Some questions

[Tabassum07]

:salam2:

I have some questions, hope someone can answer:

1. About the sujood during the recitation of the Quran. I only knew that you read it to yourself, and then later, you get up and go perform the number of sajda you read. But some people say, you should make sajda ASAP. But if you're sitting on a chair, and not facing qibla directly, so what's the proper way for this?

2. Can someone post the list of mistakes that Sajda Sahw are applicable for?

3. Does the Night prayers *have* to be odd numbered? Like, someone read Isha prayer (4 fard + 2 sunnat + 3 witr = 9 rakat. Odd), but then also wanted to make up for a Qada Isha (4 fard + 1 witr = 5. Odd). So, this makes 9 + 5 = 14 rakats. They are odd separately, but even numbered in the total prayer. I was wondering because maybe there's some sort of scientific reasoning for making the last prayers odd numbered, and so doing the qada this way would mess it up.

4. This is a question for someone travelling during Ramadan. Say, someone travels from a country where the eid date was fixed after 29 fasts. But then the person travels to a country where the eid date is not yet fixed, plus the Ramadan had started a day later. If he already had his 29 fasts, should he fast on the 30th, or even on the 31st day, till he can celebrate eid with the rest of the new country??

 

[Happy 2BA Muslim]

1. About the sujood during the recitation of the Quran. I only knew that you read it to yourself, and then later, you get up and go perform the number of sajda you read. But some people say, you should make sajda ASAP. But if you're sitting on a chair, and not facing qibla directly, so what's the proper way for this?

Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allah have mercy on him) said:

When the reader comes to a verse of prostration, if he is in a place where he can prostrate, then it is mustahabb for him to prostrate, but it is not obligatory according to the more correct opinion, because it is proven that ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allah be pleased with him) recited a verse of prostration when he was delivering the khutbah on a Friday, and he came down (from the minbar) and prostrated, then he recited it on the following Friday and did not prostrate, and he said: Allah has not enjoined us to prostrate unless we want to.

Another evidence is that Zayd ibn Thaabit recited Soorat al-Najm in the presence of the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) and he did not prostrate.

Fataawa Islamiyyah, 4/66

:salam2:

 

[Happy 2BA Muslim]

2. Can someone post the list of mistakes that Sajda Sahw are applicable for?

:salam2:

By the mercy of Allaah to His slaves, as one of the beauties of this perfect religion, Allaah has prescribed that His slaves may make up for shortcomings and mistakes that they make in their worship and cannot avoid completely, by performing supererogatory (naafil) acts of worship, praying for forgiveness and so on.

One of the things that Allaah has prescribed for His slaves to make up for shortcomings that may occur in their prayer is the prostration of forgetfulness, but it is only prescribed to make up for certain things; it does not make up for everything nor is it prescribed for everything.

Shaykh Ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked about the reasons for doing the prostration of forgetfulness, and he replied as follows:

The prostration of forgetfulness in prayer is generally prescribed for three reasons:

1- Doing something extra

2- Omitting something

3- Being uncertain

Doing something extra: for example, doing an extra bow (rukoo’), prostration (sujood), standing or sitting.

Omitting something: such as omitting an essential part of the prayer, or omitting one of the obligatory parts of the prayer.

Being uncertain: such as when a person is not sure how many rak’ahs he has prayed, whether it was three or four, for example.

In the case of doing something extra, if a person adds something to his prayer – bowing, prostrating, standing or sitting – deliberately, then his prayer becomes invalid, because when he added it, that means that he did not do the prayer in the manner ordained by Allaah and His Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever does an action that is not part of this matter of ours (i.e., Islam), will have it rejected.” Narrated by Muslim, 1718.

But if he did that extra thing by mistake, then his prayer is not invalidated, but he should do the prostration of forgetfulness after saying the salaam. The evidence for that is the hadeeth of Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) who said that when the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said the salaam after two rak’ahs in one of the two afternoon prayers, either Zuhr or ‘Asr, and they told him about that, he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did the rest of the prayer, then he said the salaam, then he prostrated twice (the prostration of forgetfulness) after saying the salaam. Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 482; Muslim, 573.

And Ibn Mas’ood (may Allaah be pleased with him) narrated that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) led them in praying Zuhr and he prayed five rak’ahs. When he had finished it was said to him: “Has something been added to the prayer?”

