Satanic Verses

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kashif_nazeer

~~~Alhamdulillah~~~
Again from Wikipedia... "It was said by the prominent Sunni scholar, Ahmad bin Hanbal in regards to Al-waqidi: "He is a liar." Other famous Sunni scholars like Al-Bukhari and Abu Hatim al-Razi said in regards to Al-Waqidi's work: "His narrations are not retained, and their bane comes from him."
Writing in big letters is very helpful, thank you.

You are right in a way,but I meant scholars,when I said biographers(I should have clarified that). Al Waqidi was a Haafidh of hadith(memoriser) and not a scholar and he has been deemed lier by some and weak and abondoned by some.

You are welcome.
 

alf2

Islam is a way of life
Not sure what you mean about 'Twilight', could you explain?
Rushdie embroidered an existing story, he didn't make it up. To quote from Wikipedia, "Narratives derived from hadith involving these verses can be read in, among other places, the biographies of Muhammad by al-Wāqidī, Ibn Sa'd (who was a scribe of Waqidi), al-Tabarī, and Ibn Ishaq." I understand that some, though not all, of these biographers were respected.

Twilight is a vampire love story.
And his biography by Yahiya Emerick is the best I've ever read.

Also, I think this is all a waste of time. I wont be returning.
No the man did not deserve a death sentence, in my opinion. But I hate how when people write a bad book about Muhammad (saws) everyone sees it as a big accomplishment. Yet if someone wrote a book about Jesus (may peace be upon him) even Atheists would condemn the book. Even though Christianity has very very similar values as Islam. I guess thats just the impact of the Crusades still hanging around today.

Christians good.
Everyone else bad.
 

Townie

Junior Member
Twilight is a vampire love story.
And his biography by Yahiya Emerick is the best I've ever read.
Still not sure why you mentioned this, but thanks all the same.
Also, I think this is all a waste of time. I wont be returning.
No the man did not deserve a death sentence, in my opinion. But I hate how when people write a bad book about Muhammad (saws) everyone sees it as a big accomplishment. Yet if someone wrote a book about Jesus (may peace be upon him) even Atheists would condemn the book. Even though Christianity has very very similar values as Islam. I guess thats just the impact of the Crusades still hanging around today.

Christians good.
Everyone else bad.
This is just plain wrong. There are many books and films about Jesus, many of which are critical, or which contradict the Christian view of him. Christians may not like it, but in the main they accept it. I don't think that atheists would condemn a book which was critical of Jesus, since they don't believe him to be anything other than a man, and many atheists doubt that he even existed.
I don't think anyone applauded Rushdie because he was trying to insult Muslims. The book didn't get very good reviews, but as I've said I don't think it is one of his better books.
 

PeacefulHumanity

:)Smile! It's Sunnah
And his biography by Yahiya Emerick is the best I've ever read.

I'm currently reading his translation of the Holy Quran. It's simply one of the best, written in plain, normal English (as opposed to the medieval kind with all the thous and thees). I highly recommend it.
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
I came here to find out more about Islam and the Prophet. It seems to me that the 'Satanic Verses' issue is pretty fundamental to that understanding, that's why I asked the question.
I think I understand more about your view of the book and its author, and I am heartened to find that no-one here seems to believe that Rushdie deserved to be killed for his writings.
However, I don't understand how there can have been a disagreement about whether this incident happened or not, and that maybe throws doubt on the contention that everything in the Qu'ran is the indisputable word of God.
What are your views on this?
Verbose crap.

- - - Updated - - -


I came here to find out more about Islam and the Prophet. It seems to me that the 'Satanic Verses' issue is pretty fundamental to that understanding, that's why I asked the question.
I think I understand more about your view of the book and its author, and I am heartened to find that no-one here seems to believe that Rushdie deserved to be killed for his writings.
However, I don't understand how there can have been a disagreement about whether this incident happened or not, and that maybe throws doubt on the contention that everything in the Qu'ran is the indisputable word of God.
What are your views on this?
Verbose crap.
