:salam2:
Hi Dear BG,
That's the problem I have. What parts are authentic and whar parts are not and if one cannot remain a muslim unless he believes in the injeel (as you say) then one must be able see the glaring anamolies contained in the scriptures.
Yes, there are glaring anamolies contained in scripture. I had requested you to read the book - Is Bible God's Word? carefully. But it looks you even did not opened it. Any open mind reader of the book would be able to see anourmous anamolies/manipulations contained in bible. Moreover, how can a book of God contain bad words/topics such as bastard, sex, incest, numerical contradictions, scientific contradictions,racism, rape, wine promotion etc? So, what we can conclude from the this? Either it is not from God or it is manuplated by the human beings. A pure book should be clean without error / contradictions. That is why i said muslim belevie in
what Jesus preached and
not what that is preached today.
To prove that the Bible has gone through a thorough manipulation, no book or outside source is needed. The contentes of the Bible itself contain a large number of internal testimonies to this fact. Today the fact is so conclusively established and accepted that those who still claim it free from human interference, are either the most ignorant ones or plain liears. Is this fact alone not enough that from among the list of the proclaimed Words of God, the Bible is probably the only book whose original text cannot be provided alongwith its translations. Even the Hindu Books which are much more ancient than the Bible, publish the original Sanskrit text with almost all its translations.
Jesus, a human monotheist prophet, repeatedly called to Allah the One God and warned those who ascribed partners to Him:
"Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and Him Only.'" (Matthew 4:10)
"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One.'" (Mark 12:29)
Jesus emphasized his own humanity:
"As it is, you are determined to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God." (John 8:40)
"By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear." (John 5:30)
So then, whose word must I accept? Those "pastors ,preachers and imams whom you mentioned in your post above? Or the written words of the authors from Moses right through to Paul?
Paul was human being like you and me. Was he born during the time of Prophet Jesus(PBUH). Did he saw him? So, better soften your heart little bit and use your own brain. Pray to God to show you the truth whatever it may be. I am sure if you are sincere you will receive the answer.
Jesus never claimed to be God, or part of a God. He never mentioned Trinity, nor did he appoint a church to entrust itself with reshaping the faith and re-inventing the law. The deviation started with Paul and some others—leaders, clergy, and philosophers—centuries after Jesus's departure. Christianity as we know it today was re-formulated with its concepts of:
- Trinity, centered around the prophet Jesus who was thenceforth called God, begotten son of God
- The sacrosanct Church of Christ , talking and enacting laws in the name of God
- The story of crucifixion and resurrection from the dead
- Original sin and atonement Read for example, according to Paul (NIV):
"At once he [Paul]began to preach in the synagogues that Jesus is the Son of God." (Acts 9:20)
"Remember Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, descended from David. This is my gospel…" (2 Timothy 2:8)
"Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all." (Galatians 5:2)
"What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision?" (Romans 3:1)
No book has ever been written to bring about it's own demise.
That is the reason we believe (based on the current content of bible) that it has been manipulated, otherwise why a Word of God will be in this shape?
During the seventh century CE when Muhammad (peace be upon him) was sent, there were only a few groups of followers of the original message and teachings of Jesus. The Injeel revealed to Jesus no longer existed in any form, as was the case of the Tawrah of Moses before him. They were replaced with the Old and New Testaments written by different human authors selected and sanctioned as holy by the Church ecumenical councils, several centuries after the departure of Jesus.
It was high time then to re-establish the eternal guidance of the Creator to all humanity, but this time in a final eternal form, through the Glorious Qur'an and the detailed teachings and living model of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Jesus prophesized the coming prophet whose universal message will stay forever:
"He is the one who comes after me, the thongs of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie." (John 1:27)
"And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— " (John 14:16 )
As for the Quran. I will NOT pass judgement. I never will. It is a book that is endeared by the Islamic faith. What gives ME the right to prescribe,(when I know insufficient about it) to you muslim folk that it is a fraud and that is a story concocted by a man in a dream?
None whatsoever.
I am NOT God, Nor am I commissioned by God to (perhaps unjustly) to dictate to the billions of muslims out there that they believe in a fraud. That would be way out of line. If that's their belief, then so be it. They have made their choice.
I'm a defender not of christianity, but my belief in the father ALMIGHTY YHWH. and his word. I will not be subservient to some intellectual crackpot in an effort impress other people for the sake of his own benefit. Nor will i accept the notion that the scriptures (especially withiout any concrete foundation or proof) are built upon a big lie.
Sorry Dear, i didn't want to make you angry. I am really sorry if i hurted you in any way. In fact i wrote my answer little late so that you may cool down a little bit. I dont want to argue with you either.
I invite you to look up an eminent Bible scholar whose name is DWIGHT A PRYOR and just to spend an hour of you time to listen to what he interpretes about the scriptures?
Although I do not expect you to change faith, that is your choice, but at least I hope it will provide a good pointer to show how I view my belief in the Almighty.
YUSUF and I are poles apart.He is an ordinary man llike you and I, with his own opinion and nothing more, nothing less. I follow the scriptures, not the opinion of men.