He said: “Why are you asking that?”

They said: “You prayed five (rak’ahs).”

So he turned towards the qiblah and prostrated twice. Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 4040; Muslim, 572.

In the case of omitting something, if a person omits one of the essential parts of the prayer, one of the following two scenarios must apply:

Either he remembers it before he reaches the same point in the following rak’ah, so he has to go back and do that essential part of the prayer and whatever came after it,

Or he does not remember it until he reaches the same point in the following rak’ah, in which case the following rak’ah takes the place of the one in which he omitted that essential part, and he should make up the invalid rak’ah.

In either of these two cases, he should do the prostration of forgetfulness after saying the salaam.

For example: a man stood up after doing the first prostration of the first rak’ah and did not sit or do the second prostration. When he started to recite Qur’aan he remembers that he had not done the second prostration or sat between the two prostrations. In that case he should go back and sit as between the two prostrations, then prostrate, then stand up and do whatever is left of his prayer, and do the prostration of forgetfulness after saying the salaam.

An example of one who did not remember until after he reached the same point in the following rak’ah is a man who stood up following the first prostration in the first rak’ah and did not do the second prostration or sit between the two prostrations, but he did not remember that until he sat between the two prostrations in the second rak’ah. In this case he should make the second rak’ah the first rak’ah, and add another rak’ah to his prayer, then say the salaam then do the prostration of forgetfulness.

Omitting an obligatory part of the prayer – such as if he omits an obligatory part and moves on to the next part of the prayer. For example, he forgets to say Subhaan Rabbiy al-A’la (Glory be to my Lord Most High) and he does not remember until he has got up from prostrating. In this case he has omitted an obligatory part of the prayer by mistake, so he should carry on with his prayer then do the prostration of forgetfulness before saying the salaam, because when the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) omitted the first tashahhud he carried on with his prayer and did not go back and repeat anything, then he did the prostration of forgetfulness before saying the salaam.

In the case of being uncertain, such as if a person is not sure if he has done something extra or omitted something, e.g., he is not sure whether he has prayed three rak’ahs or four, one of the following two scenarios must apply:

Either he thinks that one or the other is more likely to be case, whether it is doing more or omitting something, in which case he should proceed on the basis of what he thinks is more likely to be the case, complete his prayer accordingly, then do the prostration of forgetfulness after saying the salaam;

Or neither appears more likely to be the case, so he should proceed on the basis of what is certain, namely the lesser amount, and complete his prayer accordingly, then do the prostration of forgetfulness before saying the salaam.

For example: a man prays Zuhr then he is not sure whether he is praying the third or fourth rak’ah, but he thinks it more likely that it is the third. So he should pray another rak’ah, then say the salaam, then do the prostration of forgetfulness.

An example of when neither seems to him more likely to be the case is when a man is praying Zuhr and is not sure whether he is in the third rak’ah or the fourth, and neither seems to him more likely to be the case. In that case he should proceed on the basis of what is certain, which is the lesser amount. So he should regard it as the third rak’ah, then do another rak’ah and do the prostration of forgetfulness before saying the salaam. Thus it becomes clear that this should be done before the salaam if you have omitted one of the obligatory parts of the prayer or if you are not sure how many rak’ahs you have done, and neither of the two choices seems more likely to be the case. And it should be done after the salaam if you have added something extra to the prayer or you are not certain but one of the two choices seems more likely to be the case.

See Majmoo’ Fataawa al-Shaykh, 14/14-16

:salam2:

 

[Tabassum07]

Happy2BA Muslim, Jazakallah Khair for the detailed reply. Even though my head is now spinning. Um, so if a person had to do sahw, he doesn't need to repeat the prayer, right? Like, if I was praying 4 fard, made some mistake and did sahw, usually I would repeat the 4 fard again.

I'll return again. Lol, I have to go eat dinner.

 

[ahmed_indian]

Happy2BA Muslim, Jazakallah Khair for the detailed reply. Even though my head is now spinning. Um, so if a person had to do sahw, he doesn't need to repeat the prayer, right? Like, if I was praying 4 fard, made some mistake and did sahw, usually I would repeat the 4 fard again.

