Reciting Fatihah during engagement

Discussion in 'Islamic Discussion' started by ShahnazZ, Nov 10, 2010.

  1. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    :salam2:, I hope you're in the best state of health and iman.

    I have a friend who is Palestinian and she has a question about engagement. There are many Arabs who practice the concept of having "a Fatihah" where they recite the surah before getting engaged. Some scholars that I have come across have stated that this is an innovation while others state it is a good deed/allowed.

    I'm not sure which of the two it is, so inshAllah I would really appreciate whatever information anyone can give me.

    JazakAllah Khair.
  2. ahmed_indian
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    ahmed_indian to Allah we belong

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    :salam2:,

    did prophet (peace be upon him) did? No

    did sahaba (may Allah be pleased with them) did? No

    did great scholars of Islam (may Allah have mercy on them) did? No

    now you can decide....:)
  3. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    Lol jazakAllah khair akhi, I agree but what I'm looking for is actual daleel.
  4. ahmed_indian
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    ahmed_indian to Allah we belong

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    there is no daleel in Quran and sunnah for this act. is not having a daleel not an actual daleel? :D
  5. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    Possibly, but I'm sure there is daleel on the subject as it is such a wide and common practice. I do recall coming across daleel at some point, but I just can't find it now.
  6. ahmed_indian
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    ahmed_indian to Allah we belong

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    :salam2:,

    1. u know one thing sister, the daleel is to be presented by those who say its allowed and not by those who say its not allowed.

    2. and i found this for you:

    http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/89582
  7. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    Regarding the fact that the daleel that is presented allows the recitation of the Fatihah, if so then in any other case it would mean that this is correct. However, you have to look at the scholar and authenticity of the fatwa. Additionally, it is my belief that the Fatihah is a bid'ah. I just needed the proper daleel for it, which currently seems to be missing.

    JazakAllah khair for this fatwa. I know the same website had another fatwa that was more explicit though, so I'm looking to hunt an explicit one down.
  8. thariq2005
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    thariq2005 Praise be to Allah!

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    Assalaamu `alaykkum sister, your answer is based upon two principles that are very beneficial to remember, which are:

    1) The 'Asl (origin) for any worldly affair (which is not related to the deen) is that it is permissible, until proven otherwise (by the shari`ah). This is based on the words of Allaah Subhaanah: "He it is Who created for you all that is on earth…" [Soorah Baqrah: 29]. For example: Using a toothpick, or sleeping on a bed etc

    2) The 'Asl for any deen related matter is that it is Haraam, until proven otherwise (by the shari`ah). Like for example, some people do Sajdah of Tawbah and other acts of worship that is not prescribed in the deen. So thus the initial view is that reciting Faatihah in engagements is Haraam, and the person who says it is permissible or even Mustahabb should bring his/her proofs forth.
  9. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    JazakAllah khair. I agree wholeheartedly and that's why I'm asking. To prove those that believe it is correct to be wrong.
  10. thariq2005
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    thariq2005 Praise be to Allah!

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    Wa iyyaaki. Well this recitation is affiliated with the deen, ask them for the proof behind doing such an act. You see that people who usually do this, that they do it so this "recitation" can be like a blessing for their marriage life, and that they initiate their marriage life upon this "blessing". How can it be that these people have come to know about sucha "blessing" which even the Messenger of Allaah :saw2: did not know about? Do they think they are more knowledgable than the Messenger of Allaah :saw2:?

    It is pretty lame that people long things out and make both their life and deen hard upon themselves. Not only do they make it hard upon themselves, but they also incur sins upon themselves by indulging in these innovations.

    Also can I know, what proof are you actually looking for? I apologize for being "slow"

    Wassalaamu `alaykkum
  11. Abu Talib
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    Abu Talib Feeling low

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    JazakAllaah Khayran akhi. This statement made me happy indeed The Prophet Mohammed :saw2: knew more about Allaah Azza Wa Jal than us and we should avoid doing things which he did not teach us in Islam.
  12. thariq2005
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    thariq2005 Praise be to Allah!

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    So why is it that on a day of happiness people choose specifically to recite Soorah Faatihah? Why not Aayatal Kursi? or other Soorahs, or ayaahs? Most of the people believe that reciting Fatihah is prescribed in this deen of Allaah, when it is not.

    May I ask, can I add an extra rak`ah to Salaatul Maghrib, because I want to worship Allaah more? Is it not enough for us, what was enough for the Messenger of Allaah :saw2: in terms of this deen? Is it not enough for us, what was enough for Abu Bakr, `Umar, `Uthmaan, `Ali (radiAllaahu `anhum)? And is it not enough for us, what was enough for all of the Sahaabah (radiAllaahu `anhum)?

    What is your definition of "Extreme"? So am I a moderate muslim (free from extremism) if I go around dancing, and jumping up and down whilst reciting some dhikr, and saying this is act of mine is from the Deen of Allaah Subhaanah?

    So can you name me a scholar from the past (who was known and acknowledged by other scholars for his scholarship) who came about with sucha statement (i.e. one can recite Soorah Fatihah in his/her engagement and this is a form of `Ibaadah)
  13. ShahnazZ
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    ShahnazZ Striving2BeAStranger

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    Brother Thariq2005, when I say proof I just mean regular daleel from an authentic source. Your statement about how these people do things without proof is exactly what I mean. The thing is they say they DO have proof and many of them believe it to be a sunnah. Of course, when you ask them for this, they never happen to have it.

