help clarifying some salat issues.

muslimguy

Junior Member
:salam2:

I started going to a new Masjid lately, and the brothers over there are mostly Pakistanis, the problem is they don't pray heel to heel and they don't fill in the gaps between them, so there is space left btween each of the Mussalin, and when I try to make my feet touch the persons next to me they 'll move them away and they kinda get upset sometimes.

so I was wondering if anybody here can explain to me what is going on? and if that is from the sunna then can you give me a proof of it.

jazakom Allah khairan

:salam2:
 

Optimist

قل هو الله أحد
Interesting question. I've just looked it up on Islamweb.net and apparently it is not a must. It is from a lecture for Sheikh Abdullah Aljibrin. Some sahabah described tucking the heel by the heel but according to the sheikh this was not meant to be understood in literal sense.

Allah knows best.
 

Libinette

Umm Zubayr
Here, at my local masjiid, the imam usually reminds everyone, please make sure you are shoulder to shoulder, foot to foot, check the line before if they're any gaps... yes, some people don't respect these conditions, and others follow these to the letter, squeezing you during your salaat.. take a middle path.. if the other person is moving their feet away, don't try to join again :D
 

Shahzad

Junior Member
absolutely soulzcore. We stand shoulder to shoulder, with feet just little apart.
dont bother "muslim guy". They are right and u r right as well
 

seeking_peace1

Your Sister in Islam
:salam2:

I started going to a new Masjid lately, and the brothers over there are mostly Pakistanis, the problem is they don't pray heel to heel and they don't fill in the gaps between them, so there is space left btween each of the Mussalin, and when I try to make my feet touch the persons next to me they 'll move them away and they kinda get upset sometimes.

so I was wondering if anybody here can explain to me what is going on? and if that is from the sunna then can you give me a proof of it.

jazakom Allah khairan

:salam2:

:salam2:

well i'm not surprised.thats very common here in pakistan infact in the subcontinent.ppl have no knowledge about it.but its Mandatory.it has been ordained to stand shoulder to shoulder and foot to foot.

"Hadrat Ans RA narrates that Rasool Allah SAW ordained "“Straighten your Saf and stand close to each other, verily I can see you from the behind as well” (it was Rasool Allah SAW’s miracle given by Allah SWT). Hadrat Ans RA continues by saying that “then everyone of us would stand with shoulder to shoulder and foot to foot”. (Bukhari Alazan bab ulzaq almunkab bilmunkab walqadam bilqadam fi alsaf 725, Muslim 434).

Hadrat Nauman bin Basheer RA narrates Rasool Allah SAW facing people said “O, people straighten your saf, straighten your saf, straighten your saf. Listen! By Allah SWT if you did not straighten your saf then Allah SWT will create differences and scatter (disperse) in your hearts.” Hadrat Nauman bin Basheer RA continues that then everyone was standing being glued ankle-to-ankle, knee-to-knee, shoulder-to-shoulder with his companion.(Abu Daood.Al-Salat. Babu tasweeya Al-sfoof, 662).

Hadrat Ans RA narrates that Rasool Allah SAW said “stay really close to each other in your saf and bring closeness in between two safs (means do not leave distance between two safs) and keep your necks equal (i.e. stand on an even surface or equal place so that your necks are equal). By Allah SWT to whom I will return (who has custody on my life), verily I see iblees entering empty or wide spaces between saf as if it is a small black goat”.(Abu Daood.Al-Salat,babu tasweeya Al-sfoof 667).

Ya Allah SWT forgive me for any unintentional mistake I made in quoting these Hadiths ameen.and sorry for not good enough english.

:wasalam:
 

muslimguy

Junior Member
:salam2:

jakaki Allah khairan sister seeking peace, but I have heard from one of the brothers saying something like abu hanifa RA is the one who said we should pray that way. wallah A'llam. do you know anything abut this?

:salam2:
 

muslimguy

Junior Member
absolutely soulzcore. We stand shoulder to shoulder, with feet just little apart.
dont bother "muslim guy". They are right and u r right as well

:salam2:

brother could you please provide a daleel from the sunna?

jazaka Allah Khairan

:salam2:
 

Peace2u

Turn To Islam
:salam2:
well i'm not surprised.thats very common here in pakistan infact in the subcontinent.ppl have no knowledge about it.but its Mandatory.it has been ordained to stand shoulder to shoulder and foot to foot.

Salam

One of the local Imams at my Masjid said of the reason why it's preferred to stand shoulder to shoulder and foot to foot is to not allow Shaitan the chance to come in-between us while we pray.

