Talking to women

[booya]

This is from a revert perspective.

I am a naturally shy, introverted person. It's not often that I go out of my way to introduce myself and have a little chit chat, be it men or women. My circle of friends is really small and it often takes a longg time for someone to know me and be around me to be in that circle.

I understand that Islam regulates the relationship between men and women, however strict/lax the interpretations are.

Knowing the rulings and etiquettes, I think it makes it that much tougher to get to know people. At recent events where Muslims work together and meet, I rarely talk to the sisters. But at the same time I see some brothers talk to sisters, or vice versa, but I guess it's because they've known each other for a while. At the few times I talked to the sisters out of necessity, sometimes it ended without knowing each other's names, place of study, or any infos.

In normal Western/non-Muslim culture, it is common to just say hi, introduce yourself, ask for the names of Women, etc. Is it appropriate to do so to Muslim sisters? I thought it would be a little awkward for a brother to approach a sister just to ask for her name and just have a little "Nice to meet you" chat. Because, to be honest, I think we do not just introduce ourselves to someone we don't know if we are not interested at all to her.

What do you think of the topic of men-women friendship?

 

[hayat84]

:salam2:
brother,I'm shy like you,maaybe more.I wrote a lot of messages on tti,had many opinions for anybody (male/females),but if I had to say everything by person,well I am sure i wouldn't be able to say neither -Salam-
as reverted person,I acquired a great knowledge about the behaviour of a muslim woman toward a man.first of all,if it's a man,if I need an information,I never chit/chat with him,but I only ask and go.on the contrary,if it's a woman I'm pleased to exchange some words with her.and remember,as muslim man,if you talk to a sister to ask for something,it depends how you look,because I read on Quran that when the sight of a man matches to that of a woman,he should put his sight down,and vice-versa.so when you want to know something from a woman,it's a good thing if you don't look directly in her eyes.thi is Islam,what a beautiful religion.it's not use in Islam to have speeches between men and women,except if they are relatives.
I'm so shy that when I do something out of home,I don't look in front of me,but I look at the ground...I'm so terrible!

 

[aisha16]

In all honesty if your a practicing Muslim
you cannot have a girl/guy freindship. That person is not your Mahram so it's kinda awkward to go up to them and chat. Plus it's not a dire neccesity for anyone to come up and talk to the opposite gender to just talk. I would give salaam and talk just for necessity. Trust me you do not want to be the brother who goes up to the sisters and is always looking for some
Conversation. The sisters will either get uncomforable or think your trying to flirt with them. On another note get to know the brothers around you there's nothing wrong with that. Everyone feels shy sometimes but it's a lot better to get out of the bubble trust me. That's my two cents peace

 

[booya]

Jazakallah for the answers

Just found a good video, but I don't understand Arabic. Can someone translate?

[yt]EzA42CQW8Ho[/yt]

 

[Rustandi]

:salam2:
brother,I'm shy like you,maaybe more.I wrote a lot of messages on tti,had many opinions for anybody (male/females),but if I had to say everything by person,well I am sure i wouldn't be able to say neither -Salam-
as reverted person,I acquired a great knowledge about the behaviour of a muslim woman toward a man.first of all,if it's a man,if I need an information,I never chit/chat with him,but I only ask and go.on the contrary,if it's a woman I'm pleased to exchange some words with her.and remember,as muslim man,if you talk to a sister to ask for something,it depends how you look,because I read on Quran that when the sight of a man matches to that of a woman,he should put his sight down,and vice-versa.so when you want to know something from a woman,it's a good thing if you don't look directly in her eyes.thi is Islam,what a beautiful religion.it's not use in Islam to have speeches between men and women,except if they are relatives.
I'm so shy that when I do something out of home,I don't look in front of me,but I look at the ground...I'm so terrible!

:salam2:


sister don't feel terrible about it, cause its not a bad thing.

there are 2 kinds of haya' (shyness) good one and bad one.

The good Haya' is to be ashamed to commit a sin or a thing which Allah and His Messenger (saws) has forbidden

and the bad one is to feel ashamed to do a thing, which Allah and His Messenger (saws) ordered to do.

Narrated by Abu Huraira (ra): The Prophet said, "Faith (Belief) consists of more than sixty branches (i.e. parts). And Haya is a part of faith." (Bukhari)

Narrated Abdullah ibn Umar (ra): The Prophet (saws) passed by a man who was admonishing his brother regarding Haya and was saying, "You are very shy, and I am afraid that might harm you." On that, Allah's Apostle said, "Leave him, for Haya is (a part) of Faith." (Bukhari)

Abdullah ibn Umar (ra) narrated that the Prophet (saw) said: "Indeed haya (modesty) and Iman are Companions. When one of them is lifted, the other leaves as well." (Baihaqi)

btw i look at the ground as well when i'm walking

 

[alf2]

I have a similar issue. I am beyond introvert..I am pretty much anti-social. Any kind of social talking not related to my job makes me so uncomfortable and makes me do things out of nervousness I wont say.

