I'lm-e-ghayb and our prophet pbuh

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Salam brothers and sisters,

From what I have been reading, i learned that our prophet was given the keys. The secrets of the past, present and future was given to him. Allah has given him unseen knowledge. He was seen heaven and hell and Allah himself. He was informed about all events. He also had the key to the treasures of the quran.

So is the information i learned correct. The site: *Link removed*

P.S. Does this mean (assuming its correct) that our prophet had the keys of the ghayb and what i have been foolishly muking around with was not actually the unknown or ability or power or whatever i said and that i was being foolish. Also does this mean our prophet knew what Alif Laam Meem meant?
 

thariq2005

Praise be to Allah!
Wa `alaykum salaam wa rahmatullaah

I have edited your post for now... Inshaa'Allaah will address the issue soon or another mod will do so inshaa'Allaah
 

Abu Talib

Feeling low
Wa`alaykumassalam Warahmatullahi Wabarakatu

Allah commanded His Prophet to entrust all matters to Him and to inform, about himself, that he does not know the unseen future, but he knows of it only what Allah informs him. Allah said in another Ayah,

((He Alone is) the All-Knower of the Ghayb (Unseen), and He reveals to none His Ghayb.) ﴿72:26﴾ Ad-Dahhak reported that Ibn `Abbas said that,

(If I had the knowledge of the Ghayb (Unseen), I should have secured for myself an abundance of wealth.) refers to money. In another narration, Ibn `Abbas commented, "I would have knowledge of how much profit I would make with what I buy, and I would always sell what I would make profit from,

("and no evil should have touched me.'') and poverty would never touch me.'' Ibn Jarir said, "And others said, `This means that if I know the Unseen then I would prepare for the years of famine during the prosperous years, and in the time of high cost, I would have prepared for it.''' `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam also commented on this Ayah;

("and no evil should have touched me. ''), "I would have avoided and saved myself from any type of harm before it comes.'' Allah then stated that the Prophet is a warner and bearer of good news. He warns against the torment and brings good news of Paradise for the believers,

(So We have made this (the Qur'an) easy on your tongue, only that you may give glad tidings to the pious, and warn with it the most quarrelsome of people.) ﴿19:97﴾

(189. It is He Who has created you from a single person, and (then) He has created from him his wife, in order that he might enjoy the pleasure of living with her. When he covered ﴿had sexual relation with﴾ her, she became pregnant and she carried it about (lightly). Then when it became heavy, they both invoked Allah, their Lord (saying): "If You give us a Salih (good in every aspect) child, we shall indeed be among the grateful.'') (190. But when He gave them a Salih child, they ascribed partners to Him (Allah) in that which He has given to them. High be Allah, Exalted above all that they ascribe as partners to Him.)
Tafseer Ibn Katheer

{Say: "None in the heavens and the earth knows the Ghaib (Unseen) except Allah, …} [27:65].

“Say (O Muhammad): I do not say to you that I possess Allah’s treasures, nor that I have knowledge of the Unseen. I do not say to you that I am an angel. I follow only that which has been revealed to me.” [Sûrah al-An`âm: 50]
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Wa `alaykum salaam wa rahmatullaah

I have edited your post for now... Inshaa'Allaah will address the issue soon or another mod will do so inshaa'Allaah

Wa`alaykumassalam Warahmatullahi Wabarakatu


I assume the site i was reading off of was wrong, or was my understanding wrong? I mean our prophet PBUH did say that his followers can ask him any question and he will answer. So I know that our prophet did know about the unseen and the message of the quran. He knew what God had allowed him to know about the past, present and future =)

correct?

So the ghayb (unforseen) is indeed Allah's to know and it has nothing to do with the unknown/enigma/power or what ever i was blabbing about. Everything is from Allah. And I appologise for my misconception on the working definition of the ghayb.
 

Abu Talib

Feeling low
I assume the site i was reading off of was wrong, or was my understanding wrong? I mean our prophet PBUH did say that his followers can ask him any question and he will answer. So I know that our prophet did know about the unseen and the message of the quran. He knew what God had allowed him to know about the past, present and future =)

correct?