Thank you very much for invitation. Who is Diwit Pryor? He is an ordinary man llike you and I, with his own opinion and nothing more, nothing less. I follow the scriptures, not the opinion of men. Quran (the final and pure scripture) is much clear about the concept of trinity.
Plenty of other definitive descriptions that fit only Prophet Muhammad can be cited from both the Old and New Testaments.
True versus False Prophets
Here are some criteria for a true prophet:
* He should bring signs or proofs that are far beyond human capacity.
* His message should be shown to emanate from without himself.
* He should carry his mission to the end in spite of all obstacles.
* His message would be supported by God to victory over his enemies.
1. Applying these criteria to the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), we find that the main proof he presented is a living miracle, the eternal word of God: the Qur'an. The Arabic text of the Qur'an challenges all generations to produce anything as perfect or splendorous. Even the Prophet's own sayings (Hadith) are very different from the Qur'an. Also, the scientific precision of Qur'anic references to natural phenomena, as well as the wisdom of its decrees, are far beyond the human knowledge and culture at the time of revelation and for several centuries to follow. Please see suggested links at the bottom of this answer.
2. The message and text of the Qur'an did not emanate from within, but from outside, the Prophet Muhammad. This can be proved by the way he was addressed in that extraordinary Book.
The Qur'an repeatedly reminded and drew the attention of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) to his obligations towards Allah, the revelation, the believers, and the unbelievers. Please read the Qur'an 75:16-18, 20:114, 87:6-7, 10:109 and 10:15-16.
He was also repeatedly exhorted and warned against yielding to the temptations and pressures that were surrounding him. Please read the Qur'an: 17:73-75, 13:37-38, 5:49, 2:145, 2:120, 5:67, 6:14, 6:114, 11:112, 15:88, 68:48 and 72: 21-22.
In addition, the Qur'an included admonitions that were directed to the noble Prophet (peace be upon him) in some situations. Please read the Qur'an: 4:105-109, 9:43, 9:117, 9:113, 6:52, 8:67-68, 66:1 and 80:1-11. Sometimes the Qur'an revealed matters that he would have preferred to keep secret in the depths of his pure soul. Please read the Qur'an: 33:37.
It is difficult for a sound mind to imagine that the noble Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) would address himself with the aim of guidance, exhortation, warning, and admonishment, or would reveal things about himself that he would not like other people to know about. Also, it is difficult to believe that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) would, after doing that, convey to the people the Qur'an, which would never be abrogated, deleted, or forgotten.
Occasionally, the revelation was delayed for weeks or months, despite the urgent need of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) to refute the hypocrites and the slanderers. Examples for this are the Qur'anic verses 24:11-17 and 93:1-3.
The Prophet even used his own discretion in interpreting some verses, until revelation was sent down contradicting his opinion. An example of this is verses 9:80-84.
3. The Prophet delivered the revealed message and fought for it, against all odds. His whole twenty-three years of prophethood were years of hardships. The first thirteen years he and his followers were persecuted, tortured, and boycotted by the pagans of Makkah. He refused all offers of kingdom, wealth, or reconciling his message with their pagan beliefs. The following ten years, after immigration to Madinah, witnessed a harsh continuous struggle to spread the faith, with incessant fighting against the hostilities of Arab tribes and Madinah Jews, as well as the preludes to confrontation with the great Roman and Persian Empires. His personal life was the simplest and most ascetic of his contemporaries.
4. Allah supported him and his few early followers with unexpected victories in spite of their poverty, physical weakness, and military and technical inexperience. His message was supported and spread to every corner of the world in a brief time. No human being could have such a biography unless he is a true messenger of God, and truly he was. Allah rewards him for what he honestly delivered and for his striving for the salvation of all nations and generations.
Who Are False Prophets?
Coming now to false prophets, Jesus said, according to the Bible (NIV):
"They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men." (Matthew 15:9)
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves." (Matthew 7:15)
"For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible." (Matthew 24:24)
"For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform signs and miracles to deceive the elect—if that were possible." (Mark 13:22)
There are two categories of false prophets:
* Claimers following their own fancies and whims, seeking worldly gains of prestige, authority, or wealth
* Prominent personalities, over-magnified by their followers, who raise them to the status of prophets or semi-gods
Of the first category are those who invented or changed a creed without authority or supporting evidence from God. Examples are Paul and others, then followed by the Church, which reformulated Christianity against what Jesus stood for. Similarly in Islamic history, several claimants sought to ruin Islam from within, forming deviant sects like Qadianis, Baha'is and extreme Shiite sects such as the Ismailis.
The second category includes several philosophers, scientists, clergy, and leaders, etc., who were considered almost inviolable prophets to be believed and followed unquestionably. Examples are Greek philosophers, Marx, Lenin, Darwin, Saints, Roman emperors and their modern counterparts of the so-called New World Order.
Dear BG, Guidance is in the Hand of Allah only. The purpose of these disucssion is not to put you down but just to present you islamic point of view. You may accept it or reject it using your free will. We believe that guidance comes only from Allah. He guides whom he wills. We can only pray for all of us - May Allah keep all of us on straight path (Ameen)
Kind Regards
