Atheism
- Thread starter dianek
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dianek
Junior Member
Honestly....though I believe in God.....I am coming to believe that organized religion is the root of all things wrong in this world....everyone thinks they are right, willing to kill or be killed. I saw some valid thoughts in his recommended video.....He is Balkan by the way and has some very real issues western woman succumbing to Muslim men......he believes it is a spit in the face of the women from their culture....
As for Atheism....I don't believe there is NO GOD......But I would say that religion itself is not so good.
As for Atheism....I don't believe there is NO GOD......But I would say that religion itself is not so good.
Multiculti
New Member
you still need Islam because it's the basis of our culture, and it is a very good basis, especially if you avoid some common mistakes.
this is a rather fashionable way to see life currently in the West .. everyone is against "organized religion" ... which simply means they want a religion where they have no duties ... would you rather had "disorganized religion" ?
atheists have to understand that there is no life without duties and responsibilities ... it is an impossible myth ... actually, it is our duties and responsibilities that makes us humans and distinct from animals .. atheists belief that we are some form of animals after all...
as for the video ... it is pure propaganda ... what is the source (and how biased is it ?)
why does the video not mention numbers about HIV for example ? when talking about divorce it is important to show that you compare like for like ... what is the rate of marriage amongst these groups ? same for education/prison ...etc ... the approach in the video to proving the benefits of atheism is so simplistic that it is safe to say stupid.
But hey, the fact that atheists see themselves as special and better than believing in God is not at all new ... this arrogance and callousness has always been there .. listen to what the people of Noah used to tell him about his followers:
And We sent Noah unto his folk (and he said): Lo! I am a plain warner unto you. (25) That ye serve none, save Allah. Lo! I fear for you the retribution of a painful Day. (26) The chieftains of his folk, who disbelieved, said: We see thee but a mortal like us, and we see not that any follow thee save the most abject among us, without reflection. We behold in you no merit above us - nay, we deem you liars. (27)
Qura'an 11:25-27.
so, the "the most abject" are those who believe ... said silly little atheists. To me, the power of the thought lies in itself, not the number of its followers. Even if no one believed Muhammad (peace be upon him) it would not have made him any less right.
Actually, it is plain obvious for most people that religion is on the rise every where, especially in Muslim countries.
Why don't you invite your friend to a discussion here to see what great ideas he can enlighten us with ? From my experience with atheists I do not hold much hope though. Most atheists are not intellectuals in any sense, it is purely a psychological attitude to rejecting life duties. They do like to pretend that they are smart though, much to their inferiority complex.
atheists have to understand that there is no life without duties and responsibilities ... it is an impossible myth ... actually, it is our duties and responsibilities that makes us humans and distinct from animals .. atheists belief that we are some form of animals after all...
as for the video ... it is pure propaganda ... what is the source (and how biased is it ?)
why does the video not mention numbers about HIV for example ? when talking about divorce it is important to show that you compare like for like ... what is the rate of marriage amongst these groups ? same for education/prison ...etc ... the approach in the video to proving the benefits of atheism is so simplistic that it is safe to say stupid.
But hey, the fact that atheists see themselves as special and better than believing in God is not at all new ... this arrogance and callousness has always been there .. listen to what the people of Noah used to tell him about his followers:
And We sent Noah unto his folk (and he said): Lo! I am a plain warner unto you. (25) That ye serve none, save Allah. Lo! I fear for you the retribution of a painful Day. (26) The chieftains of his folk, who disbelieved, said: We see thee but a mortal like us, and we see not that any follow thee save the most abject among us, without reflection. We behold in you no merit above us - nay, we deem you liars. (27)
Qura'an 11:25-27.
so, the "the most abject" are those who believe ... said silly little atheists. To me, the power of the thought lies in itself, not the number of its followers. Even if no one believed Muhammad (peace be upon him) it would not have made him any less right.
Actually, it is plain obvious for most people that religion is on the rise every where, especially in Muslim countries.
Why don't you invite your friend to a discussion here to see what great ideas he can enlighten us with ? From my experience with atheists I do not hold much hope though. Most atheists are not intellectuals in any sense, it is purely a psychological attitude to rejecting life duties. They do like to pretend that they are smart though, much to their inferiority complex.
a_brother
Make dua for us all
:salam2:
what i saw from the movie are statistics, One needs to examine those statistics first... Any one can post a youtube clip and write as they like!!!!
the problem is not religion, the problem is people... until one brings new creation to this world, problems will still happen since we are humans....
as about islam, muslims (<< these are people, not perfect) are not practicing Islam (<< this is the religion, pure)... when people start practicing the religion (islam), you'll see a much much much better statistics!!!... examine the history when muslims were in power (at that time people were practicing Islam!!!!)