Peace2u
 
brothers alhamdulillah we had also discussion about this topic


Joining ankles in prayers?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Shaykh Muhammad ibn Salih al-'Uthaymin, rahimahullah

س234: ما المعتمد في إقامة الصفوف؟ وهل يشرع للمصلي أن يلصق كعبه بكعب من بجانبه؟ أفتونا مأجورين؟
الجواب: الصحيح أن المعتمد في تسوية الصف محاذاة الكعبين بعضهما بعضاً، لا رؤوس الأصابع، وذلك لأن البدن مركب على الكعب، والأصابع تختلف الأقدام فيها، فهناك القدم الطويل، وهناك القدم القصير، فلا يمكن ضبط التساوي إلا بالكعب .
وأما إلصاق الكعبين بعضهما ببعض فلا شك أنه وارد عن الصحابة –رضي الله عنهم- فإنهم كانا يسوون الصفوف بإلصاق الكعبين بعضهما ببعض ، أي أن كل واحد منهم يلصق كعبه بكعب جاره لتحقق المحاذاة وتسوية الصف، فهو ليس مقصوداً لذاته لكنه مقصود لغيره كما ذكر بعض أهل العلم، ولهذا إذا تمت الصفوف وقام الناس ينبغي لكل واحد أن يلصق كعبه بكعب صاحبه لتحقق المساواة، وليس معنى ذلك أن يلازم هذا الإلصاق ويبقى ملازماً له في جميع الصلاة .
ومن الغلو في هذه المسألة ما يفعله بعض الناس من كونه يلصق كعبه بكعب صاحبه ويفتح قدميه فيما بينهما حتى يكون بينه وبين جاره في المناكب فرجة فيخالف السنة في ذلك، والمقصود أن المناكب والأكعب تتساوى

Question: What is the relied-upon position regarding the straightening of the rows (sufuf)? Is it prescribed for the praying person to join his ankle (ka'b) to the ankle of the person next to him? Please give us the fatwa, may you be rewarded.
Answer: That which is correct is that the relied-upon position regarding the straightening of the row is that the ankles should be in line with each other, not the ends of the toes, and that is because the body is supported upon the ankle, and the feet differ in regard to the toes, because some feet are long, and some feet are short. So it is impossible to ensure straightness except by the ankles (i.e. by the ankles being in line with each other).

As for joining the ankles to the ankles of the others, then no doubt this is reported from the Sahabah, radhiyallahu 'anhum, for they would straighten the rows by joining ankles, that is, every one of them would join his ankle with the ankle of his neighbour to ensure being line, and the straightness of the row. So it is not meant as an aim in itself, but rather as a means of achieving another aim, as some of the people of knowledge have mentioned. Therefore, when the rows are completed and the people are standing, it is befitting for every one of them to join his ankle to the ankle of his companion to ensure straightness. It does not mean that he should continue this joining and remain so for the whole salah.

From the extremism that has occurred with regard to this issue is what is done by some people in that one of them will join his ankle to the ankle of his companion, and he will spread his feet so far apart until there is a gap between his shoulder and the shoulder of his companion, so he will oppose the Sunnah by doing that. But the aim is that the shoulders and ankles should be in line with each other.
(quote end)

1. Hadhrat Umar (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates that Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) said: “Straighten the sufoof, line up the shoulders, close the gaps and become tender in the hands of your brothers. Do not leave any gaps for shaitaan. Whoever joins the saff, Allah will join him. And whoever cuts the saff Allah will cut him.” (Bukhari & Abu Dawood)

[Become tender: that is to comply when a brother musalli in the saff touches your shoulder indicating that you should bring it in line with the shoulders of the other musallis in the saff.]

2. Hadhrat Baraa’ Bin Aazib (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates that Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) used to enter the saff from end to end, touching our chests and our shoulders. He would say:

“Do not be irregular (in your rows), for then your hearts will become irregular (i.e. discord will overtake you).” He would (also) say:

“ Verily, Allah Azza Wa Jal and His Malaaikah dispatch Salaam on the first sufoof”

[When the word ‘Salaat’ is related to Allah Ta ‘ala, it denotes Rahmat, i.e. He sends down mercy. When it is related to the Malaaikah, it means that they supplicate to Allah Ta`ala to send His mercy upon His servants.]

3. Hadhrat Anas Bin Maalik (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates that the Iqaamah for Salaat was given. Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) turned towards us and said: “Straighten your sufoof and stand close together, for verily I see you from behind.” In a narration of Hadhrat Anas (radhiyallahu anhu) it is mentioned: “Everyone among us would put his shoulder with the shoulder of his companion (alongside) and his foot with his foot.”

