Problems with the Salafi (wahabbi) methodology

S

Seeker-of-truth

Junior Member
Assalaamu alaikum everyone,

Hi There,
Now i'm not one who normally hates on groups, especially a group like the salafi's who claim they are on the sunnah. I have been blessed with enough wealth to buy many islamic books including most of Saheeh Bukhari but I am british and so I don't understand arabic like many others so all of my books are translated into english.
Now whilst I was reading one of my books Sahih bukhari Vol. 1, Translated by Muhammad Muhsin Khan, I couldn'y help but wonder who this guy is and if his translations are accurate and trustworthy. To my amazement I find that he is a salafi and is accused of tampering with the meanings of parts of bukhari in favor of the salafis. Then I read on to find that many other "Salafis" have been accused of altering the words of classical islamic texts. Seriously try it go onto google and type Salafi tamp you dont even need to finish the word tamper and on all of the suggestions would be books that they have been accused of tampering with. I bought my books and they cost me a lot of money (im a college student) and most of them were translated by Muhammad Muhsin Khan. These salafis even supposedly altered the meanings of things from other important texts such as Riyad Us-Saliheen! and also many other places. Here are ssome links from places where they have been accused:

*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!, its a good website for islamic knowledge

http://qa.*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!/issue_view.asp?HD=1&ID=154&CATE=91

A link from another random forum it seems good it has pictures n stuff If you don't wanna believe this 1 then thats ok

*link removed*

A great american sheikh - Sheikh Nuh Ha Mim Keller

*link removed*

There are plenty of other places where i found similar attacks on wahaabis.

If this turns out to be true, then there is a real problem

I need an answer fast, I may have to go and beg the shopkeeper to refund my books I have around £400 worth, thats a lot of money. Or will it be wrong to refund them to the shopkeeper who might misguide another customer with the books?

The alterations are all in favour of the salafi methodology, which put the suspicion into my head that this is a conspiracy.

I thought Salafi's were legit and apparantly they say that Hajj is not compulsory upon women who dont have a mahram, and men and women pray exactly the same, and a big scholar of theirs Al Albani wishes to have the grave of our rasool (SAW) demolished and is called an innovator.. after I get a few genuine replies you may delete as people may spam with all sorts of messages thread Jazaakh allahu khair

But seriously I need an answer

please dont think im spreading hate i just want to know
 
ahmed_indian

ahmed_indian

to Allah we belong
Seeker-of-truth said:
why does s....h come up as stars?
Click to expand...

:salam2:

bcoz some of its beliefs are against Quran and sunnah....the site is blocked by TTI.

also brother, the arguments between sunnis, salafis, (though sunni and salafi means same), deobandis, sufis and beralwis will not stop. as all of them will present their viewpoints which will seem to be correct.

all we need is to stick to Quran and sunnah and not dwell too much on some of the minor issues which are not an essential part of our aqeedah.
 
S

Seeker-of-truth

Junior Member
this is all well and good but what about my books, they could have fake translations in them and whats wrong with sunni path? i didnt notice anything against quran and sunnah from there. What if the translator did actually reword the hadiths to his favor?
 
A

Abu Talib

Feeling low
Assalamu`alaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatu

I'd like you to spend time reading the following links no need to buy books also.

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showpost.php?p=199944&postcount=38

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17670&highlight=salafiyyah

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?p=265926#post265926

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showpost.php?p=148261&postcount=1

It is reported that once a heretic was brought to Harun al-Rashid who subsequently ordered for his execution. The heretic said to him, 'Why are you executing me?' He said, 'To relieve the worshippers of you (and your heresy).' He said, 'And what can you do about the one thousand narrations that I attributed to the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) although he did not utter a single letter of them?' Al-Rashid then said to him, 'O enemy of Allah! And what can do you about Abu Ishaq al-Fazari and Ibn al-Mubarak who will sift through them and extract them one by one!' It is just as the Prophet (sallallahu `alayhi wa sallam) said in an authentic narration, 'This knowledge will be carried in every generation by its trustworthy ones. They will remove from it the distortions of the excessive ones, the false claims of the liars and the wrong interpretations of the ignorant.' [al-Bayhaqi]
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I'm sure Nuh Ham Mem Keller & hispeople would also accuse Abdullah Ibn Mubarak of tempering the classical texts then. Your quick to conclude its fake translation what makes you sure those links which you saw are true translations then?
 