At the end, one is held accountable of his own deeds (good and bad)...
sister Diane, "organized religion" by anyone other than the true creator "is the root of all things wrong in this world"... if you believe that Allah is the creature, then Islam is the true religion from the creator...
i would advise you to examine Tawheed and Quran
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=-1&f=15
http://www.quranexplorer.com/
Knowing Allah: AsmaWaSifat »Allah's Names/Attributes
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35836
Knowing Mohammed (SAW):
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36923
what i saw from the movie are statistics, One needs to examine those statistics first... Any one can post a youtube clip and write as they like!!!!
the problem is not religion, the problem is people... until one brings new creation to this world, problems will still happen since we are humans....
as about islam, muslims (<< these are people, not perfect) are not practicing Islam (<< this is the religion, pure)... when people start practicing the religion (islam), you'll see a much much much better statistics!!!... examine the history when muslims were in power (at that time people were practicing Islam!!!!)
At the end, one is held accountable of his own deeds (good and bad)...
sister Diane, "organized religion" by anyone other than the true creator "is the root of all things wrong in this world"... if you believe that Allah is the creature, then Islam is the true religion from the creator...
i would advise you to examine Tawheed and Quran
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=-1&f=15
http://www.quranexplorer.com/
Knowing Allah: AsmaWaSifat »Allah's Names/Attributes
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35836
Knowing Mohammed (SAW):
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36923
Classic atheist theory.
The soviet union was atheist and comited huge genocides. Was organized religion behind the World Wars? Is organized religion behind the exploitation of weaker nations. No.
If it weren't for Islam and the Caliphs the world would be set back at least 500 years.
Secularism is the new organized religion, people just haven't realized it yet.
Diane is a relatively new muslim ... her current way of thinking is very common in the west (well, ceretainly in England, not sure about the US).
Dear Diane, don't be tricked by the atheists claims. The track record of atheism is nothing but disgusting. Why don't they own up to Stalin, Hitler, Pol pot and the other horrible, terrible criminals they were guided by non-belief like themselves ? Why don't they own up to social Darwinism (do you know what that mean ?). Why don't they own up to having no barriers and no morals - which is the essense of their way to see the world ?
I've asked a whole forum of presumably "smart" and "educated" atheists to give me a good reason why a man should not sleep with his grown up daughter of her free will ... thye never found an answer ... if they can't find a justification for banning such a horrible act then what hope is it they find a justification for any morals ?
Dear Diane, don't be tricked by the atheists claims. The track record of atheism is nothing but disgusting. Why don't they own up to Stalin, Hitler, Pol pot and the other horrible, terrible criminals they were guided by non-belief like themselves ? Why don't they own up to social Darwinism (do you know what that mean ?). Why don't they own up to having no barriers and no morals - which is the essense of their way to see the world ?
I've asked a whole forum of presumably "smart" and "educated" atheists to give me a good reason why a man should not sleep with his grown up daughter of her free will ... thye never found an answer ... if they can't find a justification for banning such a horrible act then what hope is it they find a justification for any morals ?
D.Ahmed
Believer
:salam2:
Sister dianek is from the US not from England i'm pretty sure of it just thought I'd point that out.:lol:
Mumin01
Junior Member
i totally agree brother
Salaam,
What is so beautiful about statistics is that they lie. The video made some strange assumptions. There were no comparions. So what if the divorce rate is lowest among atheists. How many people were interviwed one? Muslims were not mentioned. Islam is the fastest growing religion in America.
Atheist: not god. One who does not believe. If you do not believe from the getgo you can not trust..from the getgo..the world becomes a very cold place..from the getgo. The universe becomes you. You can not taste humility. How can you know compasssion and mercy and understanding..you deny Allah subhana talla. You only have your ego.
Let us be careful. Please..we are in His Presence...let us not even venture into this arena. Because we are His Creation..granted life by HIs Will to return to HIm..attempting to please Him by our deeds. May Allah subhana talla forgive me.
What is so beautiful about statistics is that they lie. The video made some strange assumptions. There were no comparions. So what if the divorce rate is lowest among atheists. How many people were interviwed one? Muslims were not mentioned. Islam is the fastest growing religion in America.
