Non muslim is asking question i need urgent rply

[amna_muslimaa]

:salam2:
I need an urgent answer Please ...a non muslim brother is asking me this question please can any one help me
Thats what i said :
)))))As you have read the holy quran then it will be more easy for you to tell me in which verse does it says that kill womens if they dont wear hijabs and if they dont marry (forced marraige) this is not the fault of islam get it this is fault of this stupid men who killed daughter Islam hates and is against force ....
walaikumsalam
And the brother answered:
))))please tell me. islam is not against force, please stop lying. go read 4:34 please. and when your own prophet married a 6 year old and had sex with her at 9, and men do it all the time in muslim countries today because of that, it is islam's fault. just stop lying, both to me and yourself. your religion is backwards, that's why so many leave and come to the west. we don't want that garbage here
I need an urgent reply......
walaikumsalam

 

[Basicofislam]

:salam2: sister what your friend said is surah nisaa ayah 34. and there is absolutly no mention of killing in that surah. And this person who has told you that is very ill informed. And in islam you cant force anybody to marry. The women have right to choose. It is more culture then religion what they are talking about.You have touched a sensitive question that has been elaborately taken up by the learned theologians and scholars since long. We will not add to that and let the people follow whatever view they consider carries more weight. What however, we feel to suggest (as our personal opinion) is that there is no specific order about the child marriage in Islam. It is not mandatory for the Ummah, and the issue left is open to the stages of social advancement and situations. If a society feels that in the current day sociological setting, marriage below a certain age is not required, it may go for that.

But let us make a note of warning too. The issue of child marriage has come via West and is part of a whole “package” that intends to dismantle Islam as a social code and state philosophy. Try to look at the components in that whole context. Let me give you a few tips: “child marriage”, “gender equality”, “women empowerment”, “sex education”, “reproductive control”, “contraception”, sustainable growth” – are among the few terms used in the gender context. Can you please tell me that you know enough about this “UN sponsored shari'ah”, that is being thrust as alternative to the Shariah of Islam? If you are not well aware, then kindly be careful about pushing too hard even some seemingly “reasonable” issues like child marriage. The real intention (seems) not to stop this practice today (which is more a Hindu issue), but lead to the erroneous conclusion that Islam permitted a “wrong” thing. Afterall this subject has been of special interest for them for the last thousand years or more. Why do you forget that the central theme of the filthy books like “Rangeela Rasool” and the “Satanic Verses” has been this so-called child-marriage.


As far as Ayesha RA is concerened.There are different reports and traditions regarding Ummu-ul-Mo'mineen Aisha's age when she was betrothed. What every one agrees to is that while the promise/nikah happened in Makkah, she was delivered to the house of the Prophet (s.a.w.) (meaning her 'Rukhsati') about four years later in Medina. Thus even according to the age you have quoted, she was about 11 years old when she entered the Prophet's haram in Madina. Some believe that she was above 13; some others reports say much older (17,19). The generally quoted age is 9 years.

In fact, Islam has imposed no restriction on the age of marriage, and certainly it has not ordered the young age marriages as well. What, of course, is obligatory is that a girl cannot be given in marriage without her consent, although the marriage has to be arranged by her 'wali'. An adolescent given in marriage has the right to break the contract at puberty.

the issue you raised - or the like, which attempt to question the seerah, and behaviour of the Prophet of Islam (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) makes me sad, and I find it hard to discuss. Why, because, as a Muslim, I have accepted it first and foremost that Muhammad (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) was the prophet of Allah and never said or did anything without clear Divine sanction and permission - Ma yantiqo anil hawa'; in huwa illa' wahyun yooha' - al-Qur'an - that: he (the Prophet) never said (or did) anything of his own liking, but what was revealed to him. That being the position I never dare to question what the Prophet did and why. I wished you had avoided this marriage or age question related to the beloved wife of the Prophet (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) who, according to Ha'kim (Mustadarak) was shown to him in his dream by an angel saying: A'isha is your wife. This means the marriage was ordained by Allah Himself.