S

Seeker-of-truth

Junior Member
thanks for the link wow u got all the books right there.. but tampering with classical texts is a very serious issue, and their is usually an agenda behind it. and what Sheikh Keller says does make sense.. he has his hadith example as a proof.
 
salahdin

salahdin

Junior Member
Guys you know what there is nothing called wahabism for if it is Sheikh Muhammad Ibn Abd-al-Wahhab you mean , he follow the foots steps of our beloved prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم . He did not bring something new. Muhammed bin 'Abd Al Wahhab considered his work an effort to purify Islam by returning Muslims to what he believed were the original principles of Islam, as typified by the Salaf and rejecting what he regarded as corruptions introduced by Bid'ah and Shirk.


Hadith #68

Whoever protects the honor of his brother in his absence, Allah will protect his face from the fire on the Day of Judgment. [Tirmidhi]




“A believer is a mirror to his brother. A believer is a brother of a believer: he protects him against any danger and guards him from behind.”
(Related by Al Bukhari in Al Adab Al Mufrad and by Abu Dawood.)
 
A

Abu Talib

Feeling low
Seeker-of-truth said:
thanks for the link wow u got all the books right there.. but tampering with classical texts is a very serious issue, and their is usually an agenda behind it. and what Sheikh Keller says does make sense.. he has his hadith example as a proof.
Click to expand...

He is known to lie and play with the text to suite ones argument if you check the links i gave one has proof how he plays around.
 
S

Seeker-of-truth

Junior Member
i am so confused.. you look one way and everyone is awesome and amazing for the work they've done, you look to find a bit more about them and they are liars, tamperers and deceivers, even the publishing companies have been accused, bin baz and al albani have been accused. What exactly do we know about sufi'ism except that its "mystical" whatever that means. I don't know what to do. My life is a mess. This is why we must learn arabic.. So much would become so clear.
 
D

dunno

Junior Member
Dr. Mushin is very trustworthy. Ibn baz and albani are also very trustworthy scholars. Don't be surprised that people attack them, I stopped getting surprised about people attacking them when I saw people attacking our beloved prophet. Everyone is attacked but you should definatly stay from websites attacking those people.

Saudis are often called wahabis or salafis, I dont mind being called a salafi since I do my best to follow the salaf ( sahabah ). However, it upsets me when I'm called a wahabi. The sheikh was a great man that cleared shirk from Saudi Arabia. But since we as muslims refuse to be called Muhammadin how can we accept being called wahabis?
 
sachin4islam

sachin4islam

Junior Member
Assalam Alaikum:

To differentiate truth from falsehood just pray a few times with these sects who ignorantly accuse Salafis,undoubtedly you will realize who is to the path of Muhammad (SAW) and who is deviant. I focus here on way of offering prayers.

Follow untwisted truth and pure Islam. Yes,one problem with Salafism is that they go extremist many a times with regards to other sects of Islam. But undoubtedly Salafism is not a sect but only way of Muhammad (SAW) and Sahaba.

Regards.
 
A

abdul-aziz

Junior Member
:salam2:

without a doubt being closer to that ways of the prophet, PBUH and sahaba, ra is a very good role to follow.

like previous post, mentions there are differences attached to this name and I will quote what somebody else mentioned not my words:

Subhan Allah Salafis are now 6 different groups, with each group making tabd'iee or tafsiq of the other.. all this while claiming to be "the true followers of the Salafs aqida and manhaj"...