Atheist: not god. One who does not believe. If you do not believe from the getgo you can not trust..from the getgo..the world becomes a very cold place..from the getgo. The universe becomes you. You can not taste humility. How can you know compasssion and mercy and understanding..you deny Allah subhana talla. You only have your ego.
Let us be careful. Please..we are in His Presence...let us not even venture into this arena. Because we are His Creation..granted life by HIs Will to return to HIm..attempting to please Him by our deeds. May Allah subhana talla forgive me.
Min-Fadhli-Rabii
Junior Member
Assalam aleikum,
Well I am not sure if the number on the video is true or not. To me, there is increase of atheisism. Due to number of reasons why people turn/ed to atheism:
As the world advanced in technology and science, many scientific bibble verses came to be discovered that are Untrue. Like the earth and the sky has pillars, the moon has it own light, the earth is flat e.t.c. The capability of man to have the technology and investigate/experiment and comes out to be not true. Many turned to atheism and their offspring follow their ancestor or parents. But these people they never give chance to islam by reading to It and know what It has to offer to them because they thought, Islam is a foreign religion/religion of middle east. What they fail to think is that all major three religions, Christianity, Judaism And Islam are all religion from Middle East. Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Ismael and Mohammad. peace be upon them all, are all from Middle East.
Some religion are not strict in drinking some parents become alcoholic though they believe in a certain this organised religion. The parent ends up beating other partner and have have very bad family due to the treatment of the alcolic/addict family causing children to turn to atheist as the parents were believers in a certain religion but they were causing havoc in the family.
The secularism contributes also to the increase of atheisms through proganda, media and so called freedom of speech.
Well I am not sure if the number on the video is true or not. To me, there is increase of atheisism. Due to number of reasons why people turn/ed to atheism:
As the world advanced in technology and science, many scientific bibble verses came to be discovered that are Untrue. Like the earth and the sky has pillars, the moon has it own light, the earth is flat e.t.c. The capability of man to have the technology and investigate/experiment and comes out to be not true. Many turned to atheism and their offspring follow their ancestor or parents. But these people they never give chance to islam by reading to It and know what It has to offer to them because they thought, Islam is a foreign religion/religion of middle east. What they fail to think is that all major three religions, Christianity, Judaism And Islam are all religion from Middle East. Abraham, Moses, Jesus, Ismael and Mohammad. peace be upon them all, are all from Middle East.
Some religion are not strict in drinking some parents become alcoholic though they believe in a certain this organised religion. The parent ends up beating other partner and have have very bad family due to the treatment of the alcolic/addict family causing children to turn to atheist as the parents were believers in a certain religion but they were causing havoc in the family.
The secularism contributes also to the increase of atheisms through proganda, media and so called freedom of speech.
BrotherZak
Junior Member
Mark Twain once said ""There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."" Results can be skewed and numbers can be manipulated quite easily and anyone who has taken research statistics will have already known this.
But as for the apparent rise of Atheism it is mainly comprised of people leaving the religion of Christianity-hence if anything it proves the vitality of Christianity in the light of science is not very good. I've spoken on forums and talked to hundreds of western students who share atheistic ideas and for the most part the cause is Christianity. You have educated and analytical thinking students having a hard time believing bible contradiction, earth flat theory, worldwide floods( quran specifically says to Noah's people), and other countless scientific blunders and not to mention an irrational theology where God comes down as God incarnate to be Killed by Men so he can return to himself and thus save all of humanity from sin which they had no part in committing!! What do you expect? But remember Islam is increasing as well among westerns as well....
But as for the apparent rise of Atheism it is mainly comprised of people leaving the religion of Christianity-hence if anything it proves the vitality of Christianity in the light of science is not very good. I've spoken on forums and talked to hundreds of western students who share atheistic ideas and for the most part the cause is Christianity. You have educated and analytical thinking students having a hard time believing bible contradiction, earth flat theory, worldwide floods( quran specifically says to Noah's people), and other countless scientific blunders and not to mention an irrational theology where God comes down as God incarnate to be Killed by Men so he can return to himself and thus save all of humanity from sin which they had no part in committing!! What do you expect? But remember Islam is increasing as well among westerns as well....
A Question to all Atheists
Bible says: "Atheists are fool. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. They are filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one." (Psalms 14:1-3)
Gita says: "The irrational, the faithless, and the disbeliever perishes. There is neither this world, nor the world beyond, nor happiness for the disbeliever." (Gita 4:40)
According to Muslim belief, this temporal world is a test for the hereafter (Quran 18:7, 67:2, 2:155, 2:214, 29:2-3), and each and every individual will be judged perfectly according to his/her own deeds and actions (Quran 36:54, 4:85, 40:17, 21:47, 36:54, 2:281, 7:29, 16:111, 17:13-15, 20:134-135, 42:24, 4:123) including Prophet Muhammad (Quran 11:35, 46:9, 17:73-75). Therefore, there is not an iota of inhumanity or irrationality in Muslim belief.
