Confirmation Please!

Believer1985

Junior Member
:salam2:

I know that the following may have been discussed many a times before, but I dont think I read a bottom line to it anywhere, so I hope that if i post this here somebody will give a proper bottomline answer for everyone's benefit.

OK, so...a while back I was surfing TTI and I saw that somebody said we cannot consume whey powder. As far as I know, whey powder is just milk powder...

I have also noticed for many months now that everyday products contain ingredients such as Spirit vinegar. these products include mayonnaise or ketchup etc...isnt Spirit a type of alcohol?

I dont want be a preacher and declare everything haram, but since we face these measures everyday, I just was hoping someone could clear it up.
Thank you

:wasalam:
 

dianek

Junior Member
I would also like to add Vanilla Extract to that list, as I believe it has alcohol in it as well.....
 

Saifu deen

Alhamdullah..
:salam2:

Haram is opposite of Halal, means unlawful, again it is an Arabic word. Muslims are prohibited to consume Haram food products made from from Haram ingredients. They also based according to Quranic teachings and Sunnah as mentioned in sharia.
  • Haram ingredients from alcohol beverages: Beer, Beer flavor, Rum Flavor, Hard Cider, Beer Batter, Soy Sauce (Naturally brewed), Wine, Pure Alcohol as a Natural Flavor, Vanilla Extract containing alcohol.
  • Haram ingredients from Human body: L-Cysteine from human hair.
  • Haram ingredients from Pig: Bacon, Ham, Gelatin, Enzymes, Marshmallow (pig Gelatin), Vitamins.
  • Grain/plant based ingredients with pig based carrier: Beta carotene (pig Gelatin) and BHA/BHT (pig based carrier).
  • Dairy ingredients made from pork enzymes and culture media: Caseinates, Lactose, Whey.
  • Ingredients made from pork fat: Lard, Mono & diglycerides, Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate, DATEM, Polysorbate 60 or 80.
Reference: http://www.muslimconsumergroup.com/Ingredients.do?menu=Ingredients&eventAction=ingredienttypes

Whey may contain some E-Codes so be aware of it inshallah...

The following E-codes contains pig fat...

PLEASE AVOID IT


E 100, E 110, E 120, E 140, E 141, E 153, E 210, E 213, E 214, E 216, E 234, E 252, E 270, E 280, E 325, E 327, E 334, E 335, E 336, E 337, E 422, E 430, E 431, E 432, E 433, E 434, E 435, E 436, E 440, E 470, E 471, E 472, E 473, E 474, E 475, E 476, E 477, E 478, E 481, E 482, E 483, E 491, E 492, E 493, E 494, E 495, E 542, E 570, E 572, E 631, E 635, E 904, and PERMITTED EMULSIFIER.


The above E-codes can be found in Tooth Paste, Shaving Cream, Chewing Gum, Chocolate Sweets, Biscuits, Corn Flakes, Toffees, Canned food, and Medications like Multi-Vitamins.

Please read the incredients before EATING or USING ANY PRODUCT

Wassalamu Alykom..
 

danial

Junior Member
since when is Lactose and Whey produced from pork enzymes? whey is in almost every powdered milk out there
 

dianek

Junior Member
:salam2:

Haram is opposite of Halal, means unlawful, again it is an Arabic word. Muslims are prohibited to consume Haram food products made from from Haram ingredients. They also based according to Quranic teachings and Sunnah as mentioned in sharia.
  • Haram ingredients from alcohol beverages: Beer, Beer flavor, Rum Flavor, Hard Cider, Beer Batter, Soy Sauce (Naturally brewed), Wine, Pure Alcohol as a Natural Flavor, Vanilla Extract containing alcohol.
  • Haram ingredients from Human body: L-Cysteine from human hair.
  • Haram ingredients from Pig: Bacon, Ham, Gelatin, Enzymes, Marshmallow (pig Gelatin), Vitamins.
  • Grain/plant based ingredients with pig based carrier: Beta carotene (pig Gelatin) and BHA/BHT (pig based carrier).
  • Dairy ingredients made from pork enzymes and culture media: Caseinates, Lactose, Whey.
  • Ingredients made from pork fat: Lard, Mono & diglycerides, Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate, DATEM, Polysorbate 60 or 80.
Reference: http://www.muslimconsumergroup.com/Ingredients.do?menu=Ingredients&eventAction=ingredienttypes

Whey may contain some E-Codes so be aware of it inshallah...