6 salafi groups:

1) Neo-Salafi/Madkhali/Jami/Murji'ia Salafis: their shaikhs are Rabee MAdkhali, Shaikh Al-Jami, Shaikh Ali Halabi Al-Athari
2) Salafiyya Mashyakhiyya: Ibn Baz, Ibn Uthaymeen, Albani, Muqbil Wad'iee
3) Salafiyya Ilmiya: Abdul RAhman Abdul Khaliq, the Ansarul Sunnah movement
4) Ikhwani Salafis: Abdul Majeed Zandani, Omar Al-Ashqar
5) Suroori/ Sahwa Salafis: Safar Hawali, Salman Oadah
6) Salafi Jihadi: Osama bin Laden & Al-Qaeda

all these groups make tafseeq of each other..
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These issues should be ignored, and I will tell you why.

First to start off, prior to 1990, there wasn't any of these labels in this magnitude. It seems when Iraq war happened there became an influx of categorization of Muslims. The reason is not because of non muslims, it is because muslims began to take hold of the world wide web. As more and more people began sharing information globally there started the labeling system in a way that Muslims never seen before.

Today, Muslims have matured greatly, we realized that information is worthless unless there is evidence established with respects to Islam. There is a unification taking place as we speak, consolidating information and corroborating authentic sources. Do you know the shia have literally thousands upon thousands of texts in Arabic that are relatively worthless and unauthentic. Now I purposely spun the subject away from the op main question or point on purpose. Because by the end of the day, Allah, swt, will correct the Ummah as he sees people with the willing desire to be on the correct path, the straight path. So you will have people oppressing themselves, others proceed in moderation, and finally those who try to achieve the greatest blessing and reward from Allah. {see 35:32}

It's like riding a bicycle down a road that branches off to different areas, you don't need to guess this road or that road, you have a compass. that compass is the Quran. Now along the way you and your bicycle needs maintenance, the knowledge of how to obtain those as well as the availability of the necessary things, for you to go out and utilize them, will come from ^up above 7 heavens. Yes, knowledge is a part of rizq. As Allah, swt describes {2:31} what took place in our beginning then look at the challenge answer of the next ayah {2:32} The angels stated we only know what you(Allah) taught us. What better example do we need in obedience to the Just Creator, swt.





wa Allah ya'lam

Surat fatir recited , do review translation if need so along with recitation.

:wasalam:
 
tariq353

tariq353

Junior Member
:salam2:

Brother first of all making sects in Islam is not allowed
"Indeed, those who have divided their religion and become sects – you, [O Muhammad], are not [associated] with them in anything. Their affair is only
to Allah; then He will inform them about what they used to do."
[Quran 6:159]​
​
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but still Prophet :saw: told us that ummah will be divided into sects and only one will enter Jannah......... funny thing is that each n every one is trying their lvl bst in proving that they r one who have the ultimate license to heaven n all other r kaafir :astag:........ evn the most deviated sects doing all sorts of biddah claim to be the one having the ultimate licence....

their thinking is similar to that of Jews n christians as mentioned in Quran
"And they(jews and christians) say, "None will enter Paradise except one who is a Jew or a Christian." That is [merely] their wishful thinking. Say, "Produce your proof, if you should be truthful."
Quran 2:111
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There is nothing like wahabism... look all these gr8 people tried to take people back to Authentic sources (Quran & Sunnah) so the people induldged in biddah grant them these kind of names... They played the same game which christian played with muslims for centuries.
We call ourself as muslim n Prophet :saw: as the last n final messenger but christians tag us n call us as "Mohammeden" is it right???
Obvoiusly no...

There r muslim groups who have done specialized courses in misrepresenting those who r spreading the true message of Islam & declaring them kaafir :(

Calling other kaafir is very serious..bcz if the other isnt in the sight of Allah the kufr comes back to the caller
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intresting they dont have any dawah websites but yes they v expert websites declaring others as wrong n Supporting their biddah s by misquoting hadiths n verses.

So brother don't bother abt all these false claims....