So the ghayb (unforseen) is indeed Allah's to know and it has nothing to do with the unknown/enigma/power or what ever i was blabbing about. Everything is from Allah. And I appologise for my misconception on the working definition of the ghayb.

Assalamu`alaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatu

Yes, it was only which Allah had revealed to the Prophets (Peace Be Upon Them All) they knew of future.

If the Prophet (Peace and Blessings of Allah Be Upon Him) had really the power of unseen he would have won all battles or even told who will die during the battle or which will be won or lost common sense! Its was only Allah who revealed him which ever he spoke about and nothing else.
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Assalamu`alaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatu

Yes, it was only which Allah had revealed to the Prophets (Peace Be Upon Them All) they knew of future.

If the Prophet (Peace and Blessings of Allah Be Upon Him) had really the power of unseen he would have won all battles or even told who will die during the battle or which will be won or lost common sense! Its was only Allah who revealed him which ever he spoke about and nothing else.

Ahh, so the power of the unseen was to know of the forseen, like the future, who dies, who wins and such. That makes sense brother, and that is why the link was bad, because in the link, there was a part where they said that (it was from a hadeeth) that the prophet showed his followers the position and the names of the enemies that died in the battle of badr (jihad)
 

Abu Talib

Feeling low
Ahh, so the power of the unseen was to know of the forseen, like the future, who dies, who wins and such. That makes sense brother, and that is why the link was bad, because in the link, there was a part where they said that (it was from a hadeeth) that the prophet showed his followers the position and the names of the enemies that died in the battle of badr (jihad)

Trust me these sites can put up anything to prove their claim.
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Trust me these sites can put up anything to prove their claim.

Dang why so? Also so what i have come to understand about the prophet is right? And that i had a misunderstanding about the working definition of the ghayb as the ghayb means the unforseen, past, future, death, life, day of judgement, heaven and hell location. And it was nothing of what i thought it to be. I know everything is from Allah. So then the unknown things like jinns, the unknown secrets, power, abilitiy, capacity, the secret of the universe is nothing close to the ghayb (unforseen)? Also forgive me in my err, i know that jinns true form is also unseen to us..Anyway forgive me for my foolishness. I pray that God will too =)
 

Abu Talib

Feeling low
The Meaning of Al-Ghayb

As for the meaning of Ghayb here, the Salaf have different explanations of it, all of which are correct, indicating the same general meaning. For instance, Abu Ja`far Ar-Razi quoted Ar-Rabi` bin Anas, reporting from Abu Al-`Aliyah about Allah's statement, i

((Those who) have faith in the Ghayb), "They believe in Allah, His angels, Books, Messengers, the Last Day, His Paradise, Fire and in the meeting with Him. They also believe in life after death and in Resurrection. All of this is the Ghayb.'' Qatadah bin Di`amah said similarly.

Sa`id bin Mansur reported from `Abdur-Rahman bin Yazid who said, "We were sitting with `Abdullah bin Mas`ud when we mentioned the Companions of the Prophet and their deeds being superior to our deeds. `Abdullah said, `The matter of Muhammad was clear for those who saw him. By He other than Whom there is no God, no person will ever acquire a better type of faith than believing in Al-Ghayb.' He then recited,

(Alif Lam Mim. This is the Book, wherein there is no doubt, a guidance for the Muttaqin. Those who believe in the Ghayb), until,

(the successful). '' Ibn Abi Hatim, Ibn Marduwyah and Al-Hakim, in his Mustadrak, recorded this Hadith. Al-Hakim commented that this Hadith is authentic and that the Two Shaykhs - Al-Bukhari and Muslim - did not collect it, although it meets their criteria.

Ahmad recorded a Hadith with similar meaning from Ibn Muhayriz who said: I said to Abu Jumu`ah, "Narrate a Hadith for us that you heard from the Messenger of Allah.'' He said, "Yes. I will narrate a good Hadith for you. Once we had lunch with the Messenger of Allah . Abu `Ubaydah, who was with us, said, `O Messenger of Allah! Are people better than us We embraced Islam with you and performed Jihad with you.' He said,

(Yes, those who will come after you, who will believe in me although they did not see me.)''