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
I don't think that the quality of a man's writing is dependent on his morals or his actions. Salman Rushdie is a very respected writer,

This is where the differences begin. So he cant walk the talk err writing. In most part of world, that does not give any one respect. And if you ask, we will say he does all this for a living. Ask Rushdie himself...

Stoic and averse. Thats what Townie,
Satanic verse and its author is all about. Rushdie is another case of Manufactured publicity. Its been thrown up again and again in this forum. This forum has much better deeper topics discussed, search the forum and you will get the answer.
Practically speaking, subhuman portrayals of a person and by extension a people can also have bad consequences, in a very immature world so full of hatred towards THOSE people. The 'other' were once Jews. Now it is Muslims. Are we free to say this? Respond with violence? Who has done that? Let us get some sense of proportion back into this whole thing about violence and provocations. Kindly note that Rushdie is alive and well (and may he continue to be and maybe then he shall be moved one day to express some sympathy for a million Iraqis who are dead for no fault of theirs)

From: Web

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.

I have read the Qur'an, but only in translation I'm afraid. I do not think that Satan had anything to do with the verses, but I am also not sure that this incident didn't happen.
Response:
Personally, I thought it was a microcosm of the cognitive dissonance between the (relatively) privileged and the (relatively) oppressed. No category is absolute or impermeable, of course; to have death threats publicly uttered against you is an act of oppression. And yet, Salman Rushdie has lived in relative affluence, his physical safety ably defended by the nation-state of his choice.......And Salman Rushdie, defender of rapist Roman Polanski and U.S.'s war against Afghanistan, advocate of declaring Pakistan a terrorist state, and disparager of all post-colonial vernacular writing is hardly a poster child for the virtues of a self-righteously unrestricted tongue.
When I read the plot summary of the book now in preparation to writing this post, I was surprised by how much I had forgotten about the book. It was not terribly memorable, though in part that was the fault of having read it a trifle young, without literary context to grasp all the themes, or appreciate some of the nuances. What I do remember with vividness though, is reading, almost 10 years later, Martin Ling's biography of the Prophet Mohammad: His Life Based on the Earliest Sources, and being shocked by how much fantasy I had assumed to be fact due to unquestioningly accepting the Mahound narrative in Rushdie's book.............................. the anti-Muslim bigotry around me was insidious and pervasive enough so as to strip any such dignity or familiarity away from Mohammad.

From: web

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.

(from his wikipedia entry). I have read .........
Response:
Rushdie has reported that he still receives a "sort of Valentine's card" from Iran each year on 14 February letting him know the country has not forgotten the vow to kill him. He said, "It's reached the point where it's a piece of rhetoric rather than a real threat."[43] Despite the threats on Rushdie, he has publicly said that his family has never been threatened and that his mother (who lived in Pakistan during the later years of her life) even received outpourings of support.[44]
A former bodyguard to Rushdie, Ron Evans, planned to publish a book recounting the behaviour of the author during the time he was in hiding. Evans claimed that Rushdie tried to profit financially from the fatwa and was suicidal, but Rushdie dismissed the book as a "bunch of lies" and took legal action against Ron Evans, his co-author and their publisher.[45] On 26 August 2008 Rushdie received an apology at the High Court in London from all three parties.[46] A memoir of his years of hiding, Joseph Anton, is due to be published 18 September 2012. Joseph Anton was Rushdie's secret alias.

International Guerillas
In 1990, soon after the publication of The Satanic Verses, a Pakistani film entitled International Gorillay (International Guerillas) was released that depicted Rushdie as plotting to cause the downfall of Pakistan by opening a chain of casinos and discos in the country. The film was popular with Pakistani audiences, and it "presents Rushdie as a Rambo-like figure pursued by four Pakistani guerrillas".[51] The British Board of Film Classification refused to allow it a certificate, as "it was felt that the portrayal of Rushdie might qualify as criminal libel, causing a breach of the peace as opposed to merely tarnishing his reputation."[52] This effectively prevented the release of the film in Britain. He later said, "If that film had been banned, it would have become the hottest video in town: everyone would have seen it".[52] While the film was a great hit in Pakistan, it went virtually unnoticed in the West.[52]

From : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salman_Rushdie
(I found one section removed from wiki, interesting that section has been removed. It had a carefully worded response from Rushdie.)

