The Blame Game

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q8penpals

Junior Member
As Muslims, I think if we want to improve the image of our religion, we need to stop doing things that we do not want others to do - stereotyping people based on where they are from.

I realize that being a Muslim is foremost, but there are many posts here and on other "Islamic" websites blame "the west" - so you are blaming ME for things, since I was born and raised in the west? What about all the Muslims in the west? What about the families of converts?
:SMILY309:


I personally stop reading posts (on this site and other Islamic sites) as soon as they start blaming the western countries for every ill in the world - is the west 100% right all the time? No, of course not, and I am not trying to say that they are. Many times though, they are the only countries who are willing (or able) to help others. Due to the historically booming economy (which is slightly sagging of late), America sends TONS of food to countries all over the world every year (even when we are going into debt as a country!), plus foreign aid money, but we barely get a thank you - we get "how come you don't give more?"

No, I don't hear anyone saying anything good about the west, but gee, people from darn near every country in the world are practically banging down the doors to get in! If the west is such a great "evil" why are so many (Muslims included) trying to get in or not choosing to leave? Maybe because it is not that bad, or they could do worse somewhere else.

Everyone, every country, every leader, every group of people, everyone is responsible for their own actions/reactions to situations they find themselves in. Ghandi, Martin Luther King Jr, Susan B Anthony, Rosa Parks, and others - they found their rights by being persecuted and peacefully working to end their various oppressions - not bombing, kidnapping, or sitting around going "poor us, we are oppressed!"

So please, the next time the west is blamed, please remember that you are blaming millions of Muslims who live in the west as well.

Lana
 

Oem Soufiane

Junior Member
salaam aleikum,

there is a difference between a muslim and an arab (or asian, i heard there are a lot of asian muslims in the UK). I can't hardly imagine that a practising serieous muslim wants to live in the US. And by the west, we mean the western governments, not the people who live there and live in peace with us. Since governments send troops to Iraq and Afghanistan and looking away from the situation in Palestina, and feed the fear of the people by spreading anti-islamic propanda wrapped in politicly correct words. Making it hard for us to be ourselfves in hijaab.
I think i know what you mean, people from outside of Europe always complaining, but still wanting to stay here. but there is a difference between a practising muslim and a 'I-will-go-to-jannah-because-my-parents-are-muslims' muslim
 

Mabsoot

Amir
Staff member
Assalamu Alaykum,

Firstly, Nobody is attacking or critising the American People. Secondly, it is true that many people are responsible for their own actions and not all the blame can be passed to the West. But, it all depends on WHAT the problem is.

Nobody is blaming you dear sister. There are many Americans and people from the West here. Im one of them, I am British. I critisise Blair and my government because they are some of the leading criminals and mass murderers this world has today!

There is nothing wrong with saying that. The UK has been invading and massacring people for hundreds of years. Why should we keep hiding these facts? Its our right to talk out and make sure the world knows the reality of what is happening.
Look through the Following Link to get a better idea at what is happening in our world, i put it together, it is all based on Leading independent Human Rights Organisations.. Nothing Biased:

Why Angry Protests?


Why is it OK to demonise and hound Muslims for the actions of a minority? Why should Muslims be painted evil for a group that has nothing to do with Islam?

The US, the UK and other countries in the West have been responsible for some of the worlds greatest human rights abuses and atrocities. 9/11 dwarfs their murder, lies and distortion. We Let The FACTS Speak.

Our arguments are not based on emotions or propoganda. But on Clean Hard Facts. We are talking the number of Dead, (Which the USUK Coalition will not count, as the Bush administration said "We Dont do civillian body counts". 700,000 people have since died in Iraq, who would have been alive had Bush and his cronies NOT insisted on expanding their already buldging Wallets. Greed doth destroyeth not just men but lays waste nations.

From the evil colonialisation of the poor all over the world through to backing tyrants like Saddam Hussein, Aiding and appeasing evil racist states such as South Africa and Israel, and supplying these kind of states with bombs and weapons. The recent killing of 1000+ Lebanese was testimony to the failure of either the US or the UK to have any heart.

It is a stone cold killing machine which does not favour the poor. Its so called "Aid plans" favour only those who give them support. Aid Assistance is a joke.

Aid Money is Mostly Tied to Various Restrictive Conditions

Come on, a country which loves to bomb, "shock and awe" some of the worlds poorest countries is going to be handing free checks, food, money to poor people? Nothing is for free, and the biggest blood suckers of all will make sure of that. Lets look at the facts:

In their 2000 report looking back at the previous year, the Reality of Aid 2000 (Earthscan Publications, 2000, p.81), reported in their US section that “71.6% of its bilateral aid commitments were tied to the purchase of goods and services from the US.”

So, they have to BUY stuff from the US or else they get No Aid. Why is it the Poor African Nations are in debt??? Their debt far exceeds their GDP. This is because the fat cats who sat in the World Trade Center and other places, made plans on how to monopolise and make as much money as possible from these poor people.
Almost half of all foreign aid can be considered “phantom aid”, aid which does not help fight poverty, and is based on a broader definition of foreign aid that allows double counting and other problems to occur. Furthermore, some 50% of all technical assistance is said to be wasted because of inappropriate usage on expensive consultants, their living expenses, and training (some $11.8 billion).

Aid appears to have established as a priority the importance of influencing domestic policy in the recipient countries
— Benjamin F. Nelson, International Affairs Budget: Framework for Assessing Relevance, Priority and Efficiency, (Washington, DC: General Accounting Office, October 30, 1997)

So, aid is used to steer domestic policy. The US threatened Many small and poor countries that they would lose ALL their Support If they did not Vote in favour of the UN security council resolution against Iraq in the build up to the invasion.