The following E-codes contains pig fat...

PLEASE AVOID IT


E 100, E 110, E 120, E 140, E 141, E 153, E 210, E 213, E 214, E 216, E 234, E 252, E 270, E 280, E 325, E 327, E 334, E 335, E 336, E 337, E 422, E 430, E 431, E 432, E 433, E 434, E 435, E 436, E 440, E 470, E 471, E 472, E 473, E 474, E 475, E 476, E 477, E 478, E 481, E 482, E 483, E 491, E 492, E 493, E 494, E 495, E 542, E 570, E 572, E 631, E 635, E 904, and PERMITTED EMULSIFIER.


The above E-codes can be found in Tooth Paste, Shaving Cream, Chewing Gum, Chocolate Sweets, Biscuits, Corn Flakes, Toffees, Canned food, and Medications like Multi-Vitamins.

Please read the incredients before EATING or USING ANY PRODUCT

Wassalamu Alykom..

Kind of hard to avoid all those products.....have to brush your teeth! There has to be some leniency in there somewhere. Sorry guys, but in Tunis, plenty of chocolate was eaten by the family there and chewing gum etc. I think some of this rather extreme.
 

wantobeMumin

Junior Member
asalamu alykum

i just waned to make a point that i myself being a organic chemistry major has found it hard to believe that all alcohol coumpouds are Haram. For the people who have no back ground in chemistry should know that there are over 10 million organic compound which have been named and found by chemist. now alcohol is a functional group (- OH) and if its present in any compound then its is an alcohol and have some name like methanol, ethanol etc. Now are all these compounds haram? do each and every one induce drunkeness if consumes? i would more likely say no because millions of things which we use or handle who have some sort of chemical composition which has (OH) functional group.out body wash, perfumes,hand wipes,plastics, and list can go on... Even our own body makes alcoholic compounds!
So what shoud we do? I would say do what our scholars have suggested. the more obvious alcohol which is for consumption is haram for sure.
jazakalla kahir (If i said anything wrong its only due to my ignorance)
 

danial

Junior Member
Alcohol is onli haram if its amts is able to intoxicate us. thats why coca cola is not haram although it contains trace amounts of alcohol. and wantobeMumin, i totally understand ur chemistry technical terms as i take organic chem too.haha
 

muharram23

New Member
Staff member
Gelatin is Halaal - Please Read!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As-Salaamu Alaykum wa Rahmatullah everyone,

My dear brothers and sisters, I see there is a lot of confusion has arisen around the subject of what is considered Halaal and what is considered Haraam when it comes to food and have taken the time to shed some light on the subject.

Unfortunately many Muslims commit dhulm (oppression) against themselves by labeling certain foods ‘haraam’ while they are actually halaal and perfectly permissible to eat.

The fact of the matter is: Gelatin is Halaal.

You may be asking "how could he say this when gelatin has come from a pig?"

Please take the time to read the following article which has been based on a lesson given by Shaykh Muhammad Bazmool, and a fatwa given by Shaykh Al-Albaanee. InshaAllah this will clear up any misconceptions on the issue. The proof is given below.

Gelatin: Halaal or Haraam?
http://calltoislam.com/index.php?opt...=299&Itemid=42

Istihala is when something becomes pure. It was najis (impure) but it is now taahir (pure). A good example would be maitah (animal carcass): it is najis, but should it be burned and become ashes, or decompose and become earth, then it is taahir, it is no longer najis. This can happen with dung or faeces or whatever. Whenever something changes from one property to another, then the ruling likewise changes.

