I have a million questions about Isis

HirraJaved

Junior Member
Like I know it's Sunni Muslims and their killing all the other sects so that they can make a Khilafah, but where do they get their justification from? What verses in the Quran? And I just want to know what most of you think about them I for one am against them cause their killing innocent people and what's their rush?! They should be patient because the khilafah will be reastablished by Imam Mahdi but really I just want to know what verses they use to justify what their doing and also can anyone tell me about all of the different sects in Islam I really want to know, I know Sunni is the right one but I still want to know about the others esspecially Shia tell me about shia and their beliefs and how can I prove to someone that Ali radi allahu anhu wasn't the first caliph but that Abu Bakr radi allahu anhu was the first
 

MehmetHilmi

Junior Member
Selamun Aleykum

Wow. You are very curious. But rightfully so.

ISIS gains support from sheep. People who have been taught to accept everything from the "scholars" without any question. These are people who refuse to use their aql (mind) and they literally worship the "scholars".

I'm sure they use the sayings of some classical scholars to justify themselves. Killing large amounts of people by Qisas, burning people, keeping sex slaves isn't something foreign to Islam. Various scholars have agreed with these methods. You'll be surprised at how much these things were condoned by some "scholars" of the past.

Some of their justification is from verses of the Quran taken out of context. Also different translations of the Quran have different words because everyone translates Arabic differently. This can sometimes make a huge difference in the message.

The key here is to use logic. If something sounds crazy to you, do not accept it. If something is against the Quran, do not accept it. If something is against the Ijma, do not accept it. Question everything.

Allah gave us a mind to think. If we do not think and become sheep for one man, aren't we disrespecting Allah?

Khalifa will come when Allah wills. But we Muslims should at least have an economic union. Don't hope for too much with the current situation of disunity though.

There have always been different sects in Islam. Right from the Death of the Prophet (SAW), there was a big split and even wars.
 

a_stranger

Junior Member
I like to add that when we study Quran and Sunna we find that the essence of Islam is mostly built on love , mercy and good will towards all the creation. Ignoring this essential part of Islam causes misunderstanding and wrong doings.
We need to do a great purification(tazkia) within ourselves to be good Muslims ( following the steps of our prophet salla Allah alaihi wa sallam, and Sahaba ), this means a great deal of patience , forgiveness, calmness, good conduct.
 

mezeren

Junior Member
ISIS is one of the many organisations which was founded, trained and supported by western intelligence in order to exploit resources of muslim world. its job is to divide muslims and make islam look like a barbaric religion. What they do are against true islam but not Sunni or Shia islam. Do not forget sister that there is only one original islam, the rest are deviations from it.

You can not find any verse from Quran to back what they do to war captives. But you can easily find justifications for their barbaric actions in Sunni or Shia islam.

"Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly(5421) with them: for Allah loveth those who are just. "
"Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong."
(Quran,60; 8/9)

So, it is duty of muslims to defend their land when attacked. But, how muslims behave in a war situation?

Therefore, when ye meet(4820) the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks; At length, when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond(4821) firmly (on them): thereafter (is the time for) either generosity or ransom:(4822) Until the war lays down its burdens. Thus (are ye commanded): but if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you,(4823) some with others. But those who are slain(4824) in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost.(Quran,47;4)

Until muslims are victorious they do nat take war captives, after they are victorious muslims can capture the enemy (not as a slave or concubines). What to do next is to free them with or without ransom. So, there is no excuse for slavery or raping woman in the name of islam.

Also, sister, there is no Mahdi in real islam, that belief came from other religions via fabricated narrations. Do not wait for one.

And, both Sunni and Shia are wrong to attempt to rank companions of Rasullullah, saying Abu Bakr or Ali will have a higher position in afterlife. Nobody knows that but Allah. it is none of our bussiness. The word "caliph" was not used by first four companions. They used the term "Amir al-Mumineen". it is a political position, not a divine one.
 

a_stranger

Junior Member
Imam Ahmad reported in his Musnad from the Hadith of Mu`adh (may Allah be pleased with him) that he asked the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) about the best of faith. He (the Messenger) said: Which faith is excellent? He replied: That you love (any person or thing) for the sake of Allah, hate for the sake of Allah, and that you keep your tongue busy in the remembrance of Allah. He said: Allah’s Messenger, is there anything besides this? He said: You like for the people what you like for yourself, and you dislike for them what you dislike, and you either say good or keep silent."