Aid is not so simple, what Bush, Blair, the Government say on the Media is not true. They will not tell you that they tell Poor countries that if they get Aid, they can not Buy CHEAP Goods from CHEAP Suppliers like China and India, but must buy American, Must Buy British goods. This is what is happening, this is what is sold to you and me as "WE are Helping the Poor with AID".

The US government is a business. Bush, Condoleeza Rice, Rumsfeld, Perle, Cheney are all sitting on the boards of the worlds leading Companies for Oil, Gas, Weapons, Reconstruction and much more. They make a lot of money from invading countries like Iraq. They made a lot of money from 9/11. Its all in their favour. So, how can there be impartiality?

And what sort of Aid are we talking about? A lot of the time, Military aid is mixed in as part of Humanitarian aid under the guise of "Security and Fighting terrorism"

Did you know that the US, UK and France are the leaders in supplying weapons???

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif]Since 1976, Israel had been the largest annual recipient of U.S. foreign assistance. According to a November 2001 Congressional Research Service report, Israel: U.S. Foreign Assistance, U.S. aid to Israel in the last half century has totaled a whopping $81.3 billion. Weapons to Israel.[/FONT]

What happens with all those weapons? Wonderful Aid to Israel is used to kill Women and Children.

_38658925_palestinian_ap300.jpg


[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif]Between 1994-2001 the U.S. provided many weapons to Israel Absolutely FREE, including:[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif]64,744 M-16A1 rifles[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif]2,469 M-204 grenade launchers[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif]1,500 M-2 .50 caliber machine guns[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Helvetica, Arial, San Sarif].30 caliber, .50 caliber, and 20mm ammunition[/FONT]
"While the US provided large amounts of military aid to countries deemed strategically important, others noted that the US ranked low among developed nations in the amount of humanitarian aid it provided poorer countries. “We are the stingiest nation of all,” former President Jimmy Carter said recently in an address at Principia College in Elsah, Ill"

Is it at all difficult to understand why some people are not exactly cheering in the streets for the Western Countries? What lies underneath the facade of civility?

not bombing, kidnapping, or sitting around going "poor us, we are oppressed!"
Are you generalising now that Muslims, go around bombing and kidnapping? Its a very very small percentage of people who will do that. Thats very inaccurate, infact its the US and its allies like Russia and Israel who are the world leaders at killing, kidnapping, torturing people. Given the amount of abuse that they have continually sufferered, the Muslims are the most Patient people you will ever come across. Just read about Chechnya, Palestine, Iraq, Kashmir, Burma, Phillipines, Thailand, Bosnia, Albania, China and many other countries where Muslims are oppressed today by the so called "peaceful" nations. When President Bush shakes Putty Poot's (Putins) hands you keep in mind they are both State Terrorists and murderers. Russian Troops Kidnap Muslim Men, Women and Children everyday. Many disappear and are tortured to death. This is all well documented by independent and well known human rights organisations.

So you tell that to the following Muslim Mothers!!


http://www.hrw.org/photos/2002/chechnya/

Look through the Following Link to get a better idea at what is happening in our world, i put it together, it is all based on Leading independent Human Rights Organisations.. Nothing Biased:

Why Angry Protests?

Terrorism Oppression of Woman has Nothing to Do With ISlam

Ask yourself why the US is not part of the International Criminal Court? Why is the US the World Leader on vetoing action against human rights violaters? Why they are against rules and legislature to do with War Crimes and Human Rights abuses including torture?

On Eid, 100+ of our brothers and sisters were bombed to death in Afghanistan. Did you know about that? People need to ask themselves why this was never covered in their news.

So please, the next time the west is blamed, please remember that we have not even reached the tip of the iceberg when it comes to their crimes. 650,000 dead in Iraq, 1,000,000 children dead by US imposed Sanctions which Madeline Albright declared "a Price Worth paying". And not only are people dying from bombs and bullets, but from the depleted Uranium scattered all over Iraq, Palestine, Lebanon, Bosnia, Afghanistan. This has led to infant mortality, defects at birth, high rates of leukemia and cancer. This is Aid.
 

Submitter

Junior Member
:salam2:

And by the west, we mean the western governments, not the people who live there and live in peace with us.

Bingo. I have absolutely nothing against Americans or Europeans or any western people. A lot may be ignorant of what's really going on in the eastern world but this isn't their fault - it's down to the media.

Personally, I wouldn't live in USA ever. The stench of corruption from the government is just too pungent for me. I am intending to, inshallah, move from the UK too as soon as is possible after finishing my studies (I was born here).

Brother Mabsoot has posted some excellent info. I hope after reading it you can see when people largely blame the west for various troubles around the world they arn't referring to the citizens of the west, rather the governments.

:wasalam:
 

marildu

Junior Member
Assalamu Alaikum,

Personally, I wouldn't live in USA ever. The stench of corruption from the government is just too pungent for me. I am intending to, inshallah, move from the UK too as soon as is possible after finishing my studies (I was born here).

Please show me a government in this world (Muslim country or not) that isn't corrupt to a certain extent. U.S. just isn't as shy about it.

I personally feel that although the U.S. is not a practing-Muslim friendly place it is not the source of all of our problems. I believe it's in the Quran that these things would happen. (or hadith I'm not certain) That we will be put through so many problems and if we turn to Allah swt instead of the things and people of this world we will once again be able to defend ourselves and be a great people. So Muslims instead of blaming the west should do their part and pray salat, give zakat, fast, and be good Muslims.

Just my two cents.

Edit:

Surah Al-Tin

By the Fig and the Olive, And the Mount of Sinai, And this City of security,- We have indeed created man in the best of moulds, Then do We abase him (to be) the lowest of the low,- Then what can, after this, contradict thee, as to the judgment (to come)? Is not Allah the wisest of judges?
 
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