Example: Let us say that someone uses the fat of a dead animal to make soap. That fat is najis, but the chemical change that it was put through makes it taahir.

Ibn Hazm put it concisely when he said,

"Ruling upon an object is upon what it is named (what it is), if the name (what it is) changes then so does the ruling."

He also mentioned in his book of fiqh, Al-Muhalla: "If the quality of the substance of naturally impure objects changes the name which was given to it so that it is no more applicable to it and it is given a new name which is given to a pure object, so it is no more an impure thing. It becomes a new object, with a new rule."

Meaning that if the natural composition of a substance changes to another substance of a different composition, so much so that you can no longer call the new substance by the name of what it was -- ruling upon that substance changes too.

Proof/Example 1:
The companions (Radiya ‘Llahu 'anhum) used to eat a cheese that came from the land of the disbelievers. In that cheese was a part of the calf which was slaughtered by the disbelievers in a way that is not in accordance with Islaam. The companions knew this, but they also knew that the prohibition was upon the calf, what is directly from the calf, and what could be properly called part of the calf; the ruling is not upon that which you cannot identify as part of the calf nor is it called any longer such-and-such part of the calf. This is called istihala.

Proof/Example 2:
Another proof from the Sunnah: The Prophet (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) forbade making vinegar out of wine, but he said that if you should come across vinegar that has been made from wine then it is halaal.

Why?

The ruling is upon what the object is, and not what it was. Wine is haraam; vinegar is not, and before the wine became an intoxicant, it was halaal. Why? Because it was fruit before that.

Proof/Example 3:
Allaah says in the Qur'an:


"And surely there is a lesson for you in the cattle we give you to drink of what is in their bellies from between the faeces and blood, pure milk, wholesome to those who drink it." (16:66)


Allaah is putting forth an example for us of how something pure can come from
something impure.

And we can also use as proof something that we've already gone over. The Prophet (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) said that when the hide of maitah (the carrion) is tanned, then it is taahir. He (sallallahu 'alayhi wa sallam) gave us a method to purify something which was first impure.

Let us examine things we are familiar with: mono and diglycerides, whey, gluten, emulsifiers, gelatin, and whatever else is on the international haraam list. These by-products sometimes come from animals, pigs even, in which case the ruling on the initial substances is that they are haraam. But the initial substances (e.g. fat, marrow, cartilage, etc.) are put through chemical change so that you no longer can even call it "pig fat" or "animal bone" or "skin" or "cartilage", etc. because it is no longer that, hence it is taahir, it is halaal.

What is gelatin? The Oxford dictionary of science defines it as: "A colorless or pale yellow, water-soluble protein obtained by boiling collagen with water and evaporating the solution. It melts when water is added and dissolves in hot water to form a solution that sets to a gel on cooling." (page 290)

Is this a chemical change or is this not a chemical change? Is it protein any longer? No, it is not.

You are in disbelief so you ask, "But how can it be halaal when it came from something haraam?"

Because of the proofs mentioned above, the ruling is not based upon what it was, the ruling is based upon what it is. A Hanafi scholar, Ibn Abedin gave the example: "the swine which drowns in a salt lake and decomposes and becomes salt itself, is now halaal."

And other Hanafi scholars go on to say: "salt is different from meat and bones. If they become salt, they are salt."

To take the salt example further: salt consists of sodium chloride (NaCl) when together they are the halaal food known as salt, when separated they make up two poisonous substances which are then haraam for consumption.

The ahnaaf (Hanafis) also use as an example the human semen, saying that it is najis, then when it inseminates the egg and becomes a blood clot it is still najis, but when it becomes flesh it is no longer najis. And the ahnaaf are not the only ones who take this position.

The examples are numerous and they extend beyond food: Yesterday a man was kaafir and going towards Hell, today he is Muslim, so what is the ruling upon him? It is based upon what he is today. We must be careful when we call things haraam because it is a form of dhulm (oppression). Scholars have said that it is worse that you make something halaal to haraam rather than making something haraam to halaal.