Having said the above, let me give you in sufficient detail how the marriage of Ai'sha (the Mother of the Faithful) was conducted. To begin with let me first caution how over the centuries, the narrow-minded malicious bigots made the Prophet's married life their most favoured target subject. They overlooked all the ground realities, the urgency and necessities and made the age or number of wives of the Prophet their central point of interest. We need to remember that when the adversary feels defeated on all fronts, the last resort is the area of character-assassination. That is what the hypocrites (Abdullah bin Ubai) and the Jewish clergy initiated right during the life time of the Prophet, and their friends continued it todate.

I feel sick, but let me quote a few so that you understand the seriousness of the subject:

(1) Philip Schaff states in the History of the Christian Church: Muhammad was a slave of sensual passion. The motive of his excess in polygamy were his sensuality which grew with his years, and his desire for male offspring.

(2) Gibbon writes in his Decline and Fall of Roman Empire: In his private conduct Mohammad indulged the appetites of a men and abused the claims of a Prophet.

(3) Gustav Weil writes in his History of the Islamic Peoples: Muhammad's harem occupies a conspicuous place in the Qur'an... It shows how easily the Prophet, in matters sensual, was carried away by his passions.

(4) Will Durant states in his Age of Faith: Women and power were his only indulgences.

(5) Nabia Abbot states in her work A'ishah the Beloved of Muhammad: Muhammed, the prayerful and perfumed prophet of Islam was avowedly a great lover of ladies.

For refutation of these wild allegations of sensuality leveled against the Holy Prophet we can do no better than quote the considered views of various other Western scholars who are not carried off their feet by prejudice and bias. We also quote the views of certain otherwise bigoted writers, who could not help but admit the high moral character of the Holy Prophet and the real motives which prompted him to marry more than one wife. We divide the life of the Holy Prophet into four periods as under:

(1) Life up to the age 25 years.
(2) From 25 years to 50 years.
(3) From 51 years to 54 years.
(4) From 55 years to 63 years.

We deal with the first part of the life up to the age of 25.

The Holy Prophet was born in a society which may be called a 'free society' where there was no bar to having extramarital relations. The Prophet was very handsome and well-built too. However, his youthful life up to the age of 25, when passions are very strong, presents a spectacle of very chaste and unblemished moral life. No critic Eastern or Western has been able to raise his little finger of scorn in this period of his life.

Observations of some Western scholars about the high moral character of the Prophet before his marriage to Khadija (R.A.) are worth nothing: Sir William Muir, a very hostile critic admits: "All authorities agree in ascribing to the youth of Mahomet a modesty of deportment and purity of manners rare among the people of Mecca".

P. de Lacy Johnstone writes in his work "Muhammad and His Power: "He enjoyed a high character among the citizens and nothing stands against his name".

Rev. Marcus Dods states in his work Mohammad, Buddha and Christ: His unmarried youth had been exceptionally pure".

Emile Dermengham records in his Life of Mahomet: "Mahomet's youth has been chaste".

Let us come to the second period of the Prophet's life from 25 years to 50 years.

At the age of 25 he married Khadija (R.A.) who was 40 years old. Before her marriage to the Prophet she had been married twice and had children born out of these unions. The Prophet remained wedded to her for full 25 years and all his children except Ibrahim (born to Maria, the Copt) were born to her. Their married life was a model of conjugal happiness, and deep affection.

The Prophet did not marry any other wife till Khadija lived.

Leon Nemoy writes in the Universal Jewish Encyclopaedia: Undoubtedly a marriage of convenience (Khadija on her part needed an energetic and experienced businessman to manage her mercantile interests) it developed, however, into a nearly ideal companionship of affection and mutual respect. Mohammed took no other wives during Khadija's lifetime and ever thought of her in terms of deep gratitude.

Rev Hughes records in his classic Dictionary of Islam: The house of Mohammad and Khadija was bright and happy one and their marriage fortunate and fruitful.