Please think about it : to have perfect faith ( as our prophet salla Allah alaihi wa sallam taught is : (( You like for the people what you like for yourself, and you dislike for them what you dislike, ))

So the starting point to perfect our faith is to make good will towards all people ( please concentrate all people which are creators of Allah ) , and we correct what is within our hearts to love for them what we love for ourselves. If we study the life of our prophet salla Allah alaihi wa sallam we find this meaning very clear .......he did his best to teach humanity values of happiness and peace, ( then Jana) and warn them against evils within and outside human soul ( then fire Allah forbid). This good pure intention is our way to be closer to Allah subhanahu wa taaala and Jana.
And Allah knows best.
 

saif

Junior Member
Assalamu alaikum

I am amazed by the quality of responses on this thread. I agree with almost everything, what has been said. The only thing disturbing me is brother mezeren's attempt to give some blame to the western powers. While I am fully aware, that they do almost everything for their interests, I think in this particular case, we should remain focused on the our own misinterpretations and misconceptions about Islam. This whole bunch of thugs is certainly not doing those barbaric acts to serve their western masters but they are doing all that , because they think this is the correct Islam. For me, the most important question is, why is it, that the organizations like ISIS or Boko Haraam can always find enough people, who can give their lives to support their cause.

If the prevailing interpretation of Islam was all that rosy, we wouldn't have lost our glory. What we need to understand is, that the critical thinking is the key to eliminate misinterpretations and the blind adherence of the "great scholars" is the reason of all these impurities we had added to the pure message of Islam. Instead of reforming our understanding of Islam, most of the scholars teach the muslim masses, that they are not acting upon Islam in as good spirite as our ancestors did. The result is, that people are getting more and more fanatic on their misunderstandings and they believe, the glorious times will get back to them that way.

I just hope, muslims will one day realize that.

Wassalamu alaikum
 

zaman-gm

Junior Member
Islam And Muslim. This is the focal of everything.
I just say
"أعوذ بالله من الشيطان الرجيم"
"مِن شَرِّ الْوَسْوَاسِ الْخَنَّاسِ "
"O Allah"guide us on the right path you love."
 

sister herb

Official TTI Chef
ISIS is one of the many organisations which was founded, trained and supported by western intelligence in order to exploit resources of muslim world. its job is to divide muslims and make islam look like a barbaric religion.

Unfortunately this is one of the most common way how its usually tried to explain the exist of kind of organizations. Unfortunately it doesn´t tell the truth at all. I have read before that the western intelligence (and zionists too of course) have created many groups and organizations like al-Qaeda or Talibans.

Sometime, we just should look the mirror and think what´s wrong with the islamic-majority countries where kind of groups comes from. Why certain people just can´t resolve their problem more islamic ways but they see the only way out as attacking against others and spreading the hate and violence.
 

sister herb

Official TTI Chef
Like I know it's Sunni Muslims and their killing all the other sects

Wrong. They kill people from all sects, not only from other sects. I hardly can see that their actions have anything to do with Sunni Islam neither Islam in general. Their reasons to kill are yearning of power and fanaticims. I would compare them to the Crusaders, whose of their own minds fighted for the pure Christianity but their acts were against the basic message of the Christianity as they didn´t hesitate to kill everyone whose came to their way - also their fellow Christians.
 

saif

Junior Member
Imam Ahmad reported in his Musnad from the Hadith of Mu`adh (may Allah be pleased with him) that he asked the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) about the best of faith. He (the Messenger) said: Which faith is excellent? He replied: That you love (any person or thing) for the sake of Allah, hate for the sake of Allah, and that you keep your tongue busy in the remembrance of Allah. He said: Allah’s Messenger, is there anything besides this? He said: You like for the people what you like for yourself, and you dislike for them what you dislike, and you either say good or keep silent."

Please think about it : to have perfect faith ( as our prophet salla Allah alaihi wa sallam taught is : (( You like for the people what you like for yourself, and you dislike for them what you dislike, ))

So the starting point to perfect our faith is to make good will towards all people ( please concentrate all people which are creators of Allah ) , and we correct what is within our hearts to love for them what we love for ourselves. If we study the life of our prophet salla Allah alaihi wa sallam we find this meaning very clear .......he did his best to teach humanity values of happiness and peace, ( then Jana) and warn them against evils within and outside human soul ( then fire Allah forbid). This good pure intention is our way to be closer to Allah subhanahu wa taaala and Jana.
And Allah knows best.

Assalamu alaikum dear sister

For people like you and me, the things are just as simple as you have described. However, these general messages of khayr towards everyone need to get more particular. Otherwise, they pose no challenge to the extremists' ideology. When ISIS kills nusayris and shias, they do it according to the fatwas of somebody as eminent as Imam Ibn Taymiyyah. The general calls of khayr, like the one in your post, are no hurdle to them because they think they are doing good to them and to the whole muslim ummah by killing them.