This deen Allaah has made yusr (easy) let us not make it 'usr (hard).

And Allaah (Subhanahu wa ta'ala) Knows Best.
 

Abdullah_77

Junior Member
yes... i know jello is haraam and accept that...
but i cant take it when u guys make haraam everything... like know these brothers are saying ketchup may be haraam

give me a break
 

Saifu deen

Alhamdullah..
This deen Allaah has made yusr (easy) let us not make it 'usr (hard).

And Allaah (Subhanahu wa ta'ala) Knows Best.

:salam2:

How are you brother?.. Jazaka Allahu Khair...

May be you can share with us the article which you've sent me via email inshallah, titled '' ARE WE EATING PORK''.. I have used some of that article in this thread, but please post it if you can..

Alhamdullah I have benefited from it, and inshallah it will benefit everyone as well...

Baraka Allahu feek..

''Why we dont see it as another way of pleasing Allah (swt), by refraining of the things that can be Haram..''. Yes I agree with ''danial'', without being paraniod..

Wassalamu Alykom..
 

UmmOf3

Junior Member
Salaam aleikum

Many of those E-numbers listed, are often vegetarian. Especially 471 and 472! So instead of avoiding something, call the manufactorer.
 

Masria

Junior Member
I am just eating an egg and ketchup sandwich, I wonder how long it will take for me to get drunk?

Do people really feel the need to take things this far? I wonder if there are any E numbers in water these days considering the amount of additives they put in?
 

Saifu deen

Alhamdullah..
I am just eating an egg and ketchup sandwich, I wonder how long it will take for me to get drunk?

Do people really feel the need to take things this far? I wonder if there are any E numbers in water these days considering the amount of additives they put in?

:salam2:

The information I have provided was from a muslim organisation in UK, I believe. Inshallah brother Muharram can share the full details of it inshallah.

I believe we should share knowledge with brothers and sisters and if the information which I have provided includeded false information, then provide your evidence and knowledge about it so that we can benefit and learn inshallah.

My aim was to benefit the brothers and sisters, and not to misguide others with false information. If someone trying to benefit me with anything then I would kindly say ''jazaku Allahu Khayran'', and if the information provided is wrong then I would also say ''Jazaka Allahu Khayran for your effort to benefit me''...

Wassalamu Alykom..
 

Masria

Junior Member
The information I have provided was from a muslim organisation in UK, I believe.

I was not suggesting that the information was not correct but I fail to see the relevance of alcohol in ketchup. The prohabition against alcohol is to stop intoxication and how can you become intoxicated by ketchup?
 

Believer1985

Junior Member
yes... i know jello is haraam and accept that...
but i cant take it when u guys make haraam everything... like know these brothers are saying ketchup may be haraam

give me a break

Dear brother,

Had you read my post more clearly, you wouldve seen that I clearly stated I didnt want to be a preacher and declare everything haram, hence the topic title "CONFIRMATION Please."

Ketchup and mayonnaise both contain Spirit Vinegar. The question posed here is: are we allowed to consume Spirit vinegar as I was once informed Spirit was a type of alcohol.
:wasalam:
 

Believer1985

Junior Member
I was watching Islam Channel once and someone sent in a question about E numbers. The scholar said "These E numbers are of a tiny quantity." stating we were allowed them...

And no, you cant get drunk on sandwiches but it STILL CONTAINS the alcohol. Most sandwiches in supermakets (esp Marks and Spencer) contain White Wine Vinegar and many pasta pots contain either Cider of Spirit vinegar...
 

Saifu deen

Alhamdullah..
I was watching Islam Channel once and someone sent in a question about E numbers. The scholar said "These E numbers are of a tiny quantity." stating we were allowed them...

.

:salam2:

Jazaka Allahu Khaiyran. So I can use products that contain those E coded without any restriction!!.

Inshallah you can provide us with the fatwa if you can.. Baraka Allahu feek.

Wassalamu Alykom..
 
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