No other religion or philosophy, to my knowledge, has the concept of Absolute Justice. For example, according to Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism and Sikhism, mass murderer evils like Hitler and Stalin may be reincarnated as Sudra or lower creature or even plant! This kind of belief or doctrine is the greatest insult and hatred against Sudras, lower creatures, and plants. No sensible person can accept this kind of justice. On the other hand, Christians believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world! If it's really so, then Jesus also died for the sins of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, suicide bombers, liars, and hypocrites! This is even more dangerous! I'm not sure what kind of justice does Judaism preaches.
Anyway, Atheists not only do not believe in Intelligent and Supreme Being (Creator of the universe) but also preach their belief in the name of logic, rationality, humanism, and (pseudo) science! But the fact is that, they directly/indirectly support the actions of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, liars, and suicide bombers. They have no other option but justifying the actions of all sorts of criminal acts. Because, without an Intelligent and Supreme Being, it will never ever be possible to judge and punish the criminals. And there is no difference between Hitler and Mother Teresa either! Atheists cannot condemn the actions of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, rapists, and suicide bombers, anyway. Because they have NO logical and rational basis to condemn these kinds of evil actions.
Moreover, unlike Theists, Atheists do not have any kind of personal accountability. For example, if they kill or rape some humans, they do not believe that they should be judged and punished for their crime. It doesn't matter whether or not they are killing or raping; but the fact is that, if they commit any crime, they do not think that they are guilty for their crime. Even if they feel guilty, just for show, they do not believe that they should be judged and punished one day. Therefore, it's clearly seen that Atheism is the greatest threat for Humanity.
Here is my Question to them:
Do they really believe that people like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, and suicide bombers are considered to be criminals, and as such should be judged and punished one day? If the answer is NO, then they are not only supporter but also promoter of these kinds of innocent (!) evils. If the answer is YES, then how? They must come up with solid argument and explanation in this case.
Bible says: "Atheists are fool. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. They are filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one." (Psalms 14:1-3)
Gita says: "The irrational, the faithless, and the disbeliever perishes. There is neither this world, nor the world beyond, nor happiness for the disbeliever." (Gita 4:40)
According to Muslim belief, this temporal world is a test for the hereafter (Quran 18:7, 67:2, 2:155, 2:214, 29:2-3), and each and every individual will be judged perfectly according to his/her own deeds and actions (Quran 36:54, 4:85, 40:17, 21:47, 36:54, 2:281, 7:29, 16:111, 17:13-15, 20:134-135, 42:24, 4:123) including Prophet Muhammad (Quran 11:35, 46:9, 17:73-75). Therefore, there is not an iota of inhumanity or irrationality in Muslim belief.
No other religion or philosophy, to my knowledge, has the concept of Absolute Justice. For example, according to Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism and Sikhism, mass murderer evils like Hitler and Stalin may be reincarnated as Sudra or lower creature or even plant! This kind of belief or doctrine is the greatest insult and hatred against Sudras, lower creatures, and plants. No sensible person can accept this kind of justice. On the other hand, Christians believe that Jesus died for the sins of the world! If it's really so, then Jesus also died for the sins of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, suicide bombers, liars, and hypocrites! This is even more dangerous! I'm not sure what kind of justice does Judaism preaches.
Anyway, Atheists not only do not believe in Intelligent and Supreme Being (Creator of the universe) but also preach their belief in the name of logic, rationality, humanism, and (pseudo) science! But the fact is that, they directly/indirectly support the actions of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, liars, and suicide bombers. They have no other option but justifying the actions of all sorts of criminal acts. Because, without an Intelligent and Supreme Being, it will never ever be possible to judge and punish the criminals. And there is no difference between Hitler and Mother Teresa either! Atheists cannot condemn the actions of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, rapists, and suicide bombers, anyway. Because they have NO logical and rational basis to condemn these kinds of evil actions.
Moreover, unlike Theists, Atheists do not have any kind of personal accountability. For example, if they kill or rape some humans, they do not believe that they should be judged and punished for their crime. It doesn't matter whether or not they are killing or raping; but the fact is that, if they commit any crime, they do not think that they are guilty for their crime. Even if they feel guilty, just for show, they do not believe that they should be judged and punished one day. Therefore, it's clearly seen that Atheism is the greatest threat for Humanity.