This Hadith has another route collected by Abu Bakr bin Marduwyah in his Tafsir, from Salih bin Jubayr who said: `Abu Jumu`ah Al-Ansari, the Companion of the Messenger of Allah , came to Bayt Al-Maqdis (Jerusalem) to perform the prayer. Raja' bin Haywah was with us, so when Abu Jumu`ah finished, we went out to greet him. When he was about to leave, he said, "You have a gift and a right. I will narrate a Hadith for you that I heard from the Messenger of Allah. '' We said, "Do so, and may Allah grant you mercy.'' He said, "We were with the Messenger of Allah, ten people including Mu`adh bin Jabal. We said, "O Messenger of Allah! Are there people who will acquire greater rewards than us We believed in Allah and followed you.' He said,

(What prevents you from doing so, while the Messenger of Allah is among you, bringing you the revelation from heaven There are people who will come after you and who will be given a book between two covers (the Qur'an), and they will believe in it and implement its commands. They have a greater reward than you, even twice as much.)''

(And perform Salah, and spend out of what we have provided for them)

Tafseer Ibn Katheer

The Jinn dont come under the category of Ghayb (unseen knowlegde) because Allah has already informed us about them and also gave reason why we can't see them pretty clear.

Allah says:
“Soon shall We settle your affairs, O both you great worlds!” [Sûrah al-Rahmân: 31]
“I only created the Jinn and humanity to worship Me.” [Sûrah al-Dhâriyât: 56]
Verily he [Shaytaan] and his qabeeluhu [his soldiers from the jinn or his tribe] see you from where you cannot see them…" [al-A’raaf 7:27]

Read more on that here http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/2340/Jinn
 

bari

Junior Member
:salam2:
Prophet sws did not see Allaha although he was in presence of the divine. Allah gave some specific knowledge about the unseen world but prophet did not know ghayb.Pp
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer


The Jinn dont come under the category of Ghayb (unseen knowlegde) because Allah has already informed us about them and also gave reason why we can't see them pretty clear.

Allah says:
“Soon shall We settle your affairs, O both you great worlds!” [Sûrah al-Rahmân: 31]
“I only created the Jinn and humanity to worship Me.” [Sûrah al-Dhâriyât: 56]
Verily he [Shaytaan] and his qabeeluhu [his soldiers from the jinn or his tribe] see you from where you cannot see them…" [al-A’raaf 7:27]

Read more on that here http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/2340/Jinn

:salam2:
Prophet sws did not see Allaha although he was in presence of the divine. Allah gave some specific knowledge about the unseen world but prophet did not know ghayb.Pp

Salam brothers and sisters,

Ahh that makes sense. So after reading that little subscript, the ghayb (unseen knowledge, unforseen) is exactly the knowledge of the unseen world (i.e. afterlife, future, past, present, death, birth) So i was wrong God dammit..

:( I feel so dumb, like me always talking about:

Salam brothers and sisters,

I don't know if I'm being a troll or a spammer, but i really want to know. Am i normal? The reason I ask that is because my aspiration is so confusing

You see its just that im really intriuiged by it. My intuition for it is different from a normal curious person. Like i liked the Unknown since childhood (as far as I can remember). Also I don't know if I had these dreams before when i was a child, but like a year or 2 years ago I had some wierd feelings and I had dreams, which I cannot remember, i remember one was concerning Jinns, and well some quran ayats also lightened and enforced my aspiration to know the reason and the purpose. truely don't know if this aspiration is about unknown as in creation (i.e. universe, jinns, Alif Laam Meem) or if it unknown/unseen that is beyond like the ghayb or absolute like the keys to the ghayb or maybe something else. Whenever I pray or before I go to sleep I always ask Allah for Guidance, I ask him to show me and understand my dream and if its from shaitain destroy the dreams and I ask to understand it, if its just unknown or the ghayb (beyond). Im also interested in the keys to the universe...but yeah..The only reason I asked here on TTI is because i want understand it and its purpose its so hard to explain and really mind consuming

