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as long as i know that jannah is for muslims
is it obligatory for called ourselves as a salafi?
if not then why i should call my self as a salafi and make a new identity or sect by the name of islam?
i am a muslim isn´t it enough?
i follow quran and sunnah so i am a sunni.
but why i need a new name (salafi).?
isn´t it depart us from ummah?
 

AbuKhalid

Junior Member
esa2s3 said "i do recall that the salafi saparated them selfs from the main body of the ummah by siding with british ww1 and help to destroy the islamic state which was ruled by sultan abdul hameed the khilafah of islamic state"

If I understand correctly, YOU said the salafis (.. i.e those Muslims who follow the teachings of the 3 best generations which is the sahabas, the tabe3in and the tabat tabe3in) did this. Well, sounds to me they are the ones on the right path ... so what u call the "main body" should have followed them. But sufi rarely do that ... Also, your statement is not a historical fact. Plz do not twist information to fit your desire


Hafz is in need of his own advice here...masud.co.uk is sufi

Junaid said: "if not then why i should call my self as a salafi and make a new identity or sect by the name of islam?"

Junaid, u dont need to call yourself a salafi ... if you follw the salaf, then u r salafi khalas. And if you follow the salaf, then u r not new in that and salafiya is not a new identity. If u dont take from the salaf .. then who do u take from.

For those who claim that salafis do not agree with the 4 imaams and thier madhhab ... thats not true. There's not just the 4 imaams we learn from but we respect and learn from them all. After all, Imam Abu Haneefa rahimahullah was a salaf, as he was a taabi3e. So, to sum it, call me hanafee, maaliki etc... I do learn from them but I do not follow thier mistakes. Thats not disrespect but its understanding that our salaf were human beings and they complement each other. Allahu A'lam
 

Nazihah

Be A Stranger
My apologies

as long as i know that jannah is for muslims
is it obligatory for called ourselves as a salafi?
if not then why i should call my self as a salafi and make a new identity or sect by the name of islam?
i am a muslim isn´t it enough?
i follow quran and sunnah so i am a sunni.
but why i need a new name (salafi).?
isn´t it depart us from ummah?

Assalamualaikum,

I apologise if what I've posted cause a lot confusion. i have no intention at all to do such. I still don't understand why is there still the need to label ourselves. Can't we just call ourselves Muslim. Muslim which follow the Quran and Sunnah Nabi Muhammad (s.a.w). The Quran already state not be divided.

"And hold fast, all together, by the Rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favour on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the Pit of Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus doth Allah make His Signs clear to you: that ye may be guided." Al-i-imran 3:103

"As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least: their affair is with Allah: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did." Al-An'am 6:159

And I must have written wrongly the previous post, instead of sunni, shia etc., it shld be hanafi shafei, etc. And I will edit it soon.

This thread, I believe, soon will be closed. My intention is for all to know what to call themselves, that is, just Muslim. I'm not a scholar, anything posted here might be wrong. We should hold tight to the Quran and sunnah.

Again I apologise for any confusion.

Wasalam.

<Nazihah>
 

IbnAlAawam

Junior Member
Assalamualaikum,

I apologise if what I've posted cause a lot confusion. i have no intention at all to do such. I still don't understand why is there still the need to label ourselves. Can't we just call ourselves Muslim. Muslim which follow the Quran and Sunnah Nabi Muhammad (s.a.w). The Quran already state not be divided.

"And hold fast, all together, by the Rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favour on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the Pit of Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus doth Allah make His Signs clear to you: that ye may be guided." Al-i-imran 3:103

"As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least: their affair is with Allah: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did." Al-An'am 6:159

And I must have written wrongly the previous post, instead of sunni, shia etc., it shld be hanafi shafei, etc. And I will edit it soon.

This thread, I believe, soon will be closed. My intention is for all to know what to call themselves, that is, just Muslim. I'm not a scholar, anything posted here might be wrong. We should hold tight to the Quran and sunnah.

Again I apologise for any confusion.

Wasalam.

<Nazihah>

:salam2:

It's ok sister. I thought that was what you meant too.
Someone started talking about "Salafis" and the word salafi nowadays means many different things and so confused people even more...

:hawla:
 
Junaid, u dont need to call yourself a salafi ... if you follw the salaf, then u r salafi khalas.
And if you follow the salaf, then u r not new in that and salafiya is not a new identity. If u dont take from the salaf .. then who do u take from.

it doesn´t mean that you have to make a new sects by calling yourselves as salafi
we accept islam for that reason we are muslims, we follow sunnah for that reason we are sunii and now a new one: we get those from salfs for that reason we are also salafi!

