always a true guide if you have sincerely opened your heart to Allah.
 
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