Here is my Question to them:
Do they really believe that people like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, Bush, Saddam, Modi, and all those terrorists, rapists, killers, and suicide bombers are considered to be criminals, and as such should be judged and punished one day? If the answer is NO, then they are not only supporter but also promoter of these kinds of innocent (!) evils. If the answer is YES, then how? They must come up with solid argument and explanation in this case.
Salaam,
Personally I would rather spend time with those who want to increase knowledge and know it is the deed that is important. Those who do not know the need to cleanse ones heart will never understand the language of Love. How can one who does not wish to believe understand Love? It is by giving that one receives and giving is an attribute of the Giver without End. So I lower my gaze delighting in the showers of Love. Alhumdullila.
Personally I would rather spend time with those who want to increase knowledge and know it is the deed that is important. Those who do not know the need to cleanse ones heart will never understand the language of Love. How can one who does not wish to believe understand Love? It is by giving that one receives and giving is an attribute of the Giver without End. So I lower my gaze delighting in the showers of Love. Alhumdullila.
WHAT IN THE WORLD IS GOING ON HERE
Alhamdulilah, ue salatu ua salamu ala rasulilah, to proceed,
Allahu azauajal says: Are they waiting for anything except the Hour, to come to them suddenly? But its Signs have already come!" (Al-Qur’an, Surah Muhammad)
From the Signs of judgment day is that knowledge will be taken away (by the death of people of knowledge), and ignorance will prevail. This is what I see under this topic. You know what else I see for that " sister" who opened this topic this other sign that says from the hadith of rasulilahi sallahu alayhee ua salam : There is no-one left on the earth saying, "Allah, Allah" or "There is no god except Allah." and like the other hadith says that eventually the Day of Judgment is established upon the worst of the people, who copulate like donkeys in public.
Alhamdulilah, ue salatu ua salamu ala rasulilah, to proceed,
Allahu azauajal says: Are they waiting for anything except the Hour, to come to them suddenly? But its Signs have already come!" (Al-Qur’an, Surah Muhammad)
From the Signs of judgment day is that knowledge will be taken away (by the death of people of knowledge), and ignorance will prevail. This is what I see under this topic. You know what else I see for that " sister" who opened this topic this other sign that says from the hadith of rasulilahi sallahu alayhee ua salam : There is no-one left on the earth saying, "Allah, Allah" or "There is no god except Allah." and like the other hadith says that eventually the Day of Judgment is established upon the worst of the people, who copulate like donkeys in public.
nyerekareem
abdur-rahman
:salam2:
unfortunately, i wasn't able to see the video that was posted. but here's what i think about atheists or people that hate organized religion. i've come to notice that those people generally do not have a problem with comitting actions that most religions see as sinful. they have the idea that marriage is only a piece of paper, if something feels good do it, you only have one life attitude. they like this way of life because the denial of God gives them a sense of freedom. they could do whatever they want and do not have to face accountability. but the truth is that they are only fooling themselves.
unfortunately, i wasn't able to see the video that was posted. but here's what i think about atheists or people that hate organized religion. i've come to notice that those people generally do not have a problem with comitting actions that most religions see as sinful. they have the idea that marriage is only a piece of paper, if something feels good do it, you only have one life attitude. they like this way of life because the denial of God gives them a sense of freedom. they could do whatever they want and do not have to face accountability. but the truth is that they are only fooling themselves.
"As for Atheism....I don't believe there is NO GOD......But I would say that religion itself is not so good."
Who ever said this statment should know, I am sorry, must know that is a statment of kufr( disbelief), but if ignorance is involed than inshallah who ever siad it should know that Allah revealed a system for us to live happy in this life and get jannah inshallah in the here after and this system very weakly translated is known among us as religion even that word should not shake any one bacause either you follow man-made laws or Allah's shairah in our case Islam as religion your are following in reality a religion. And the Qur'an says: "If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (Submission to Allah), Never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost."(Qur'an 3:85)
Who ever said this statment should know, I am sorry, must know that is a statment of kufr( disbelief), but if ignorance is involed than inshallah who ever siad it should know that Allah revealed a system for us to live happy in this life and get jannah inshallah in the here after and this system very weakly translated is known among us as religion even that word should not shake any one bacause either you follow man-made laws or Allah's shairah in our case Islam as religion your are following in reality a religion. And the Qur'an says: "If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (Submission to Allah), Never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who have lost."(Qur'an 3:85)
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