Because of this, I have no idea how to make friends. If anyone would like to give me tips on how to make same gender Muslim friends PLEASE SEND ME A MESSAGE. Because it's not working for me and I'm lonely I mean...I see an Arab Muslimah in Hijab all the time...Do I say, "Salaam, even though I am white as as rice and am not wearing a hijab, I am Muslim too and would like to talk with you." How awkward does that sound!?

I look at the ground when walking or around at trees, bushes, animals. NEVER at people.

 

[alf2]

Jazakallah for the answers

Just found a good video, but I don't understand Arabic. Can someone translate?

Cool video, I am going to have a friend online translate for me insha allah.
She speaks Arabic!

 

[samiha]

:salam2:

Sorry I'm just going to try to be brief but...

Akh Booya, I think the brothers and sisters here have advised you well mashaAllaah. In brevity the only thing I'd like to add to that is that even as a revert, you'll find many actions Muslims do is wrong, but as the saying by 'Ali radiAllaahu anhu is reported, "Find the truth and you will recognize it's people..." ... In Islaam, it's not appropriate for a stranger man, even being Muslim to go up to another sister and just start chatting without a reason.

If there's a reason, a purpose, then this speaking is halaal (along with proper procedures such as lowering the gaze, not getting too friendly etc) ... but just to go up and introduce randomly, or even in general gatherings is not in line with that principle. And I'll agree with you, I've seen this in many places, brothers and sisters, esp University 'Muslim groups' where they practice so much intermingling that it's hard to understand where it all comes from - as it's certainly not within the practices of Islaam.

So May Allaah reward you for your shyness and hayaa', increase you in it when it comes to the opposite gender, and bless you for your understanding. When it comes to your own brothers though, then that case may be slightly different.

Sis alf, I know what you mean, and why that might be scary, but go for it inshaAllaah! Do speak out, you never know who you'll meet in process and what it'll lead to. Just be prepared to keep your expectations low, because as the saying goes again and again, Islaam is perfect, Muslims are not.

So even if you get a strange reaction once or twice, perhaps by it you'll find people to relate to. And the second reminder I'd add to that is, since Muslims are not perfect, you may find some actions of their's to not be Islaamic as well, so keep that in mind... I've seen some people get so wrapped up in finding Muslims they tend to overlook the fact that many of their actions are not Islaamic.

waAllaahu 'Alem

 

[samiha]

Jazakallah for the answers

Just found a good video, but I don't understand Arabic. Can someone translate?

[yt]EzA42CQW8Ho[/yt]

My Arabic isn't good, but maybe this'll give an idea of the general meaning:

It starts off with a Du'aa, which I think is ...

"Allaahumma inni 'amatuka bintu abduka .."

Then the guys drive up, say "Hello"

- Two statements after which I don't understand -

She doesn't appreciate it, and rolls up her window saying, " - laa hawla wa la quwwata illah billaah"

Meaning, There is no power no strength except from Allah

After which it says on screen, "اترضاه لاختك "

Meaning roughly, "Would you be pleased with/accept this for your sister?"
---

Moral of the story being that the action that they've done, would they like it to be done to their sister? Would they approve of such an action being done to her? If not - basically why would they do it to perhaps someone else's sister?

There's a conjoining hadeeth on this vein which goes like this:

hadeeth reported by Abu Umaamah (may Allaah be pleased with him), who said that a young man came to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and said: “O Messenger of Allaah, give me permission to commit zina.”

The people turned to him to rebuke him, telling him to be quiet. But the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Leave him alone.”

Then he came closer to him and told him to sit down. He said: “Would you like that for your mother?”

He said: “No, by Allaah, may Allaah make me your ransom.”

He said: “No, and the people do not like it for their mothers either.” Then he said: “Would you like it for your daughter?”

He said: “No, by Allaah, may Allaah make me your ransom.”

He said: “No, and the people do not like it for their daughters either.” He said: "Would you like it for your sister?”

He said: “No, by Allaah, may Allaah make me your ransom.”

He said: “No, and the people do not like it for their sisters either.” He said: “Would you like it for your paternal aunt?”

He said: “No, by Allaah, may Allaah make me your ransom.”

He said: “No, and the people do not like it for their paternal aunts either.” He said: “Would you like it for your maternal aunt?”

He said: “No, by Allaah, may Allaah make me your ransom.”

He said: “No, and the people do not like it for their maternal aunts either.”

Then he placed his hand on him and said: “O Allaah, forgive his sins and cleanse his heart, and protect his chastity.” And after that the young man never thought of any such thing again.

Musnad Ahmad, 21705; al-Albaani classed its isnaad as saheeh in al-Saheehah, 370.