Also recently i had a dream but also i had a random thought of me as a aerospace engineering being sent to Saturn. Apparently there as an unknown body (a rogue planet) made out of something and no physics even M-theory and stuff could explain in, and that effected Saturn so pretty much you can stand on a gas planet. Anyway I used a mass driver (kinda like a accelerator) to boost me onto the rouge planet. I then went inside the planet and saw some unknown tunnels and stuff written on the walls. The energy of the planet and temperature was really weird, like it got hotter as i go deeper but it fluctuated. It felt comfortable, then i had a weird feeling in my dream and in my thought and i found some piece of what looks like a metal and then i hear/feel something and i run back to my ship and come back to earth

Brothers and sisters, I'm not an amazing Muslim i have committed sins but idk what this dreams are and what my aspiration is...help me find out..i pray to Allah that I find my answers and I don't know if its the unknown or the ghayb. Also to my understanding apparently the ghayb is the unseen knowledge/power/or whatever it is/beyond..then shouldn't it be also considered the unknown..See thats whats confusing me, too..please help..i hope I'm not weird

Now despite the dreams, I guess my working definition of the unknown was of worldy matters and maybe the beyond. I learned that all the things I have been saying was from my mind. I don't know if my dreams were from my mind or shaitain or autheticated. But I know that the "feelings" were made out of my mind, the shivers well i just did them. And the visions, well lol I was crazy, just my imagination running wild. You see, ever since i was introduced to Islam I have been a fanatic, and i look deep into it. So I misunderstood the defintion of the al ghayb. Its just the unforseen. I was trying to attain the unknown of the world, try to find the secrets of the universe and maybe beyond. I was trying to find the capacity and the abilities and powers and something beyond... Argg and there I go blabbing again. Anyway sorry for the blabbing, but now I don't know, i don't feel special or anything anymore LOL.. im confused as a lost nemo =)
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Salam brothers and sisters,

Ahh that makes sense. So after reading that little subscript, the ghayb (unseen knowledge, unforseen) is exactly the knowledge of the unseen world (i.e. afterlife, future, past, present, death, birth) So i was wrong God dammit..

:( I feel so dumb, like me always talking about:



Now despite the dreams, I guess my working definition of the unknown was of worldy matters and maybe the beyond. I learned that all the things I have been saying was from my mind. I don't know if my dreams were from my mind or shaitain or autheticated. But I know that the "feelings" were made out of my mind, the shivers well i just did them. And the visions, well lol I was crazy, just my imagination running wild. You see, ever since i was introduced to Islam I have been a fanatic, and i look deep into it. So I misunderstood the defintion of the al ghayb. Its just the unforseen. I was trying to attain the unknown of the world, try to find the secrets of the universe and maybe beyond. I was trying to find the capacity and the abilities and powers and something beyond... Argg and there I go blabbing again. Anyway sorry for the blabbing, but now I don't know, i don't feel special or anything anymore LOL.. im confused as a lost nemo =)

lol, i am still lost, lol I just wanted to know in islamic context, the ghayb (the unforseen) and the beyond/unknown isn't the same thing, correct? Thank you for the help.
 

abdul-aziz

Junior Member
:salam2:

this may help you in your interests:

commentary of tafsir and explanation of surat at-takathur

and here is some notes of the lecture:
http://ia600107.us.archive.org/10/items/SurahTakathur-MiracleDreamTafseer-NoumanAliKhan/SurahTakathur_MiracleDreamTafseer_NoumanAliKhan.pdf

pay particular attention to ayah 5 to 8 in the lecture.

hope that helps you for now.

then as for your question about ghayb: proceed here

don't skip now do it that order so you can fully understand, in sha Allah.

pay particular attention to page 6. then on page 8 the sheik concludes your question's confusion.

but I really would like for you to read and understand all that I put forth to you, since after reading your posts I feel these may greatly assist you and me as well.
:wasalam:
 

MahyarEL-Prince

Studying Islam...
Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullah.

Couple things are certain, Ilm al ghayb belongs to Allah alone. He is Al Hakeem, Al Alim.
He knows everything while we regular people, aswell as prophets have limited knowledge.
Of course the prophets (May peace be with them) know more then us.
But to have ilm al ghayb would mean that you know everything Past/Present/Future.