Right remains right even if no one is following that n wrong remains wrong even if every one is following that


May Allah give hidaya to all our misguided brothers..​
 
saifkhan

saifkhan

abd-Allah
salahdin said:
Guys you know what there is nothing called wahabism for if it is Sheikh Muhammad Ibn Abd-al-Wahhab you mean , he follow the foots steps of our beloved prophet ??? ???? ???? ???? . He did not bring something new. Muhammed bin 'Abd Al Wahhab considered his work an effort to purify Islam by returning Muslims to what he believed were the original principles of Islam, as typified by the Salaf and rejecting what he regarded as corruptions introduced by Bid'ah and Shirk.


Hadith #68

Whoever protects the honor of his brother in his absence, Allah will protect his face from the fire on the Day of Judgment. [Tirmidhi]




“A believer is a mirror to his brother. A believer is a brother of a believer: he protects him against any danger and guards him from behind.”
(Related by Al Bukhari in Al Adab Al Mufrad and by Abu Dawood.)
Click to expand...



salam aliakum warahamtu-llah everyone

JazakAllah khair for clarifying the point brother Salahdin.

@ seeker of truth:
thats what I always say, and one really needs to go through the books to have a clear idea. at least go through Kitab at-tawheed and kashfush shubuhaat.

i've went through Yusuf ali and also Muhsin khan and Taqiuddin hilali translation and sometimes Sahih international, I didn't find any contradiction, i must say: Dr. muhsin khan and taqiuddin hilali translation is one of the most easy English translation, I prefer this translation more than my own language.

Salafi: its not a sect, following the pious predecessors is not similar to taqleed

the moment you will be going to say Haqq in public, there will be problem, there will be attacks from everywhere, people will go against you, they might call you extremist or radical minded, subhan Allah.

this is not something new.
don't jump to a conclusion very soon.

we should read, gather knowledge and seek Allah's help, He will surely guide us to right direction.

JazakAllah khair
wassalam
 
S

Seeker-of-truth

Junior Member
I didn't jump to a conclusion i just began to doubt thats all, and if you know the story of Tunisia it goes something like this.
Once upon a time there was a tyrant who oppressed everyone murdered and torchered many people and did many other bad things..
This leader also monitored everything that was said in every main khutba and jailed and murdered those who spoke against him, So much that the imam of the main mosque in tunisia fled for over 20 years, an imam was appointed by the president himself.
In Saudi Arabia a similar story maybe with less oppression the ruler was a tyrant and monitored islamic teachings in the country. Salaf'ism is the main belief there, All publishing companies are monitored, many classical islamic texts in their original form are there.. Sheikh Bin Baz has been appointed by the king.. and I don't know if this part is true i got it from *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! if you don't trust that website than u dont need to read any further.

Advice to Our Brothers the Ulema of Najd - Contempt of the Ulema
Answered by Shaykh Gibril F Haddad
Question:Advice to our brothers the Ulema of Najd - contempt of the Ulema Answer:

Excerpt from al-Sayyid Yusuf al-Rifa`i's recent epistle,

Advice to Our Brothers the Ulema of Najd

(Nasiha li-Ikhwanina `Ulama' Najd)

translated by Sidi Gibril Haddad:

#49 - Contempt of the Ulema

The Four Madh�hib had pulpits in the Meccan Sanctuary - you destroyed them1 - and teaching chairs - you banned them. Among the last to date was that of Dr. Muhammad ibn `Alawi al-Maliki who succeeded his father and grandfather.

But your eyes could not bear to see him there, so you accused him of misguidance and sheer disbelief in your book al-Hiwar [Hiwar ma` al-Maliki by Muhammad ibn Mani`]. Had Allah not prompted me to defend him with my book al-Radd al-Mani` and others of the people of learning with theirs,2 and if King Fahd, the Custodian of the Two Sanctuaries, had not interfered to protect him, he would be ancient history today.