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And
It's the eternal fight - freedom of expression vs safeguarding the true interest of those harmed by an act committed freely but irresponsibly.
From: Web
Whats your say on wiki leaks founders extradition ? Who is champion of free speech?


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What are your here for?
Read Prophet :saw: life, you would benefit immensely.
 

Townie

Junior Member
I am sorry, but I don't understand the point you are trying to make.
If your question is about Julian Assange - I am very concerned that his extradition to Sweden may result in his eventual extradition to the US to face different charges. I think this would be wrong.
However, I do think that Sweden is a just country and if their judicial system has applied for his extradition it must happen.
Freedom of speech has always been relative. Who would have applauded the right to tell the Nazis when and where the allies would launch their assault on Normandy?
The ability of US citizens to demand to see confidential documents means that the US has more freedom of information than any other country.
Can you imagine what would have happened to Assange if he had chosen to make his stand while living in North Korea?

Think I have explained what I am here for, but what are you here for? As far as I can understand this site aims to correct common misconceptions about Islam. When I ask genuine questions I am rewarded with hostility and death threats towards my family. I have been shocked by the level of aggression, and I think most people come to this site just to talk to other people who think like themselves.

And of course I have read about Muhammed's life, from the early biographies, to the later ones by respected writers like Karen Armstrong and Christoph Luxenberg (whoever he really is).
 

Hard Rock Moslem

I'm your brother
Firstly, Salman is not a credible writer. Why are you wasting your time defending him? Secondly, you said what he wrote is a fiction yet you also said “stories he wrote does exist”. Can you explain what is your stance now? I guess you are here not to learn but to insult Islam. Khomeini does not represent Islam, he represent Iran. If you want to know whether it was right or wrong on the fatwa, pls login to Shia’s websites and ask Iranian from shia religion why their imam given such fatwa. No fatwa came from Muslim scholars to kill him, as far as I know.

Even Karen Armstrong, although she mostly written good about the Prophet yet she did hide many facts in her book about the Prophet's life. She was not truly honest. You can write in queen language, but if the info you supplied is fake and so it is fake.

If you really want to learn Islam do not learn from kuffars (disbelievers), learn from Islamic authentic sources.
 

mohammadyunus

Junior Member
Whats the matter with TTI , all mods and members ?

You giving this STUPID post 5 stars ??
You arguing with this STUPID townie ??
Wasting time ??

The prophet told us to avoid arguments especially with people like townies !!!
 

Townie

Junior Member
Firstly, Salman is not a credible writer. Why are you wasting your time defending him? Secondly, you said what he wrote is a fiction yet you also said “stories he wrote does exist”. Can you explain what is your stance now? I guess you are here not to learn but to insult Islam. Khomeini does not represent Islam, he represent Iran. If you want to know whether it was right or wrong on the fatwa, pls login to Shia’s websites and ask Iranian from shia religion why their imam given such fatwa. No fatwa came from Muslim scholars to kill him, as far as I know.

Even Karen Armstrong, although she mostly written good about the Prophet yet she did hide many facts in her book about the Prophet's life. She was not truly honest. You can write in queen language, but if the info you supplied is fake and so it is fake.

If you really want to learn Islam do not learn from kuffars (disbelievers), learn from Islamic authentic sources.
I don't understand what you mean when you say that Rushdie is not credible. He is clearly held in high esteem by literary judges and I thought Midnight's Children was a great book. Have you read it, or anything by him?
What I actually said was that Rushdie embroidered an existing story, which I believe is true. The stories about the satanic verses date from centuries before Rushdie.
Are you saying that Khomeini does in no way represent Islam? I don't remember any Muslim, Sunni or Shia, condemning the fatwa when it was made. I do remember a lot of crowds burning the book...
I disagree with you about Karen Armstrong. Her biography was generally held to be historically accurate; although of course the work by 'Luxenberg' now casts doubt on it.
If you really want to learn about something, wouldn't you want to know all the information that exists about it?