I do learn from them but I do not follow thier mistakes. Thats not disrespect but its understanding that our salaf were human beings and they complement each other. Allahu A'lam

what you mean about their mistakes?
you mean they quote something wrong or interpriate something wrong from hadits and you guess know better then them or you can interpriate better then those olama´s?
i can feel that you each and every guess who call you self as salafi ;behave your self as you all are olama and know always best about the quran and sunnah.
 

Bluegazer

Junior Member
This post was a repetition of part of the next post. That's why I wrote this message instead. Please read my next post.
 

Bluegazer

Junior Member
Assalamu Alaikum,


To brother Hafz, please explain why you quoted from the following website in your post #40 on this thread:

http://www.masud.co.uk


That is a Sufi website, and an extremist Sufi site by the looks of some articles in it.


For example, there's an article in that website entitled "The Omnipresence of the Prophet -peace be upon him-". It was written by Dr. G. F. Haddad.

Source: http://www.masud.co.uk/ISLAM/misc/hazarnazar.htm


What does "Omnipresence" mean?


According to the dictionary Merriam-Webster:

the quality or state of being omnipresent

Source: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/Omnipresence


And what does "omnipresent" mean?

present in all places at all times

Source: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/omnipresent


Do you believe that the Prophet [peace be upon him] is present in all places at all times?!


Let's see some of the other statements in that article by Dr. Haddad:

There are other verses that affirm that the Prophet, sall-Allahu `alayhi wa sallam, hears and sees the deeds of human beings. Allah Most High said: [And know that the Messenger of Allah is among you] (49:7). In the verses [Allah and His Messenger will see your conduct] (9:94) and [Act! Allah will behold your actions, and (so will) His Messenger and the believers] (9:105), the Prophet’s, sall-Allahu `alayhi wa sallam, perception is put on a par with that of the Lord of the worlds Who sees and encompasses all on the one hand and, on the other, that of all the living believers.


Notice the part I coloured red.


Do you believe that the Prophet's [peace be upon him] perception was the same as that of Allah the Almighty?!


Doesn't that statement contradict the following verse of the Qur'an?:

Say, "I hold not for myself [the power of] benefit or harm, except what Allah has willed. And if I knew the unseen, I could have acquired much wealth, and no harm would have touched me. I am not except a warner and a bringer of good tidings to a people who believe."

[Translation of the meanings of the Qur'an 7:188]


There are many obviously wrong statements like that in that article [which was posted on the website www.masud.co.uk]. Therefore, please be careful of that website. It's obviously Sufi, and of the extreme Sufis as well.

_________________________________________________________________


To brother junaid hasan,


You wrote the following in post #45 in response to AbuKhalid's statement in post #42 "I do learn from them but I do not follow thier mistakes. Thats not disrespect but its understanding that our salaf were human beings and they complement each other. Allahu A'lam":

what you mean about their mistakes?
you mean they quote something wrong or interpriate something wrong from hadits and you guess know better then them or you can interpriate better then those olama´s?
i can feel that you each and every guess who call you self as salafi ;behave your self as you all are olama and know always best about the quran and sunnah.


My question is as follows:

Do you believe that Imam Abu Hanifa was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam Maalik was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam as-Shaafi'i was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbal was infallible?


If you believe that they were infallible, then -in this particular point only- it's the same as the Catholics who say the Pope is infallible when he issues a statement ex cathedra.


You have to understand that when we say that they made mistakes, that in no way whatsoever means that we disrespect them or belittle their knowledge and their contribution to teaching and spreading Islam.