There used to be Ulema also in the Noble Prophetic Sanctuary, teaching the Four Schools of Law. The last one was Shaykh `Abd al-Rahman al-Juhani al-Shafi`i - the author of the manual Qatf al-Thimar fi Ahkam al-Hajj wa al-I`timar - whom you prevented from teaching "until he obtain a permit from Shaykh Ibn Baz." The permit was never issued and so he was stopped from teaching. Another was the scrupulous, erudite scholar and mufti, Shaykh `Abd Allah Sa`id al-Lahji al-Shafi`i - rahimahull�h! One of your spies stopped him from teaching and all requests to Ibn Baz to return him to teaching failed. As a result, the students were deprived of the benefit of his valuable lessons. Before him the verifying, erudite scholar, Shaykh Isma`il `Uthman al-Zayn al-Shafi`i - rahimahull�h! - was also stopped and harassed. Allah is the One Who shall take accounts of you!

Thus was the gate of teaching in the Four Madhahib closed shut after such teaching had lived on uninterruptedly since the earliest ages of Islam - the
days of the T�bi`�n and their Successors from the best, praised Islamic centuries and even in the time of your predecessors when they penetrated the Hijaz. Yet you gave full opportunity there to [Abu Bakr] al-Jaza'iri and his ilk, such as his in-law, to repeat and shout at the top of his lungs, right next to al-Mustafa : "The father and mother of the Prophet are in hellfire!

The father and mother of the Prophet are in hellfire!"3 Truly we belong to Allah and to Him is our return, there is no change nor power except with Allah, sufficient for us is Allah, and what a wonderful reliance!

All this is in the balance of your deeds and under your responsibility in the presence of our Almighty Lord, without fear nor trembling on your part before Allah Most High Who said: {Lo! those who malign Allah and His messenger, Allah has cursed them in the world and the Hereafter and prepared for them the doom of the disdained} (33:57) and {Those who vex the messenger of Allah, for them there is a painful doom} (9:61).


NOTES

1 These pulpits can be seen represented around the Ka`ba in pre-Wahhabi drawings and pictures of Makka.

2 Adilla Ahl al-Sunna wa al-Jama`a aw al-Radd al-Muhkam al-Mani` `ala
Munkarat wa Shubuhat Ibn Mani` fi Tahajjumihi `ala al-Sayyid Muhammad
`Alawi al-Maliki al-Makki ("The Evidences of the Sunni Community, or, The
Unassailably Proficient Rebuttal of the Blameworthy and Doubtful Points of Ibn Mani` in His Assault on al-Maliki"), which he published in 1984 in response to a contemporary's attack on Shaykh Muhammad ibn al-Sayyid `Alawi al-Maliki for the latter's having contradicted the tenets of the Wahhabi sect on a number of questions in his book Mafahim Yajib an Tusahhah ("The Necessary Correction of Certain Misconceptions"), published ca. 1983 and now in its 10th printing, perhaps the most important contemporary statement of Ahl al-Sunna on Wahhabi/"Salafi" teachings.
Other rebuttals: `Abd al-Hayy al-`Amrawi & `Abd al-Karim Murad, al-Tahdhir
min al-Ightirar bi ma Ja'a fi Kitab al-Hiwar min al-Manakir ("Warning Against Being Fooled by the Reprehensible Contents of the Book [by Ibn Mani`] `A Debate with al-Maliki'"); Shaykh Rashid ibn Ibrahim al-Marikhi of Bahrayn, Raf` al-Astar `an Shubuhat wa Dala-lat Sahib al-Hiwar ("Exposing the Insinuations and Aber-rations of the Author of the `Debate with al-Maliki'"); al-Sayyid `Abd Allah ibn Mahfuz al-Haddad Ba `Alawi al-Hadrami, al-Sunna wa al-Bid`a. Etc.

3 On the parents of the Prophet being saved see the refutation of al-Jaza'iri by `Amrawi and Murad, Wa`iz Ghayr Mutta`iz ("A Heedless Admonisher");
al-Suyuti's fatwas in Majmu` Tis` Rasa'il and al-Hawi li al-Fatawa; Kabbani, Encyclopedia (2:143-159); and al-Barzanji, Sadad al-Din wa Sidad al-Dayn fi Najat al-Abawayn al-Sharifayn.

GF Haddad �


I did not write any of that about the madhabs its copy n pasted from *!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*! if its a lie then please let me know thanks
 
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