Wording is a bit different though in the hadeeth, it asks.. " أَفَتُحِبُّهُ لأُخْتِكَ ؟ "

Allaahu 'Alem, would be good if ukht Alf's friend could give a proper translation.

 

[booya]

Jazakallah ukht samiha,

That is why sometimes I wonder if I am too strict. Indeed the people I see are college age. While I do try to think positive about them, sometimes I think maybe I should get more friends both male and female. In all the times around the MSA I only know the names of few sisters, and sometimes it is by common knowledge and not formal introduction.

With brothers I have no problem saying salaam, shake hands and introduce myself, chit-chat etc. But to the opposite gender is when I sometimes think maybe I should be more "open."

I think I speak for many brothers; Muslim conferences/events are one of the toughest places to lower the gaze.

 

[hayat84]

:salam2:
when I said that I'm terrible,it was in a good way,because my shyness is so strong,that nobody of the male gender tries to have an approach with me.in reality,I'm not able to talk in public,but if it happens that someone offenses me,my family and my faith,I become a wolf.I am among the ones who remain in silence and wait the right moment.I only need to wear Niqab,to feel more protected from the sight of humans.that's why I told to be terrible!!my soul is totally submitted to Allah and doesn't allow any other contact with persons who may have the malice in their hearts.

 

[Asja]

Assalamu allaicum wa raahmatullah wa baarkatuhu

Dear brother, as we know that free mixing between man and woman is not allowed in Islaam,and lowing of gaze is comand from Allah to us Muslims, and there is realy beautiful of our religion Islaam Mashalalh. I remember I have red once one ayah where our Prophet Mohammed sallahu alayha wa saalam said that essence of this deen is a hayaah,bashfulness, modesty and in other hadeeh he said where it was Narrated from Abu Huraira: "The Prophet said, "Faith (Belief) consists of more than sixty branches (i.e. parts). And haya (This term "haya" covers a large number of concepts which are to be taken together; amongst them are self respect, modesty, bashfulness, and scruple, etc.) is a part of faith." Sahih Al Bukhari.

This means that shyness is always khair and good for every Muslim Alhamdulillah. If you need to ask something from some sister, than it should be limited only to that what is neccessery to ask, because that would less lead to further conversation or closer meeting. And Allah knows the best.

I am also shy by nature Alhamdulilah,and when I am on my University and some male persone ask me something I only make a move my with head if I need to confirm something or I only answer shortly.

We should never forget the importante of modesty, and not forget that modesty is not limiting us in anyting, but it is only helping us to act in our own nature and is liberting us from doing some haram Astagfirullah.

May Allah guide us all to the right path and be pleased with us on Both worlds. Ameen Ya Rabby.

 

[TheAuthenticBase]

This is from a revert perspective.

I am a naturally shy, introverted person. It's not often that I go out of my way to introduce myself and have a little chit chat, be it men or women. My circle of friends is really small and it often takes a longg time for someone to know me and be around me to be in that circle.

I understand that Islam regulates the relationship between men and women, however strict/lax the interpretations are.

Knowing the rulings and etiquettes, I think it makes it that much tougher to get to know people. At recent events where Muslims work together and meet, I rarely talk to the sisters. But at the same time I see some brothers talk to sisters, or vice versa, but I guess it's because they've known each other for a while. At the few times I talked to the sisters out of necessity, sometimes it ended without knowing each other's names, place of study, or any infos.

In normal Western/non-Muslim culture, it is common to just say hi, introduce yourself, ask for the names of Women, etc. Is it appropriate to do so to Muslim sisters? I thought it would be a little awkward for a brother to approach a sister just to ask for her name and just have a little "Nice to meet you" chat. Because, to be honest, I think we do not just introduce ourselves to someone we don't know if we are not interested at all to her.

What do you think of the topic of men-women friendship?

Here's ur answer bro: http://theauthenticbase.wordpress.com/2010/06/20/victims-of-mixing-true-stories/

In short, AVOID IT!

 

[msmoorad]

Jazakallah ukht samiha,

That is why sometimes I wonder if I am too strict. Indeed the people I see are college age. While I do try to think positive about them, sometimes I think maybe I should get more friends both male and female. In all the times around the MSA I only know the names of few sisters, and sometimes it is by common knowledge and not formal introduction.

With brothers I have no problem saying salaam, shake hands and introduce myself, chit-chat etc. But to the opposite gender is when I sometimes think maybe I should be more "open."