The Four Imams themselves told us not to follow them blindly and to leave their rulings if they contradict evidence from the Qur'an and/or the authentic Sunnah. Brothers Mabsoot and Imad have quoted these sayings of the Imams in the following thread:

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9447


Best regards,

Bluegazer

Wassalamu Alaikum
 

Bluegazer

Junior Member
Assalamu Alaikum,


The following is the answer of Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid to question no. 1087 [Ruling on saying “I am a Salafi”]:

Question:
I have come to know a person who follows the Salafi da’wah and I have read a book about this movement. I believe that the Salafi da’wah is correct and that those who follow it have the sound ‘aqeedah belief), but there are some matters I want to ask about
How correct is it from an Islamic point of view to use the word “Salafi” and to describe oneself in this way?
If a person says that he is a Salafi, is he praising himself? Is this considered to be dividing the ummah?
If we tell the Sufis that their madhhab is not correct, and that neither the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) or his Companions taught it, they will respond that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) or his Companions did not use the word “Salafi” either, so how should we reply to them?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

We can answer this question with the following points:

0- Each person is obliged to follow the guidance of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and his Companions. This is the way of Ahl al-Sunnah wa’l-Jamaa’ah and the followers of the righteous predecessors (al-salaf al-saalih). Allaah says (interpretation of the meanings):

“Say (O Muhammad): ‘This is my way; I invite unto Allaah with sure knowledge, I and whosoever follows me with sure knowledge. And Glorified and Exalted be Allaah (above all that they associate as partners with Him). And I am not of the mushrikeen (polytheists… those who worship others along with Allaah or set up rivals or partners to Allaah).” [Yoosuf 12:108]

“And whoever contradicts and opposes the Messenger (Muhammad) after the right path has been shown clearly to him, and follows other than the believers’ way, We shall keep him in the oath he has chosen, and burn him in Hell – what an evil destination!” [al-Nisa’ 4:115]

Whoever follows the way of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) belongs to the salaf al-saalih, even if the people call him something else; by the same token, whoever goes against it and deviates from the Sunnah is an innovator, even if he claims to be a Salafi.

1- If a person calls himself a Salafi to express his gratitude for having been guided to this way, or to clearly distinguish himself from innovation, then this is OK and is allowed in Islam. But if he says it only for the purpose of praising himself, then this is not allowed, because Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): “… therefore justify not yourselves…” [al-Najm 53:32 – Yusuf ‘Ali’s translation]. Similarly, it is not allowed if it is said in a spirit of tribalism or sectarianism, because such attitudes are forbidden, as is clear from the following story: Jaabir ibn ‘Abd-Allaah said: “A man from the Muhaajireen shoved a man from the Ansaar from behind, so each man’s people gathered around him, saying ‘O Muhaajireen (come and help)!’ or ‘O Ansaar (come and help)!’ News of this reached the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and he said, ‘Stop this, for it is repulsive.’ Then he said, ‘What is this call of the people of jaahiliyyah? What is this call of the people of jaahiliyyah?’” (Reported by Imaam Ahmad, 14105; the hadeeth is also to be found in al-Saheehayn). The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) called it the call of the people of jaahiliyyah and described it as repulsive, even though the words “Ansaari” and “Muhaajiri” are Islamic words, the first referring to those who supported Allaah and His Messenger, and the second referring to those who left the land of kufr and migrated to Allaah and His Messenger. Why were they described in this manner? Because in this instance, the words were not used in a permissible fashion; the usage was a sectarian and political one that could have led to fighting between the two groups. The same applies to the word “Salafi”.

2- If the Ahl al-Sunnah and the salaf draw a line between themselves and the innovators, this is not considered to be dividing the ummah, as those who criticize the use of this word think is the case, but this distancing of oneself has to be done in accordance with the degree of bid’ah – whether it is major or minor – and should be regulated by the overall interests of the Islamic da’wah.

3- The Sufi claims mentioned in the question are not valid. The denunciation is not merely because of the word “Sufi”, which is a general word that may be applied to things approved of in Islam, such as asceticism (zuhd) and fear of Allaah, or it may be applied to innovations such as monasticism and extremism. Rather the denunciation is because of the various types of shirk, major and minor, that are connected with Sufism and its tareeqahs. The word Tasawwuf (Sufism) now refers to the Sufi tareeqahs and the kinds of innovations they have. Sufism – as is obvious from their books and how Sufis actually are – includes deviant ideas of kufr, such as hulool (incarnation or the belief that the Creator may be indwelling in His creation – exalted be Allaah above what they say), ittihaad (union) and wahdat al-wujood (pantheism or the unity of existence, which is the belief that the Creator and His creation are the same thing, and that everything in existence is Allaah – exalted be Allaah above what they say), and going to extremes in what they say about the awliya’, in addition to their innovations in the matter of acts of worship and awraad (du’aa’s).

4- The one who is seeking salvation has to work hard to gain beneficial knowledge and do righteous deeds, and he should avoid vain arguments and futile discussions in which there is no benefit.