 

Townie

Junior Member
The prophet told us to avoid arguments especially with people like townies !!!
I'm delighted to know that 'The Prophet' knew there would be people like me. Would he have been so delighted to realise there would be people like you?
I think not. What do you think? Do you think?
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
I don't think that the quality of a man's writing is dependent on his morals or his actions. Salman Rushdie is a very respected writer,

This is where the differences begin. So he cant walk the talk err writing. In most part of world, that does not give any one respect. And if you ask, we will say he does all this for a living. Ask Rushdie himself...

Stoic and averse. Thats what Townie,
Satanic verse and its author is all about. Rushdie is another case of Manufactured publicity. Its been thrown up again and again in this forum. This forum has much better deeper topics discussed, search the forum and you will get the answer.
Practically speaking, subhuman portrayals of a person and by extension a people can also have bad consequences, in a very immature world so full of hatred towards THOSE people. The 'other' were once Jews. Now it is Muslims. Are we free to say this? Respond with violence? Who has done that? Let us get some sense of proportion back into this whole thing about violence and provocations. Kindly note that Rushdie is alive and well (and may he continue to be and maybe then he shall be moved one day to express some sympathy for a million Iraqis who are dead for no fault of theirs)

From: Web

.
.

I have read the Qur'an, but only in translation I'm afraid. I do not think that Satan had anything to do with the verses, but I am also not sure that this incident didn't happen.
Response:
Personally, I thought it was a microcosm of the cognitive dissonance between the (relatively) privileged and the (relatively) oppressed. No category is absolute or impermeable, of course; to have death threats publicly uttered against you is an act of oppression. And yet, Salman Rushdie has lived in relative affluence, his physical safety ably defended by the nation-state of his choice.......And Salman Rushdie, defender of rapist Roman Polanski and U.S.'s war against Afghanistan, advocate of declaring Pakistan a terrorist state, and disparager of all post-colonial vernacular writing is hardly a poster child for the virtues of a self-righteously unrestricted tongue.
When I read the plot summary of the book now in preparation to writing this post, I was surprised by how much I had forgotten about the book. It was not terribly memorable, though in part that was the fault of having read it a trifle young, without literary context to grasp all the themes, or appreciate some of the nuances. What I do remember with vividness though, is reading, almost 10 years later, Martin Ling's biography of the Prophet Mohammad: His Life Based on the Earliest Sources, and being shocked by how much fantasy I had assumed to be fact due to unquestioningly accepting the Mahound narrative in Rushdie's book.............................. the anti-Muslim bigotry around me was insidious and pervasive enough so as to strip any such dignity or familiarity away from Mohammad.

From: web

.
.

(from his wikipedia entry). I have read .........
Response:
Rushdie has reported that he still receives a "sort of Valentine's card" from Iran each year on 14 February letting him know the country has not forgotten the vow to kill him. He said, "It's reached the point where it's a piece of rhetoric rather than a real threat."[43] Despite the threats on Rushdie, he has publicly said that his family has never been threatened and that his mother (who lived in Pakistan during the later years of her life) even received outpourings of support.[44]
A former bodyguard to Rushdie, Ron Evans, planned to publish a book recounting the behaviour of the author during the time he was in hiding. Evans claimed that Rushdie tried to profit financially from the fatwa and was suicidal, but Rushdie dismissed the book as a "bunch of lies" and took legal action against Ron Evans, his co-author and their publisher.[45] On 26 August 2008 Rushdie received an apology at the High Court in London from all three parties.[46] A memoir of his years of hiding, Joseph Anton, is due to be published 18 September 2012. Joseph Anton was Rushdie's secret alias.