4. Hadhrat Anas (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates that Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) said: “Join your sufoof and stand close together, and stand in line with (your) necks. I take oath by The Being in Whose power is my life that most certainly I see shaitaan entering the gaps in the saff as if he is a lamb.” (Abu Dawood)

5. Abul Qaasim Jadli (rahmatullah alayh) said :“I heard Nu’maan Bin Basheer (radhiyallahu anhu) say: ‘Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) turned towards the people (the musallis) and say three times: ‘By Allah! Most certainly, you should straighten your sufoof otherwise Allah will create discord in your hearts.’ Thereafter I saw that a man would attach his shoulder to the shoulder of his companion (the one standing alongside), his knee to the knee of his companion and his ankle to the ankle of his companion.” (Bukhari & Abu Dawood)

6. Nu’maan Bin Basheer (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates: “Rasulullah (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) would arrange (set in order) our sufoof. One day he came out (from his home) and saw a man (in the saff) whose chest was protruding in front of the (chests of) the community (i.e. the musallis). He then commented: ‘Straighten your sufoof otherwise Allah will cast discord in your faces (i.e. in the words coming from your mouths).” (Tirmizi)

7. Maalik Ibn Abi Aamir Ansaari (radhiyallahu anhu) narrates: “Uthmaan Bin Affaan (radhiyallahu anhu) would recite in his Khutbah: ‘When the Salaat is ready, arrange the sufoof properly and line up with the shoulders’ (i.e. the shoulders of the musallis should all be in line and touching).” (Muatta Imaam Muhammad)

8. Hadhrat Anas (radhiyallahu anhu) narrated that Nabi (sallallahu alayhi wasallam) said: “Join your sufoof and draw close among yourselves and line up with the necks.” Reported by Abu Dawood and Nisai. Authenticated by Ibn Hibbaan. (Bulooghul Maraam)--*!I’laaus Sunnan

:salam2:

brother could you please provide a daleel from the sunna?

jazaka Allah Khairan

:salam2:


These are about all the narrations pertaining to the manner and style of standing in Jamaat Salaat. Explaining these Ahadith, Imaam Bukhaari (rahmatullah alayh) states in the section captioned:

“JOINING SHOULDER TO SHOULDER”:

“This is what the Jamhoor have said: ‘Verily, the meaning (of joining in this context) is complete nearness and lining up, not actual joining (or touching).’” Al-Haafiz said: “The meaning of this is to emphasise in straightening the saff and closing the gaps.” And Aini too has said so. With this, the indication is towards emphasis in straightening the sufoof and closing the gaps. Qustulaani and others have also said this.”

(Laamiud Duraari—commentary of Bukhari)

In Faidhul Baari it is reported as follows:

“It is stated in Sharhul Wiqaayah: ‘The musalli should stand apart (with his feet) so that there is a distance of four fingers in between them, and that is also the view of Imaam Shaafi (rahmatullah alayh), In another view it is said that the distance (between the feet) should be one hand (i.e. about 10 cm).’ (The author says): I did not find any difference of opinion among the Salf (i.e. Salf-e-Saaliheen) between the stance (of the musalli) in Jama’ah and in infiraad (i.e. performing alone). There is no difference regarding the gap (between the feet). It is not that the spreading of the feet should be more in Jama’ah than when performing Salaat alone.”

The summary of this is: When we do not find the Sahaabah and the Taabi-een differentiating in their standing position between Jama’ah and individual Salaat, then we understand that the only meaning of Rasulullah’s statement of ‘joining the shoulders’ is to line up closely and to abstain from leaving gaps (between the musallis).

The following appears in Laamiud Duraari, Commentary of Saheeh Bukhaari:

“The Authorities (the Fuqaha) stated that it is best for the musalli to keep his feet about four fingers apart. They did not say that the feet should be united in ruku’ or sajdah. Aini says in Binaayah: ‘It is appropriate that there be the distance of four fingers between the feet of the musalli, for verily, this is nearest to khushoo.’”

Ibn Umar (radhiyallahu anhuma) would not spread (widely) his feet nor would the one foot touch the other, but between this there would be neither much closeness nor much distance.

In Raddul Mihtaar it is reported as follows:

“The meaning of joining ankles to ankles is that everyone in the Jama’ah should stand alongside the other (i.e. in a straight line). So is it said in Fataawa Samarqand).” (I’laaus Sunan)

From all the narrations and views of the Muhadditheen and Fuqaha of the Khairul Quroon era it is abundantly clear that the Hadith which mentions joining foot with foot does not have a literal meaning. It simply means that the feet should be all in line, and this is achieved by the heels of the musallis all being in the same line. This will ensure a straight saff on which the emphasis of all the Ahadith is

and further inf: http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18243

my personal advice is if any brother doesn´t want to join ankles then try to ar least to stay shoulder to shoulder.And when you tell him about this inshallah with hikmah and patient because normal weak muslims are not aware of this things.
 
:salam2:

jakaki Allah khairan sister seeking peace, but I have heard from one of the brothers saying something like abu hanifa RA is the one who said we should pray that way. wallah A'llam. do you know anything abut this?

:salam2:

Akhi imam abu hanifa didn´t say something from his self but from hadith, we are not allow to practise his quotation if its without prove(quran and sunnah).

Ahle sunnah waal jamat doesn´t follow any quotation of imam´s but only quran and hadith.

And i like always your post because you ask about daleel.
We should show daleel and not keep quite just by saying this and that imam said it.
 
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