As a matter of principle I do agree. These calls of khayr should be enough for us. Unfortunately, they are not.

Since I am a believing muslim myself, the following words of the famour physicist Steven Weinberg bite me like a snake:

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

How I wish he was wrong. How I wish he was wrong.

Wassalamu alaikum
 

mezeren

Junior Member
Assalamu alaikum

I am amazed by the quality of responses on this thread. I agree with almost everything, what has been said. The only thing disturbing me is brother mezeren's attempt to give some blame to the western powers. While I am fully aware, that they do almost everything for their interests, I think in this particular case, we should remain focused on the our own misinterpretations and misconceptions about Islam. This whole bunch of thugs is certainly not doing those barbaric acts to serve their western masters but they are doing all that , because they think this is the correct Islam. For me, the most important question is, why is it, that the organizations like ISIS or Boko Haraam can always find enough people, who can give their lives to support their cause.

I just hope, muslims will one day realize that.

Wassalamu alaikum


Brother, my attempt was to state a fact. it always works like this. Off course, the evil west has their own reponsibilities, and that does not take away muslims' responsibility for being stupid or ignorant.

What we need to understand is, that the critical thinking is the key to eliminate misinterpretations and the blind adherence of the "great scholars" is the reason of all these impurities we had added to the pure message of Islam.

And, that statement of yours was the core of my post. Muslims must stop taking their scholars as their lords besides Allah, like Jews and Christians.

Quran9;31. They (Jews and Christians) took their rabbis and their monks to be their lords besides Allah (by obeying them in things which they made lawful or unlawful according to their own desires without being ordered by Allah), and (they also took as their Lord) Messiah, son of Maryam (Mary), while they (Jews and Christians) were commanded [in the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)) to worship none but One Ilah (God - Allah) La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He). Praise and glory be to Him, (far above is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him)."
 

cabdixakim

Junior Member
Wacaleykumas'salaam waraxmatul'Lahi wabarakatuh.

Who worships the scholars? Who are the scholars? Should we be without need of scholars? When we say Quran and Sunnah,who among us can derive any rule from them? What will be the case of the people without scholars when Allah clearly says that some verses' deep meaning is only known to those who have in depth knowledge?

I never wish to see such blemish comments on men who died centuries ago,that so after they stayed nights awake just for one little explanation for the benefit of those who were with them and those to come,men who not only preserved Allah's religion with their gifted brains but also took swords to defend it.... Because when you say people blind follow scholars,doesn't that mean scholars planned to mislead people that anyone who blind follows them is doomed? Such a comment_this happens because people blind follow a scholar_ is accusation to the scholar himself.

ISIS and such organizations get so much recruits because people feel so much subjugated that such a movement always serves freedom and liberty to them. It's a simple psychological phenomenon.

Otherwise,when was the first time we ever heard of Sheikh Ibn Taymiyyah(may Allah have mercy upon him)? I bet none among us knew him in his/her childhood life let alone adhering to his fatwas...that's how people are little exposed to the scholars you take as blameworthy.
Do you then think those who join ISIS read a verse of Quran or a tarjumah of a Sheikh in order to do so? Those you've seen publicizing their allegiance to ISIS,claiming they did so because their knowledge of religion compels them to do,do you think those make up the mass of recruits?

People always had differences with a scholar and non-scholar alike but I've never seen the scholars' mistakes_if there any_being so much sought after!

Subxanah'Lah! Region is not based according to logic rather logic is always subjective to whatever is there of text. A times when the text isn't there but then who's allowed to use logic?
Indeed the religion is always in accordance with our simple reasoning and that we need reasoning to understand the meaning but that doesn't mean we use our logic as a determiner!

May the blessing and mercy of Allah be upon the last of His prophets,Muxammad,his family,his rightly-guided successors and those that followed them and those that followed them and all those who follow them in Ihsan until the day of judgement...aamiin
 

a_stranger

Junior Member
Assalamu alaikum dear sister

For people like you and me, the things are just as simple as you have described. However, these general messages of khayr towards everyone need to get more particular. Otherwise, they pose no challenge to the extremists' ideology. When ISIS kills nusayris and shias, they do it according to the fatwas of somebody as eminent as Imam Ibn Taymiyyah. The general calls of khayr, like the one in your post, are no hurdle to them because they think they are doing good to them and to the whole muslim ummah by killing them.

As a matter of principle I do agree. These calls of khayr should be enough for us. Unfortunately, they are not.