International Guerillas
In 1990, soon after the publication of The Satanic Verses, a Pakistani film entitled International Gorillay (International Guerillas) was released that depicted Rushdie as plotting to cause the downfall of Pakistan by opening a chain of casinos and discos in the country. The film was popular with Pakistani audiences, and it "presents Rushdie as a Rambo-like figure pursued by four Pakistani guerrillas".[51] The British Board of Film Classification refused to allow it a certificate, as "it was felt that the portrayal of Rushdie might qualify as criminal libel, causing a breach of the peace as opposed to merely tarnishing his reputation."[52] This effectively prevented the release of the film in Britain. He later said, "If that film had been banned, it would have become the hottest video in town: everyone would have seen it".[52] While the film was a great hit in Pakistan, it went virtually unnoticed in the West.[52]

From : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salman_Rushdie
(I found one section removed from wiki, interesting that section has been removed. It had a carefully worded response from Rushdie.)

.

.

And
It's the eternal fight - freedom of expression vs safeguarding the true interest of those harmed by an act committed freely but irresponsibly.
From: Web
 

Townie

Junior Member
It may be the way you use the 'quotes', but I find it hard to work out what you are trying to say.

Does he write for a living? Yes. Quelle surprise...

Should I avoid this subject because more interesting subjects have been launched? Dunno. Haven't found them yet. Didn't think it was worth answering the guy who was afraid that having a wet dream would cancel out his fast...

Then your strange little section in italics, where you seem to imply that Rushdie was responsible for the deaths of a million Iraqis? Which was certainly no fault of his...

The bit which starts "Personally, I thought it was a microcosm of the cognitive dissonance between the (relatively) privileged and the (relatively) oppressed." What does that mean? Would you like to ask the question in understandable English?

Then you've pasted in a load of stuff that doesn't seem relevant; apart from the last sentence, "It's the eternal fight - freedom of expression vs safeguarding the true interest of those harmed by an act committed freely but irresponsibly."
In what way were you 'harmed' by Rushdie's Satanic Verses? If there wasn't a deep underlying fear that the stories of the Satanic Verses were true, what would you care who talked about them?
The more you 'protest', the more the non-Muslim world will search for the reason you are protesting. To me it smells like fear...
 

MeGladder

Junior Member
I don't know why some non-Muslims try to gain advantage by using story of the Cranes, also (inaccurately) known as Satanic Verses.

Even according to that story, the verses were corrected by Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta'ala). Here is an excerpt from Tabari, Volume 1:

And God revealed: 'We never sent any apostle or prophet before you but that, when he longed, Satan cast into his longing. But God abrogates what Satan casts in, and then God puts His verses in proper order, for God is all-knowing and wise.' [Q.22:52]

So God drove out the sadness from His prophet and gave him security against what he feared. He abrogated what Satan had cast upon his tongue in referring to their gods: 'They are the high-flying cranes whose intercession is accepted [ sic ]'. [replacing those words with] the words of God when Allāt, al-'Uzzā and Manāt the third, the other are mentioned: 'Should you have males and He females [as offspring]! That, indeed, would be an unfair division. They are only names which you and your fathers have given them'… as far as 'As many as are the angels in heaven, their intercession shall be of no avail unless after God has permitted it to whom He pleases and accepts' [Q.53:21-26]- meaning, how can the intercession of their gods be of any avail with Him?
When there had come from God the words which abrogated what Satan had cast on to the tongue of His prophet, Quraysh said, 'Muhammad has gone back on what he said about the status of our gods relative to God, changed it and brought something else', for the two phrases which Satan had cast on to the tongue of the Prophet had found a place in the mouth of every polytheist. They, therefore, increased in their evil and in their oppression of everyone among them who had accepted Islam and followed the Prophet.

So, according to the story, the Satan deceived the Prophet (Sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam) for few seconds by making him utter those words. But Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta'ala) exposed the Satan, and the words were removed. Now if someone believes in that story of Satanic verses, he/she will have to believe that the God exists, and Prophet Muhammad (Sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam) was/is indeed a prophet of one and only God, Allah (Subhanahu Wa Ta'ala), the Qur'an is also in correct form.

But for Muslims, this is a slander against the noble Prophet (Sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam). The story does not match the criteria (according to Hadith sciences) to be judged as authentic. This story is rather a lie. And Muslims can not and should not believe in lies.

Hopefully the ridiculous case against the Noble Qur'an will be closed now.
 

Hard Rock Moslem

I'm your brother
I don't understand what you mean when you say that Rushdie is not credible. He is clearly held in high esteem by literary judges and I thought Midnight's Children was a great book. Have you read it, or anything by him?