And in the Quran Allah SWT has made it clear that the prophet (saws) does not know the unseen, except what Allah has willed and blessed him with. But to have the title of having absolute knowledge of the unseen would mean you know every single thing in all places at all times.

From my experiences I have found out that most people that make this claim of the Prophet having ilm al ghayb is from the Sufi's and Shia'ah.
From them I have also heard that the prophet is in all senses infallable. (Doesn't make errors/mistakes)
Indeed the prophet is a human being just like ourselves, but he has been given prophethood and has been made in the best character to lead by example..
There are hadiths of the prophet forgetting verses during Salah and a companion asked him if the verse has been abrogated, and he replied in the negative and told the companion to remind him , if he forgets. (saws)

I have also heard from some sufi's that Allah created the universe for prophet Muhammad (saws) , and also that the Prophet's Nur (saws) was the first thing created.
I have also heard the prophet (saws) is the FIRST and LAST prophet (saws) ..

Then again these are those same people (not all) that make dua to the prophet (saws)
"ya rasoolullah" "ya ali(ibn abi talib) ya hussain " Etc.

alhamdulillah ala kulli haal,
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
:salam2:

this may help you in your interests:

commentary of tafsir and explanation of surat at-takathur

and here is some notes of the lecture:
http://ia600107.us.archive.org/10/items/SurahTakathur-MiracleDreamTafseer-NoumanAliKhan/SurahTakathur_MiracleDreamTafseer_NoumanAliKhan.pdf

pay particular attention to ayah 5 to 8 in the lecture.

hope that helps you for now.

then as for your question about ghayb: proceed here

don't skip now do it that order so you can fully understand, in sha Allah.

pay particular attention to page 6. then on page 8 the sheik concludes your question's confusion.

but I really would like for you to read and understand all that I put forth to you, since after reading your posts I feel these may greatly assist you and me as well.
:wasalam:

Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullah.

Couple things are certain, Ilm al ghayb belongs to Allah alone. He is Al Hakeem, Al Alim.
He knows everything while we regular people, aswell as prophets have limited knowledge.
Of course the prophets (May peace be with them) know more then us.
But to have ilm al ghayb would mean that you know everything Past/Present/Future.

And in the Quran Allah SWT has made it clear that the prophet (saws) does not know the unseen, except what Allah has willed and blessed him with. But to have the title of having absolute knowledge of the unseen would mean you know every single thing in all places at all times.

From my experiences I have found out that most people that make this claim of the Prophet having ilm al ghayb is from the Sufi's and Shia'ah.
From them I have also heard that the prophet is in all senses infallable. (Doesn't make errors/mistakes)
Indeed the prophet is a human being just like ourselves, but he has been given prophethood and has been made in the best character to lead by example..
There are hadiths of the prophet forgetting verses during Salah and a companion asked him if the verse has been abrogated, and he replied in the negative and told the companion to remind him , if he forgets. (saws)

I have also heard from some sufi's that Allah created the universe for prophet Muhammad (saws) , and also that the Prophet's Nur (saws) was the first thing created.
I have also heard the prophet (saws) is the FIRST and LAST prophet (saws) ..

Then again these are those same people (not all) that make dua to the prophet (saws)
"ya rasoolullah" "ya ali(ibn abi talib) ya hussain " Etc.

alhamdulillah ala kulli haal,

Thanks for the help from both of you brothers.

Now reading both of the links and listening to the narration. i felt empowered and everything seemed clear to me. Now i understand the urge to be different and better was built into my mindset and everyone has the same urge. I understand that the urge can be very distracting, but isn't it the urge that which helps our society to progress ironically? I really pray that its possible for me to be different and still not be distracted in not seeing the truth in front of my own eyes.

Also regarding the ghayb, I read the pdf and I understood it, the ghayb is meaning the unseen. Now reported hadeeth claim that the ghayb (unseen) also contains the knowledge of the 5. So the ghayb (unseen) is about the unforseen and not the unknown and beyond. Now I am not saying that Allah doesn't know the unknown either, but he has the keys to both the unknown/beyond and the unseen. So technically, isn't it possible for us humans (given that we are limited) still aspire and actually find the unknown/beyond in a limited way? Like I am talking about maybe the secret of the universe, dark matter/energy, the beyond type thing.. Because maybe in understanding dark matter/energy or anything regarding the beyond, we can help humanity and maybe we can attain the ilm-yaqeen? Because i know that we have both the certainty from knoweldge and feel from the quran as well.