I'll return again. Lol, I have to go eat dinner.

if the mistake invalidates the prayer..u have to repeat the prayer.

but if it is a minor mistake, yes just make sajdah sahw...no need to repeat the salah and overburden urself.

u can read the following book for better understanding (read slowly to avoid getting ur head spinning )

http://www.islamicbulletin.com/free_downloads/prayer/Entire_Salaah_Book.pdf

 

[Tabassum07]

but if it is a minor mistake, yes just make sajdah sahw...no need to repeat the salah and overburden urself.

Let's say I was reading 4 fard. On the second rakat, when I was sitting, I read at-tayyat, but then I started a line of the durood after that, and realized my mistake, and stood up immediately and performed the rest of the salat. And then I did the sajdah sahw in the last rakat. Was that correct? I mean, even if you say one line extra where it wasn't meant to be, you have to do the forgetfulness sajdah?

Witr is not fardh, therefore you do not make up for it if you missed it. You cannot pray two witr prayers during the same night.

..Well.. akhi, Witr are wajib, and even the link that akhi ahmed_indian posted says that witr are wajib which must be made qada for as soon as possible.
Do you think you could please show me some proof that two witr cannot be read on one night??

You always follow the Jamaa`a wherever you are. If you travel to a community who fasted a day later or earlier than you did, you fast with them and celebrate Eid with them. It is haraam to fast on the day of Eid.

Even if it means fasting 31 days? Sorry, just clarifying what I understood.. Like, my brother is traveling from Singapore to India, and he started his fasts one day before us. When he gets here, when we have our 30th fast, it would be the 31st fast for him. So he still has to keep it with us right, and then pray eid the next day with us. (of course, this is all assuming that there will be 30 days fasts for us, and not 29.)

 

[Tabassum07]

Okay, so if the witr is wajib, how do you do the qada for it? Can I pray it during the day instead?

And please don't say I dont have to read it. I mean, there's no harm is there? Plus I do follow other things in Hanafi school.

 

[Tabassum07]

Jazakallah Khair brothers. Okay, I'm done with this thread.

 

[daywalker]

It's math! Two witrs make an even number of rak`aat, therefore they result in no witr.

:salam2:
Its not math actuelly but mentioned in hadith:

the Prophet (sallallaahu alaihi wa sallam) said: There cannot be two Witr prayers in one night. Abu Dawud no. 1439

..Well.. akhi, Witr are wajib, and even the link that akhi ahmed_indian posted says that witr are wajib which must be made qada for as soon as possible.
Do you think you could please show me some proof that two witr cannot be read on one night??

You arent praying 2 witr of the same day, but one of the day another is qadha. Its same with other prayer also, how can we pray 2 dhuhr salah or 2 asr salah? One is for today, another one is for qadha. So your issue hasnt somethign to do with the hadith mentioned above.

The hadith says there cannot be two Witr prayers in one night. [Abu Dawud no. 1439 and At-Tirmithi no. 470]

And he (sallallaahu alaihi wa sallam) also said: Make the end of your prayer at night Witr. [Al-Bukhari no. 990 and Muslim nos. 151, 751]

And he (sallallaahu alaihi wa sallam) said: Whoever feared that he will not get up at the end of the night should perform Witr at the beginning of it. And whoever desired to stand at the end of it should pray Witr at the end of the night. [Muslim no. 755 ]

If it is easy for the Muslim to perform the night prayer at the end of the night, he should seal his prayer with one Rakah of Witr. Whoever found difficulty in this should perform his Witr at the start of the night. And if Allaah makes it easy for him (after that) to stand in prayer, he should offer what he can in units of two Rakahs, and he need not repeat the Witr, for the first Witr is sufficient for him, according to the aforementioned Hadith which is: There cannot be two Witr prayers in one night. [Abu Dawud no. 1439 and At-Tirmithi no. 470]

Shaykh `Abdul-`Azeez Bin Baz(rh)
Fatawa Islamiyah Vol. 2 Page 298

WAllahu alam bis sawab.

 

[Tabassum07]

Akhi, so it isn't wrong to pray witr for that night, and then Witr-Qada at the same time?

 

[daywalker]

Akhi, so it isn't wrong to pray witr for that night, and then Witr-Qada at the same time?

:salam2: you may pray any qadha salah at any time except prohibited time.