What I actually said was that Rushdie embroidered an existing story, which I believe is true. The stories about the satanic verses date from centuries before Rushdie.
Are you saying that Khomeini does in no way represent Islam? I don't remember any Muslim, Sunni or Shia, condemning the fatwa when it was made. I do remember a lot of crowds burning the book...
I disagree with you about Karen Armstrong. Her biography was generally held to be historically accurate; although of course the work by 'Luxenberg' now casts doubt on it.
If you really want to learn about something, wouldn't you want to know all the information that exists about it?

He is a racist, immoral and he is lying to the whole world by depicting wrong information about Islam. How can you say he is a credible writer when he writes something is not the true picture of Islam? If I write lies about christianity, will your govt give me award in the name of "freedom of expression"? What is freedom of expression? I saw someone vanadalized a bus seat with writing "my mother is a whore" (nauzubillah, may Allah forbids), is this what you call freedom of expression? And you going to give an award?

The fatwa to kill him is correct if he was a Muslim because what he did was is blasphemy in Islam provided he did it in an Islamic state. But Khomeini and his religion does not represent true Islam, so why should I condemn for something not related to me? Townie, Sheikh Ahmad Deedat (may Allah be pleased with him) was right. You should read "How Rushdie Fooled the West" book instead. He did not managed to fool Muslims, alhamdulillah (all praises to Allah), I'm afraid he did to you and most of the western people. You easily buy into lies and cheap writing because of your deep hatred towards Islam and Muslims. You don't have to confess to me.

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15078
 

Hard Rock Moslem

I'm your brother
Whats the matter with TTI , all mods and members ?

You giving this STUPID post 5 stars ??
You arguing with this STUPID townie ??
Wasting time ??

The prophet told us to avoid arguments especially with people like townies !!!

Brother,

Allah says in the Qur'an,

O mankind! Eat of that which is lawful and good on the earth, and follow not the footsteps of Shaitan (Satan). Verily, he is to you an open enemy. [Q 2:168]

Based on the above ayah it is clear Satan is our arch enemy. Those believe in God will hate and distant themselves Satan. Those disbelieve in God will have heart incline towards Satan. Either you are with God or Satan, you do not have option because we are creatures, God is the Creator. If you want an option you have to make your own planets and oxygen and migrate over there.

If you look at it today, people from other religions including atheists, secularist and communists and any other beliefs other than Islam will have a lot of hatred towards Islam. Do you notice that? Why? When I was a hindu, I do work with other non Muslims to attack Islam, unfortunately it was my jahiliyah day. Today, I was thinking why I did that? I never had hatred towards Christianity then? This is an honest confession I'm making today. I was never bias towards others but Islam. Why? Because at that time I was in the some team of Satan. A religion endorsed by Satan, so Satan will not whisper you to hate or mock religions endorsed by Satan.

When I read Qur'an then I understood. If you believe in God, you will never be friend of Satan.

Rushdie's very cheap book is clearly mocking Islam, non of our scholars agreed with Rushdie thus far. Those support Rushdie's "Satanic Verses" indeed is a friend of Satan.

Alhamdulillah, all praises to Allah. He, Allah guided you and me into the truth, sadly not Townie. Let's us make du'a for him, he maybe ignorant. I was ignorant 10 years ago. The heaven is very huge it can accommodate not this world but another dozens of worlds can easily fit into it. I'm sure Townie has place somewhere in heaven if he believe in Islam. Currently he is being deceived by "Satanic Verses" unfortunately, let's make du'a for him. I'm afraid he may be banned, it should not happen.
 

mohammadyunus

Junior Member
Brother,

Allah says in the Qur'an,

O mankind! Eat of that which is lawful and good on the earth, and follow not the footsteps of Shaitan (Satan). Verily, he is to you an open enemy. [Q 2:168]

Based on the above ayah it is clear Satan is our arch enemy. Those believe in God will hate and distant themselves Satan. Those disbelieve in God will have heart incline towards Satan. Either you are with God or Satan, you do not have option because we are creatures, God is the Creator. If you want an option you have to make your own planets and oxygen and migrate over there.