The Holy Prophet used to praise Khadija (R.A.) very much. A'isha (R.A.) said that she felt very jealous and said once to the Prophet. "Has not Allah given you a better wife than her?" The Prophet got very angry and said, "By Allah, He has not given me a better wife than her. She became a Muslim when others disbelieved in me. She testified to my truthfulness when others called me a liar. She gave me all her wealth when others made my life miserable. She bore me children when I did not have children from my other wives".

See just two remarks on the happy conjugal life of the Prophet with Khadija:

Emile Dermengham states that the Prophet "remained faithful to one wife much older than himself for a quarter of a century".

John Davenport records in his An Apology for Muhammad and Koran: Mohammed's gratitude to her (Khadija's) memory survived her to his latest hour.

We now come to the third period of the Holy Prophet's life from 51 to 54 years.

After the death of Khadija, Khawla bint Hakim suggested to the Prophet that he should marry. When the Prophet enquired as to with whom she proposed his marriage. She suggested Sauda bint Zam'a and A'isha bint Abi Bakr (R.A.). The Prophet agreed to the proposition. Sauda was married and Ayesha, being a minor was simply betrothed. Sauda was the widow of Sukran b. Amr, one of early followers who had emigrated to Abyssinia to escape persecution at the hands of Quraish.

Sauda was widow of mature age. She came in the Prophet's household three years before the Hijrah and remained with him for four years as his only wife.

About her marriage with the Prophet W. Montgomery Watt writes: In the case of Saudah, whom he married in Mecca, the chief aim may have been to provide for the widow of a faithful Muslim.

Sir William Muir states about this marriage: From the time of their marriage shortly after the death of Khadija she continued to be for three or four years the only wife of Mahomet.

So the Holy Prophet had only one wife up to the age of fifty four, and there was nothing sensual in contracting marriage with Sauda bint Zam'a (R.A.).

Lastly we study the Prophet's marriage with A'isha (R.A.)

A'isha was the only virgin wife of the Holy Prophet. At the time of her betrothal she was minor girl of about seven years of age. Some scholars do insist that she was older but most agree she was either 6 or 7 when betrothed, and she was delivered to the Prophet about one year after Hijra, during the month of Shawal.

Sir William Muir, while speaking about Prophet's marriage with Sauda, writes about the marriage with A'isha in these words: "About the same time he contracted a second marriage with Ayesha, the young daughter of Abu Bakr – a connection mainly designed to cement the attachment with his bosom-friend. The yet undeveloped charms of Ayesha could hardly have swayed the heart of Mahomet".

Washington Irving admits: Perhaps he (i.e. the Prophet) sought, by this alliance, to grapple Abu Bekr still more strongly to his side.

Rev. W. Montgomery Watt states: Since Muhammad had a political aim in nearly all his marriages, he must have seen in this one a means of strengthening the ties between himself and Abdu Bakr, his chief follower.

It is admitted by all scholars that A'isha occupies a prominent place amongst the most distinguished traditionists and hundreds of traditions are recorded as having been reported by her from the mouth of the Prophet. She was often consulted on theological and juridical subjects.

That shows why the Prophet under Divine inspiration was eager to accept A' isha into his harem at that age. No other person could have proved that useful for his Mission.

So in this marriage with A'isha there was a desire to cement the bonds of friendship with Abu Bakr as well as the desire for propagating the teachings of Islam, particularly delicate matters relating to women folk.

It appears that the Holy Prophet must have noticed early the precocious nature of A'isha. So in this marriage with A'isha nothing of the sensual was involved.