We ask Allaah to help us and you to follow the truth and act upon it. May Allaah bless our Prophet Muhammad.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid

Source: http://islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=1087&ln=eng


Regards,

Bluegazer

Wassalamu Alaikum
 

AllpraisetoAllah

Junior Member
:salam2:

Jazakalahu-khayran bluegazer for the link to the post you gave :The Sayings of the Four Imams on blind-following (Taqlid)

I think it explains it all about that u can follow a madhab but where not suppose to follow them blindly and that all the four Imams follow Quran and Sunnah. And subhana'Allah they the 4 imams where against blind following like they said: When a hadeeth is found to be saheeh, then that is my madhhabThe daliil u can read in that post masha'Allah..

A REMINDER :
Abu Haneefah (rahimahullaah)

The first of them is Abu Haneefah Nu'maan ibn Thaabit, whose companions have narrated from him various sayings and diverse warnings, all of them leading to one thing: the obligation to accept the Hadeeth, and to give up following the opinions of the imaams which contradict it:

1. "When a hadeeth is found to be saheeh, then that is my madhhab."

In another narration, "Woe to you, O Ya'qub[25]! Do not write down everything you hear from me, for it happens that I hold one opinion today and reject it tomorrow, or hold one opinion tomorrow and reject it the day after tomorrow."[26]

As for Imaam Maalik ibn Anas, he said:


1. "Truly I am only a mortal: I make mistakes (sometimes) and I am correct (sometimes). Therefore, look into my opinions: all that agrees with the Book and the Sunnah, accept it; and all that does not agree with the Book and the Sunnah, ignore it."[28]

2. "Everyone after the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) will have his sayings accepted and rejected - not so the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam)."[29]

Shaafi'i (rahimahullaah) said:

. "The sunnahs of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) reach, as well as escape from, every one of us. So whenever I voice my opinion, or formulate a principle, where something contrary to my view exists on the authority of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam), then the correct view is what the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) has said, and it is my view."[32]

2. "The Muslims are unanimously agreed that if a sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) is made clear to someone, it is not permitted[33] for him to leave it for the saying of anyone else."[34]

3. "If you find in my writings something different to the Sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam), then speak on the basis of the Sunnah of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam), and leave what I have said."

4. "When a hadeeth is found to be saheeh, then that is my madhhab."[36]

Imaam Ahmad was the foremost among the Imaams in collecting the Sunnah and sticking to it, so much so that he even "disliked that a book consisting of deductions and opinions be written."[43] Because of this he said:

"Do not follow my opinion; neither follow the opinion of Maalik, nor Shaafi'i, nor Awzaa'i, nor Thawri, but take from where they took."[44]

In one narration: "Do not copy your Deen from anyone of these, but whatever comes from the Prophet (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) and his Companions, take it; next are their Successors, where a man has a choice."

"Whoever rejects a statement of the Messenger of Allaah (sallallaahu `alaihi wa sallam) is on the brink of destruction."[48]
 

hafz

Junior Member
Bluegazer, you are very aggresive a sign of immaturity and youth

My dear brother you jump up too quick .I quoted those websites from another site I only skimmed through the articles. I must apologise in that because I too do not agree with some of the things you quoted. .But I have seen some valid points raised in the links to the articles I suggested ! Remember a wise man will even learn from writting on the wall .
Taqlid is mis- understood by you , please read the following articles .Blugazer to follow taqlid it is not necessary to think the 4 imams are infallible .
Don't just base your opinion on these research further and keep asking Allah s.w.t for guidance .There are many non-muslims who read the Quraan but guidance only comes to those whom Allah wills to guide .
I do feel that you have too quickly decided what is right .My brother or shall I call you my son , it is often the case that the scholars do not teach everything right and sometimes you have to pick and choose the information.
But you will find that by praying to Allah , Allah will guide you to the right path .It may not come immediately but as long as your niyyah is always for guidance and are ready to admit you are wrong Allah s.w.t will not forsake you .When I have time to dig up the information with the relevant proof I will present you with my argument.
And Brother I am a sister !
But this is a good book I would read it for all my brothers and sisters and ask Allah s.w.t for guidance.

http://www.cometoislam.com/fiqh/legal/main.htm
http://www.cometoislam.com/fiqh/question2.htm

For all my brothers please do not be blinded by your convictions but let Allah guide you and indeed all of us.
My brothers I held beliefs like you and had the same zest and nothing anyone could say would have turned me .
I had another habit of praying and really asking Allah for the smallest thing .Many nights of asking for guidance and many nights of Istakhara and salatul hajah brought me where I am.
We shouldnt be like the atheist or the hindu , the bareliawi etc who stand firm in their beliefs following their own convictions
We should open our hearts and ask Allah s.w.t for the truth and guidance .
 