If you look at it today, people from other religions including atheists, secularist and communists and any other beliefs other than Islam will have a lot of hatred towards Islam. Do you notice that? Why? When I was a hindu, I do work with other non Muslims to attack Islam, unfortunately it was my jahiliyah day. Today, I was thinking why I did that? I never had hatred towards Christianity then? This is an honest confession I'm making today. I was never bias towards others but Islam. Why? Because at that time I was in the some team of Satan. A religion endorsed by Satan, so Satan will not whisper you to hate or mock religions endorsed by Satan.

When I read Qur'an then I understood. If you believe in God, you will never be friend of Satan.

Rushdie's very cheap book is clearly mocking Islam, non of our scholars agreed with Rushdie thus far. Those support Rushdie's "Satanic Verses" indeed is a friend of Satan.

Alhamdulillah, all praises to Allah. He, Allah guided you and me into the truth, sadly not Townie. Let's us make du'a for him, he maybe ignorant. I was ignorant 10 years ago. The heaven is very huge it can accommodate not this world but another dozens of worlds can easily fit into it. I'm sure Townie has place somewhere in heaven if he believe in Islam. Currently he is being deceived by "Satanic Verses" unfortunately, let's make du'a for him. I'm afraid he may be banned, it should not happen.


Jazak Allah. Your post is very true and fits my aspect of life exactly like you said. I never thought about it until you wrote this. When i was a hindu, i always hated islam but never any other religion. In fact because of what i saw and read in the media i positively looked upto christianity ( also because i studied in a convent). When i took part in christmas celebrations no one in my family objected to it. But we avoided islam and muslims always.

Alhamdulillah. Allah guided me towards Him.

and yes you are right on this count also. Townie is behaving just like i did when i was a hindu. Yes, i will pray that Allah guides townie towards realisation of the truth.
 

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New Member
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Townie

Junior Member
He is a racist, immoral and he is lying to the whole world by depicting wrong information about Islam. How can you say he is a credible writer when he writes something is not the true picture of Islam? If I write lies about christianity, will your govt give me award in the name of "freedom of expression"? What is freedom of expression? I saw someone vanadalized a bus seat with writing "my mother is a whore" (nauzubillah, may Allah forbids), is this what you call freedom of expression? And you going to give an award?

The fatwa to kill him is correct if he was a Muslim because what he did was is blasphemy in Islam provided he did it in an Islamic state. But Khomeini and his religion does not represent true Islam, so why should I condemn for something not related to me? Townie, Sheikh Ahmad Deedat (may Allah be pleased with him) was right. You should read "How Rushdie Fooled the West" book instead. He did not managed to fool Muslims, alhamdulillah (all praises to Allah), I'm afraid he did to you and most of the western people. You easily buy into lies and cheap writing because of your deep hatred towards Islam and Muslims. You don't have to confess to me.

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15078

Why is he a racist? Satanic Verses by Rushdie is a novel, he didn't say it was the truth. I don't think Rushdie won any award for the Satanic Verses, but it was certainly not his best book. Have you read Midnight's Children?

The story of the satanic verses is interesting because of the different versions of it. Some people clearly believed that Muhammed said them and meant them and then changed his mind. Others say that he said them, but Satan put them into his mind. Others again say that he said something else but Satan made those who were listening hear the satanic verses. Of course none of us can know which is the truth, we can only believe in the version that suits us best.

I suppose the bigger issue is that when there is disagreement about the content of the Qu'ran it calls into question the rest of the book, but that was not why I asked my original question.

I have listened to Sheikh Ahmad Deedat talk about Rushdie and I thought he misunderstood the difference between a work of fiction and an expression of Rushdie's own beliefs. But at least he read the book before he condemned it, which I don't believe many Muslims did, before they took to the streets calling for Rushdie's blood.

I don't support Rushdie in what he wrote about the satanic verses episode and I don't think he fooled me. I have no hatred towards Islam, not sure why you would think I have.
 
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