You might be knowing what is usually said about the marriage of Zainab bint Jahsh - the cousin of the Prophet (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) and widow of Zaid ibn Ha'ritha. The Qur'an first says: "Zawwajna kaha" i.e. "We (Allah) gave her in marriage (to Muhammad). Then the reason is noted: that Zainab was NOT the wife of Muhammad's son, as he had no sons. Zaid was only 'adopted". The Arab considered that a prohibited category. So the custom had to be changed by the Prophet himself, as no other one could effectively do that after him. Similar is the case of Umm al Momineen A'isha (R.A.). For a bad omen, Arab considered Shawwal a month prohibited for marriage. A'isha's betrothal and departure from her parent's house took place in Shawwal. This changed the ridiculous custom. Another bad custom was that the Arabs did not give the hands of their daughters to those who they "called" their brothers (though were not actual brothers). This was the objection raised by Abu Bakr himself, when the Prophet made the proposal. The Prophet (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) then told him that a brother in faith was not an actual blood brother to be placed in the prohibited category.

Lastly, my own personal opinion is that A'isha's marriage (consummation at the age of 9 to 11) indicates that if health condition and body vigour permit, there will be no "legal bar" (religiously speaking) on age, but it will certainly not be binding as well to go for young age marriages. Afterall, the Prophet (Sall Allah-o-alaihe wa sallam) never ordered or suggested that his followers should marry young maidens.

I hope this lengthy treatment of the subject matter will satisfy most who are eager to know the facts and reasons. The few filthy minds will not stop creating "Satanic Verses". We leave them to the harsh judgement of Allah - Maalik-i-Yaum ad-Deen.

 

[pcozzy]

:salam2:

I would say, that this person is not ideal in any sense. Perhaps there is no way to even deal with such a person. These responses he gave you where picked up from people who have designed a campaign against Islam.

First with respect to abuse, this is not true, and the Quran need explanation and interpretation. For example the Quran says to pray, had it not been for prophet PBUH we wouldn't know how to. It never says 2 rakaat for fajr and 4 for thuhr, . or even how to make rukoo sadja etc... The same applies to that verse, according to the hadith of one of the companions, the question was raised about this ayah 4:34. I don't have the hadith word for word but it says to hit lightly and with nothing greater than a miswak/toothbrush. In another hadith, you can't raise your elbow from your side.

As for Ayesha marriage, this person really is stupid, because up until 100 years ago it was practiced in the west. I will refer you to this article which is written by an ex. christian minister: http://www.islamswomen.com/marriage/ayshah_and_muhammad.php

As for the last part, about that is why men are coming to the west. It has nothing to do with religion, it is just they think will make more money. Why don't he read what those people who migrated; their children what they are doing lately, they are going back to the muslim countries. So if he want to state something he needs to consider apples to apples not apples only his desires of argument.

 

[mhamzah]

:salam2:

Muhsin Khan: Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). As to those women on whose part you see ill*!conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful), but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.

Yusuf Ali: Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all).

Pickthal: Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High, Exalted, Great.

Men are in charge of women by [right of] what Allah has given one over the other and what they spend [for maintenance] from their wealth. So righteous women are devoutly obedient, guarding in [the husband's] absence what Allah would have them guard. But those [wives] from whom you fear arrogance - [first] advise them; [then if they persist], forsake them in bed; and [finally], strike them. But if they obey you [once more], seek no means against them. Indeed, Allah is ever Exalted and Grand - Sahih International.

The verse isnt talking about force marriage or Killing any where.

Explicit verses on Killing and Consent in Marriage

For that cause We decreed for the Children of Israel that whosoever killeth a human being for other than manslaughter or corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind. Our messengers came unto them of old with clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty), but afterwards lo! many of them became prodigals in the earth. (5:32)


O ye who believe! Ye are forbidden to inherit women against their will. Nor should ye treat them with harshness, that ye may Take away part of the dower ye have given them,-except where they have been guilty of open lewdness; on the contrary live with them on a footing of kindness and equity. If ye take a dislike to them it may be that ye dislike a thing, and Allah brings about through it a great deal of good. (4:19)

http://www.islamswomen.com/marriage/forced_marriages.php

Regarding Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) marriage to Hazrat Aisha:

A good lectures covering historical, cultural, religious and scientific aspects.

http://www.islamictube.net/watch/c4ec58c0063a90deb396/Dr.-Ali-Shehata---Prophets-Marriage-to-Aisha


Puberty

Islamic law (and biblical law also) is that a person becomes eligible to marriage when he reaches the age of puberty.