I think I speak for many brothers; Muslim conferences/events are one of the toughest places to lower the gaze.

salaams to all

from what i know, males should not talk to ghair mahram females-ie women that they are allowed to marry, according to Islam
whether other brothers do it or not, does not make it permissible.
you are better off the way you are.
im also shy and single & i also sometimes wonder if i would get married faster if i were not shy & was able to talk n joke with females.
but then how can you justify committing a haraam act and then also expect to have a beneficial result produced?
with regards to mixed gatherings- stay away-irrespective of whether its called an "islamic" event or whatever.
rather stay in the company of the pious, try to find musjids near you where there are good deeni talks taking place with proper arrangements with regards to sisters.
i also reccomend the TJ gatherings. you wont find any intermingling of the sexes there.
where do u live?- let me see if i can find something for u.

its one thing to talk to strange females out of necessity but you have to lower your gaze & dont talk for longer than you need to.
idle chit chat and flirting are totally haraam.

dont worry- insha allah you will get married when Allah ta'ala has decreed.

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah

 

[alf2]

Jazakallah ukht samiha,

That is why sometimes I wonder if I am too strict. Indeed the people I see are college age. While I do try to think positive about them, sometimes I think maybe I should get more friends both male and female. In all the times around the MSA I only know the names of few sisters, and sometimes it is by common knowledge and not formal introduction.

With brothers I have no problem saying salaam, shake hands and introduce myself, chit-chat etc. But to the opposite gender is when I sometimes think maybe I should be more "open."

I think I speak for many brothers; Muslim conferences/events are one of the toughest places to lower the gaze.

But...lowering your gaze is respectful..

I dont know, being more "open" with the opposite sex just leads to problems. I mean yes, not chit-chatting with females is strict BUT Allah swt knows best in this situation. Until you want to get married and are looking for your future wife with a chaperone or Imam or Sheikh - I'd say just stick to being friends with brothers.


Okay now for a small rant about the MSA - -
I really dont like MSA. I have a friend who goes to a University which has MSA and one day we were talking about our weekend plans. Hers were to go to some brother's apartment and watch a Halal movie. It was like 5 women and 7 men...in an apartment. Dimmed lights. But the movie was halal so i guess it was okay to her. LOL...Astaghfirallah.

These are the kinds of scenarios which male + female friendships lead to. Huge fitnah. Just my 2 cents.

 

[alf2]

Here's ur answer bro: http://theauthenticbase.wordpress.com/2010/06/20/victims-of-mixing-true-stories/

In short, AVOID IT!

Aww yes, those "I thought the grass was greener on the other side" stories are indeed sad. And a lot of Kufr say "Oh if they got a divorce there was probably problems in the marriage anyway"

Well yes, there may have been problems. But when you have a problem you dont just give up and move on, you try to SOLVE those problems. Not dump your family for the fake fantasy of the first Tom, Dick or Harry that show attention to you!

Yeah definatley dont mingle if you're married.

 

[helpinghumanity]

Okay now for a small rant about the MSA - -
I really dont like MSA. I have a friend who goes to a University which has MSA and one day we were talking about our weekend plans. Hers were to go to some brother's apartment and watch a Halal movie. It was like 5 women and 7 men...in an apartment. Dimmed lights. But the movie was halal so i guess it was okay to her. LOL...Astaghfirallah.

Assalamo alaikum sister,

Are you generalizing this statement?

 

[helpinghumanity]

Assalamo alaikum sister,

Seems like the opposite side of me...I am pretty social and you are not..HAHA? Tips..umm..Just be yourself....

Start saying "Assalamo alaikum" to the sisters you see....thats the first step of being social....after that friendship will start automatically..

Dont worry if you are white or black or yellow or allien...?
The bond that binds all of us is Islam... and thats what you should be thinking about all the time..

I have a similar issue. I am beyond introvert..I am pretty much anti-social. Any kind of social talking not related to my job makes me so uncomfortable and makes me do things out of nervousness I wont say.

Because of this, I have no idea how to make friends. If anyone would like to give me tips on how to make same gender Muslim friends PLEASE SEND ME A MESSAGE. Because it's not working for me and I'm lonely I mean...I see an Arab Muslimah in Hijab all the time...Do I say, "Salaam, even though I am white as as rice and am not wearing a hijab, I am Muslim too and would like to talk with you." How awkward does that sound!?

I look at the ground when walking or around at trees, bushes, animals. NEVER at people.

 

[bari]

:salam2:

The video is interesting.

 

[alf2]

Assalamo alaikum sister,

Are you generalizing this statement?

Do you mean - am I generalizing all MSA people in example seen above?
Honestly, Im not sure. I guess. But thats ignorant of me because I've never attended a college with a MSA chapter. I've only heard stories that its quite liberal in terms of gender mixing and such.

Assalamo alaikum sister,

Seems like the opposite side of me...I am pretty social and you are not..HAHA? Tips..umm..Just be yourself....

Start saying "Assalamo alaikum" to the sisters you see....thats the first step of being social....after that friendship will start automatically..

Dont worry if you are white or black or yellow or allien...?
The bond that binds all of us is Islam... and thats what you should be thinking about all the time..

Thank you for your advice, jazakallah khair.