Since I am a believing muslim myself, the following words of the famour physicist Steven Weinberg bite me like a snake:

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

How I wish he was wrong. How I wish he was wrong.

Wassalamu alaikum

Assalamu alaikim wa rahmatu Allah wa barakatu

(((How I wish he was wrong. How I wish he was wrong.)))

I believe we (Muslims ) can show that he was wrong if we learn Islam , and try to understand the true spirit of Islam which is mainly love, mercy and patience , if we fight our own selves and Shaytan , if we pray to Allah with love and humility . I believe that Islam ( Quran and Sunna ) can lift humanity to a very high level and correct it's deviations no other religion or theology can do. It is our responsibility ( each individual simple Muslim) to tell the world the truth of Islam by his/her conduct.
Wa alaikim alsalam
 

mezeren

Junior Member
Wacaleykumas'salaam waraxmatul'Lahi wabarakatuh.

Who worships the scholars? Who are the scholars? Should we be without need of scholars? When we say Quran and Sunnah,who among us can derive any rule from them? What will be the case of the people without scholars when Allah clearly says that some verses' deep meaning is only known to those who have in depth knowledge?

I never wish to see such blemish comments on men who died centuries ago,that so after they stayed nights awake just for one little explanation for the benefit of those who were with them and those to come,men who not only preserved Allah's religion with their gifted brains but also took swords to defend it.... Because when you say people blind follow scholars,doesn't that mean scholars planned to mislead people that anyone who blind follows them is doomed? Such a comment_this happens because people blind follow a scholar_ is accusation to the scholar himself.

ISIS and such organizations get so much recruits because people feel so much subjugated that such a movement always serves freedom and liberty to them. It's a simple psychological phenomenon.

Otherwise,when was the first time we ever heard of Sheikh Ibn Taymiyyah(may Allah have mercy upon him)? I bet none among us knew him in his/her childhood life let alone adhering to his fatwas...that's how people are little exposed to the scholars you take as blameworthy.
Do you then think those who join ISIS read a verse of Quran or a tarjumah of a Sheikh in order to do so? Those you've seen publicizing their allegiance to ISIS,claiming they did so because their knowledge of religion compels them to do,do you think those make up the mass of recruits?

People always had differences with a scholar and non-scholar alike but I've never seen the scholars' mistakes_if there any_being so much sought after!

Subxanah'Lah! Region is not based according to logic rather logic is always subjective to whatever is there of text. A times when the text isn't there but then who's allowed to use logic?
Indeed the religion is always in accordance with our simple reasoning and that we need reasoning to understand the meaning but that doesn't mean we use our logic as a determiner!

May the blessing and mercy of Allah be upon the last of His prophets,Muxammad,his family,his rightly-guided successors and those that followed them and those that followed them and all those who follow them in Ihsan until the day of judgement...aamiin


Assalamu Alaykum Brother,

Anyone who follows a scholar without questioning, who believes in everything they say as the truth and accepts their books as sound as Qur'an is worshipping their scholars. if one, for example, believes that the books of Bukhari and Muslim has no mistakes in them like Qur'an then he/she is taking those scholars as their Lord.

There are lots of examples in those books that contradics Quran, sciense, historical events,fitrah and even the narrations on the same matter could contradict each other. When one say "Rasulullah(a.s.) engaged Aisha(r.a.) at 6, married her at 9 " because that is what was written in Bukhari", they give those books a status equal to Qur'an. You know it is wrong deep down in your hearth but you start producing exceuses because you dare to critic Saheeh Bukhari. it is against Qur'an, it is against fitrah. What happened to the consent of the girl for the marriage? Who could have the right mind at the age of 6 to make a sound decision?

Below is an excerpt from a site ; http://www.islamandquran.org/?p=2859

There was a notion as “marriageable age” in the language of Arabic people. This notion stated the children who were in both of the age of puberty and age of majority. The Glorified Allah commands:

“Test the orphans (in their abilities) until they reach marriageable age. Then if you perceive in them sound judgement, release their property to them. (An-Nisa/Women 4:6)

Brother, we all need to learn from scholars. i am not talking about me reading the translation of the Qur'an and giving fatvas. No, everyone needs a teacher when learning. Here is my method; if i want to form my opinion on a particular matter, such as, let's say, intercession, i try to read conflicting opinions of different scholars, see their proofs, which must be formed around Qur'an and could be supported by sunnah that is in line with the Qur-an, learn the scholars refutation of each others, after all that i try to make my mind without any prejudice by using my intellect Allah has given me and on the fitrah He has created me. Even after i have reached a conclusion, i am open to change my mind if i see another scholarly opinion that i am not aware of before, i am open to review my belief on the matter.
 

saif

Junior Member
Assalamu alaikim wa rahmatu Allah wa barakatu

(((How I wish he was wrong. How I wish he was wrong.)))