Assalamu Alaikum,

My question is as follows:

Do you believe that Imam Abu Hanifa was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam Maalik was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam as-Shaafi'i was infallible?
Do you believe that Imam Ahmad ibn Hanbal was infallible?


If you believe that they were infallible, then -in this particular point only- it's the same as the Catholics who say the Pope is infallible when he issues a statement ex cathedra.


You have to understand that when we say that they made mistakes, that in no way whatsoever means that we disrespect them or belittle their knowledge and their contribution to teaching and spreading Islam.


Bluegazer

Wassalamu Alaikum

i think brother you didn´t understand what i meant!

i never follow those imams because of their private life
i follow only their those steps which is only is related with quran and sunnah.

so now who are those people to say that those steps are wrong?(that means the interpretations is wrong)

most of those people who called them self as salafis and try to understand by their new style to understand quran and sunnah they point it out that those imams are wrong or they make mistakes.(mistakes to understand quran and sunnah)

i follow blindly quran and sunnah ,not the imams

i never follow a imams word if he doesn´tt show the evidence.

and all the imams have evidence.

so why there are a question about mistakes or as you say infallible?
 

abdallahbilal

Long Live Palestine
Proud not to follow Sunna but not to be a Sunni...

SISTER NO DISRESPECT BUT THAT DOES NT MAKE SENSE BECAUSE

i dissagree withthe speaker did not tell the whole truth the verse said there will be 73 sects and all of them will be in the hellfire apart from 1 and the muslims around him said "which is the saved sect" he said "that which i and my companion(salaf) are on today" so we are instructed to follow the the the quran and the sunna and the salaf in belife and in action to make clear to sincere muslims not to follow the 72 astray groupsby calling our sunni or salafi

salam

Sister or brother,
With all due respect, I totally disagree with you.
You disagreed with the speaker's not saying the full Hadith (which u mistook for a "verse") but you also missed his quotations from the Quran:
None of the names the different Islamic sects now adopt was used in the day of the prophet (pbuh)... The names and titles assumed today are innovated bed3a which is certainly condemned by Islam.

I follow the path of the sunna nabaweyyah (Quran and authentic hadith) and good salaf and like the prophet and all of his companions but I'm proud I'm NOT a salafi or sunni (although I live in a country that names itself Sunni)... You might be amazed, but yes, the name really is a bed3a (im not fanatic here but it is as simple as that)!!!! It's dangerous to assume such a name because ALLAH alone has the right to name us and he already did so:

And strive in His cause as ye ought to strive, (with sincerity and under discipline). He has chosen you, and has imposed no difficulties on you in religion; it is the cult of your father Abraham. It is He Who has named you Muslims, both before and in this (Revelation); that the Messenger may be a witness for you, and ye be witnesses for mankind! So establish regular Prayer, give regular Charity, and hold fast to Allah! He is your Protector - the Best to protect and the Best to help! (Al-Hajj 22:78)!!

Sunnis, dear fellow Muslim, MIGHT be the closest to the rope of Allah and the way of the prophet, but Allah (God Knows Best) on the day of judgment may punnish (or forgive) them for Innovating such a name and contradicting the very thing they claim they are against (which is innovation in Deen)...

I hope some day the salafi's will issue a fatwa to disregard the usage of such a name (even for mere distinction) and adopt proudly [Muslims] because it brings about fitna...

Believe it or not brother or sister, even the early scholars did not name themselves Salafis or Sunnis or Shafi3is or Hanafis (etc), it was the mistake of some later followers...

Wallaho a3lam!!!
 

truth4real

Junior Member
EXCUSE ME THIS POST IS A BIT ARRONGANT ITSELF DO YOU THINK YOU ARE A PROPHET OR PROPHETESS TALKING DOWN TO US LIKE THIS
 

abdallahbilal

Long Live Palestine
I by mistake used the following as a title for my first post...

Proud not to follow Sunna but not to be a Sunni...

The first "not " is a typo which I wrote by accident and I really meant

Proud to follow Sunna but not to be a Sunni...

:astag:
 
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