Puberty refers to the process of physical changes by which a child's body becomes an adult body capable of reproduction. Puberty is initiated by hormone signals from the brain to the gonads (the ovaries and testes). In response, the gonads produce a variety of hormones that stimulate the growth, function, or transformation of brain, bones, muscle, skin, breasts, and reproductive organs. Growth accelerates in the first half of puberty and stops at the completion of puberty. Before puberty, body differences between boys and girls are almost entirely restricted to the genitalia. During puberty, major differences of size, shape, composition, and function develop in many body structures and systems. The most obvious of these are referred to as secondary sex characteristics.

In a strict sense, the term puberty (and this article) refers to the bodily changes of sexual maturation rather than the psychosocial and cultural aspects of adolescent development. Adolescence is the period of psychological and social transition between childhood and adulthood. Adolescence largely overlaps the period of puberty, but its boundaries are less precisely defined and it refers as much to the psychosocial and cultural characteristics of development during the teen years as to the physical changes of puberty.

Although there is a wide range of normal ages, on average, girls begin the process of puberty about 1-2 years earlier than boys (with average ages of 9 to 14 for girls and 10 to 17 for boys), and reach completion in a shorter time.[1] Girls attain adult height and reproductive maturity about 4 years after the first physical changes of puberty appear. In contrast, boys accelerate more slowly but continue to grow for about 6 years after the first visible pubertal changes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty


Age of consent

While the phrase age of consent typically does not appear in legal statutes,[1] when used in relation to sexual activity, the age of consent is the minimum age at which a person is considered to be legally competent of consenting to sexual acts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent

For historical age refer to lecture,

Current Age:

While the phrase age of consent typically does not appear in legal statutes,[1] when used in relation to sexual activity, the age of consent is the minimum age at which a person is considered to be legally competent of consenting to sexual acts.

The ages of consent for sexual activity vary by jurisdiction across North America. The age of consent in Canada is 16, all US states set their limits between 16 and 18, while some Mexico states have an age of consent as low as 12.

Local laws

The age of consent is:

puberty in: Nayarit, Querétaro
12 in: Aguascalientes, Baja California Sur, Campeche, Coahuila, Chiapas, Guanajuato, Guerrero, Hidalgo, Jalisco, Mexico City, Morelos, Oaxaca, Puebla, San Luis Potosí, Sonora, Tabasco, Tamaulipas, Yucatán, Zacatecas
13 in: Nuevo León
14 in: Baja California, Colima, Chihuahua, Durango, Quintana Roo, Sinaloa, Tlaxcala, Veracruz
15 in: Mexico (state)
18 in: Michoacán (as of August 2006)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_North_America

 

[Musulmanin]

:salam2:
I need an urgent answer Please ...a non muslim brother is asking me this question please can any one help me
Thats what i said :
)))))As you have read the holy quran then it will be more easy for you to tell me in which verse does it says that kill womens if they dont wear hijabs and if they dont marry (forced marraige) this is not the fault of islam get it this is fault of this stupid men who killed daughter Islam hates and is against force ....
walaikumsalam
And the brother answered:
))))please tell me. islam is not against force, please stop lying. go read 4:34 please. and when your own prophet married a 6 year old and had sex with her at 9, and men do it all the time in muslim countries today because of that, it is islam's fault. just stop lying, both to me and yourself. your religion is backwards, that's why so many leave and come to the west. we don't want that garbage here
I need an urgent reply......
walaikumsalam

:salam2:

this person is not interested in finding the truth. He/she is either intentionally lying to confuse you or he/she is ignorant to the bone.

 

[a_muslimah86]

:salam2:

This person seems to be very biased..prejudiced and Islamophobic!

A person wanting to *learn* even if for the sake of *common knowledge* would feel an urge to display utmost respect towards you and your beliefs..this person is making preposterous claims and on top of that insulting you..each one is worst than the other..

Let him be..and may Allah grant you the ajer for your intent to help