I believe we (Muslims ) can show that he was wrong if we learn Islam , and try to understand the true spirit of Islam which is mainly love, mercy and patience , if we fight our own selves and Shaytan , if we pray to Allah with love and humility . I believe that Islam ( Quran and Sunna ) can lift humanity to a very high level and correct it's deviations no other religion or theology can do. It is our responsibility ( each individual simple Muslim) to tell the world the truth of Islam by his/her conduct.
Wa alaikim alsalam

Assalamu alaikum,
InshaAllah. Why not? Islam is a mercy to mankind.
Wassalamu alaikum.
 

saif

Junior Member
Assalamu alaikum brother Abdihakim

Wacaleykumas'salaam waraxmatul'Lahi wabarakatuh.

Who worships the scholars? Who are the scholars? Should we be without need of scholars? When we say Quran and Sunnah,who among us can derive any rule from them? What will be the case of the people without scholars when Allah clearly says that some verses' deep meaning is only known to those who have in depth knowledge?

I think we have had this discussion before. Nobody is trying to undermine the role of the scholars. We wouldn't have been able to understand the basic sources of Islam without their help. We thankfully accept their help in understanding the basic sources. Not less and not more than that. Anything more than that is the start of scholar-worship. You don't see it happening? Indeed this concept is subtle but very important. You know, the jews also reacted strangely on Quran's comment on them, that they were doing scholar-worship.

I never wish to see such blemish comments on men who died centuries ago,that so after they stayed nights awake just for one little explanation for the benefit of those who were with them and those to come,men who not only preserved Allah's religion with their gifted brains but also took swords to defend it.... Because when you say people blind follow scholars,doesn't that mean scholars planned to mislead people that anyone who blind follows them is doomed? Such a comment_this happens because people blind follow a scholar_ is accusation to the scholar himself.

Again it is your own interpolation. Why would we blame Jesus Christ, if his followers started worshipping him? May Allah reward the scholars for their contributions. Considering one or the other verdict from a scholar of the past to be wrong is not being blemish on him. This is because all human beings are fellible. Let me lend words from Abu Bakar (ra) and allow me to mould them for my own cause:

“O People! If you worshipped Bukhari and Ibn Taymiyyah, then know that they were fellible. But if it is Allah (The One God) you Worshiped, then know that He is the Wise, All-Aware and Infellible”

ISIS and such organizations get so much recruits because people feel so much subjugated that such a movement always serves freedom and liberty to them. It's a simple psychological phenomenon.

This might be true, although I have my reservations accepting it. I don't see ISIS and such organizations offering anything near freedom and liberty. There are many oppressed muslim peoples in the world and not all of them are joining them. But only people from a certain sectarian tilt are choosing to join them. We all know, they are only unsatisfied hardline elements of Salafiyyah. The same people, who once followed Faisal bin Sultan al-Duwaish and later Juhaiman al Otaibi and organized a baghaawah against the saudi royals of their time. The faces are different now but the mentality is the same.

Or do you see Sufis of the sub-continent, Shias of arabian peninsula or hanafi turks joining them in big numbers?

Do you then think those who join ISIS read a verse of Quran or a tarjumah of a Sheikh in order to do so? Those you've seen publicizing their allegiance to ISIS,claiming they did so because their knowledge of religion compels them to do,do you think those make up the mass of recruits?

Like always, not everybody joining them understands their theory in all details. But a certain sectarian tilt is always present in them and that is undeniable.

Subxanah'Lah! Region is not based according to logic rather logic is always subjective to whatever is there of text. A times when the text isn't there but then who's allowed to use logic?
Indeed the religion is always in accordance with our simple reasoning and that we need reasoning to understand the meaning but that doesn't mean we use our logic as a determiner!
Subxanah'Lah! you keep on repeating the same thing, although we have had it before. Nobody is saying, you don't need a "nas". But when several interpretation from scholars are available for the same "nas", you need to use your rational thinking to choose the best one. Turning it off in the favour of a bigger name and choosing that opinion over a smaller name, may get you indulge in the scholar worship. What else is scholar worship then? Will you accept that only, when the muslims will start worshipping the idols of their scholars, like hindus do? No, it is not going to happen.

May the blessing and mercy of Allah be upon the last of His prophets,Muxammad,his family,his rightly-guided successors and those that followed them and those that followed them and all those who follow them in Ihsan until the day of judgement...aamiin

Aamiin.

Wassalamu alaikum.
 
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