    To Naw333, I think it's a bit presumptuous to be telling us we take things to an extreme just because we're questioning an act that has no religious basis. We believe innovations to be wrong due to the hadith where the Prophet :saw: states that every innovation is wrong and will not be accepted. Islam has already been perfected. There's nothing I can do to make it any more perfect than it already is. And I personally would not feel comfortable if my marriage was not initiated within the Commands of Allah subhanu wa ta'ala. I mean, if you want His Blessings shouldn't you do things the way He told you to do them? Doing anything otherwise is like saying you know better than Allah and His Messenger :saw:
  14. faaraa
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    faaraa Nothing but Muslimah

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    :)
    WHAT YOU ARE THINKING IS NOT WRONG... BUT WHAT THE PEOPLE DO COMMIT, IS WRONG SOME TIMES..

    You see, We MUST remember ALLAH AZZAWAJAL in EVERY THING we do
    we have to remember HIM when there is a Nikah too.. and of course it is a day of happiness for some people and they have to ask ALLAH AZZAWAJAL to guide them on the right track..

    EVEN RASOOLULLAH (PBUH) too did the same
    But do you know hoe he did it??

    On the authority of Jaabir Ibn ‘Abdullah he said: The Prophet (S) would instruct us to pray for guidance in all of our concerns, just as he would teach us a chapter from the Qur’an. He (S) would say ‘if any of you intends to undertake a mater then let him pray two supererogatory units (two rak’ah naafilah) of prayer and after which he should supplicate:​


    ‘O Allaah, I seek Your counsel by Your knowledge and by Your power I seek strength and I ask You from Your immense favour, for verily You are able while I am not and verily You know while I do not and You are the Knower of the unseen. O Allaah, if You know this affair -and here he mentions his need- to be good for me in relation to my religion, my life, and end, then decree and facilitate it for me, and bless me with it, and if You know this affair to be ill for me towards my religion, my life, and end, then remove it from me and remove me from it , and decree for me what is good wherever it be and make me satisfied with such.’
    (BIKHARI 7/162)​


    ‘…and consult them in the affair. Then when you have taken a decision, put your trust in Allaah…”(3:159)​


    do you understand now dear brother?

    Rasoolullah (PBUH) did never recite sooreh Fathiha in order to get the guidance from ALLAH AZZAWAJAL when he intended to do some thing good..
    BUT HE MADE TWO RAKATS OF SALAAH (ISTHIHARA) :)

    Reciting fathiha in such occasions is a BID'AH (Newly invented matter in the deen)
    So as every Bid'ah would lead you to hell fire.. you shouldn't follow the Bid'ah but the SUNNAH..:)

    We dont know what is good and bad.. what we have to do is nothing but to follow ALLAH AZZAWAJAL and his Messenger..:) SIMPLE..:)

    OBEY ALLAH AND OBEY HIS MESSENGER.. (Qur'an)​


    FEE AMANILLAH:hearts:
  15. thariq2005
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    thariq2005 Praise be to Allah!

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    Ow, the fact that there is no proof in their hands is what leads to the scholars saying that it is a bid`ah to recite Soorah al-Faatihah in engagements. I am still confused, but I am guessing your asking proof for "NOT" reciting Soorah al-Faatihah right? Sorry, I am not very clever :|
  16. um__ahmad
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    um__ahmad Junior Member

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    [
    Im from palestine and We do fatiha before an engagment. Its always good to say alfatiha. It doesnt mean an official engagment, but its hopefully a start to getting to know eachother better, And im reading all the posts and it seems like people are eiather sounding rude or sarcastic. Lets all be a little more patient with eachother JAK



    QUOTE=Naw333;476087]Don't take it the wrong way, brother. First of all, thank you for trying to keep our deen in check. Sometimes people do fall astray and new habits become tradition. Its just that I don't see any harm in this particular situation.

    You can go ahead and tell your Palestinian friend that this act is not Sunnah. But please do attend his wedding, and if rice is served, make a bold statement by eating with your fingers and not a spoon :] Same with the pudding[/QUOTE]
  17. faaraa
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    faaraa Nothing but Muslimah

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    EVEN THOUGH U ASK THIS FOR BRO. Thariq.. I just would like to clarify you some thing my dear sis..:)

    You see, As I understand, you a asking for an evidence which says "Dont recite fathiha on engagements", right??

    IF THATS THE CASE, then..

    First of all.. your question is sounding like.. one of my friend's question :lol:
    let me clarify..
    me and my friends are going for a cookery demonstration class..
    during the teacher shows us the procedures of cooking.. we have to sit and watch.. and later on we ask questions to clarify the doubts..

    in the last class, my friend got late to come to the class and when the demo was over, she asked the teacher
    " Mam, I tasted the food.. but I feel like you have added tomato sauce...but the recipe says NO.."
    Then the teacher said, " I did never add sauce.."
    you know what my friend said???

    " But how will you proof it???" :eek::eek:

    WHAT AN ILLOGICAL QUESTION..:lol:​


    Basically what I wanna tell you is nothing, but..
    Dear sis, you cant prove the existence of some thing which does not exist.. ON THE SPOT..:hijabi:

    HOPE YOU UNDERSTAND..

    As you said.."The thing is they say they DO have proof and many of them believe it to be a sunnah"

    Then tell them to produce their witness..
    plus, you your self said that "many of them believe it to be a sunnah" :lol:

    THEY JUST BELIEVE.. thats it.. but ask them to produce the proof for their belief..:)

    FEE AMANILLAH:hearts:

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