I don't know if I am blabbing or not, but can you please tell me I am making any sense?

Jakkaz Allah Khairn for your help brothers and sisters.
 

abdul-aziz

Junior Member
Thanks for the help from both of you brothers.

Now reading both of the links and listening to the narration. i felt empowered and everything seemed clear to me. Now i understand the urge to be different and better was built into my mindset and everyone has the same urge. I understand that the urge can be very distracting, but isn't it the urge that which helps our society to progress ironically? I really pray that its possible for me to be different and still not be distracted in not seeing the truth in front of my own eyes.

Also regarding the ghayb, I read the pdf and I understood it, the ghayb is meaning the unseen. Now reported hadeeth claim that the ghayb (unseen) also contains the knowledge of the 5. So the ghayb (unseen) is about the unforseen and not the unknown and beyond. Now I am not saying that Allah doesn't know the unknown either, but he has the keys to both the unknown/beyond and the unseen. So technically, isn't it possible for us humans (given that we are limited) still aspire and actually find the unknown/beyond in a limited way? Like I am talking about maybe the secret of the universe, dark matter/energy, the beyond type thing.. Because maybe in understanding dark matter/energy or anything regarding the beyond, we can help humanity and maybe we can attain the ilm-yaqeen? Because i know that we have both the certainty from knoweldge and feel from the quran as well.

I don't know if I am blabbing or not, but can you please tell me I am making any sense?

Jakkaz Allah Khairn for your help brothers and sisters.
:salam2:

be patient brother,

Islam encourages man to study, observe, and learn of Allah's creation. Allah is the knower of all things. If Allah's willed it for you than you will achieve this knowledge, but it probably will not come with wishful thinking. Keep in mind these discoveries didn't just pop up, a lot of hard working dedicated individuals thought through and studied for very long time to know and prove.

here is an old tti post from helpinghumanity:
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36785&highlight=mosquito

as you can see, you don't need to goto the universe to discover things that were not known until recent discoveries or the Quran told us.:wasalam:
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
:salam2:

be patient brother,

Islam encourages man to study, observe, and learn of Allah's creation. Allah is the knower of all things. If Allah's willed it for you than you will achieve this knowledge, but it probably will not come with wishful thinking. Keep in mind these discoveries didn't just pop up, a lot of hard working dedicated individuals thought through and studied for very long time to know and prove.

here is an old tti post from helpinghumanity:
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36785&highlight=mosquito

as you can see, you don't need to goto the universe to discover things that were not known until recent discoveries or the Quran told us.:wasalam:

Hmm, that link was interesting indeed. And I guess your right, wishful thinking isnt right, but for some reason I don't remember but i had dreams and idk feeling to go delve in the unknown. I can't explain in and all this "wishful" thinking as effected me in away, like making me think and stuff, i guess all that's what sprung all my imaginations and feelings..idk. Also i have wondered, some accounts consider the ghayb the unknown but its the unseen, man words have a weird way of playing. I don't see how one term means the both when the example is of the unforseen (5 items of surat luqman).
 

True_Sultan

A logical believer
Hmm, that link was interesting indeed. And I guess your right, wishful thinking isnt right, but for some reason I don't remember but i had dreams and idk feeling to go delve in the unknown. I can't explain in and all this "wishful" thinking as effected me in away, like making me think and stuff, i guess all that's what sprung all my imaginations and feelings..idk. Also i have wondered, some accounts consider the ghayb the unknown but its the unseen, man words have a weird way of playing. I don't see how one term means the both when the example is of the unforseen (5 items of surat luqman).

there is nothing wrong with my logic i hope, but it does make sense cause the quran talks about the unseen not the unknown and maybe the the same thing and maybe not, but what i am looking for (including the answers to the universe and beyond and infinite "shudder" type thing) has nothing to do with the unforseen or whatever examples are shown in the quran, doesn't that mean im safe :lol: :p
 
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