I want your advise

[IslamGreatest]

Assalamu Alaykum,,

I would like to get your advise about responding to an Ordained Minister of the Gospel of Jesus Christ's, in the USA, three questions. She answered those in the following quote:

1) I asked her that she believes in GOD the creator of the universe and his son Jesus who is the only Savior (her LORD). I would like to understand which one you worship, pray, ask, travel for, and cry; and which one responds to you, the creator of the universe “GOD” or his son Jesus “LORD”.

She answered as: John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have Everlasting Life.
There is ONE GOD.
GOD the Father.
GOD the Son.
GOD the Holy Spirit.
The three are ONE.

Let me use an Egg to explain. Picture an egg....it has a shell, a yolk and egg white. It has three distinct parts but is One egg. Shell Yolk and White = One egg. There is One GOD but the Three make up One GOD. Father, Son and Holy Spirit = One GOD.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned and come short of the Glory of God. We needed a Savior to die on the cross for the payment of our sins. GOD is too holy and we are too sinful to have a relationship with HIM without getting washed in the blood of JESUS. When we ask JESUS to save us and forgive us our sin we are no longer separated from GOD the Father ...we receive the righteousness of Christ (JESUS) and now we are no longer separated from our HOLY FATHER.
When we ask JESUS to come into our heart the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD comes into our spirit and our blind eyes are opened to understand. We are born again.

We are born of GOD's spirit. HIS Spirit dwells in us. We come out of Satan's dark kingdom into GOD's kingdom of Light. It is a divine experience that changes our lives forever and we can now know and understand GOD and talk to HIM and He talks to us. We have a personal relationship with GOD our creator and the creator of the universe. If we do not accept JESUS as our Savior then we are still lost sinners and cannot get into heaven.

John 14: 6 JESUS saith unto him, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life. No man cometh unto the Father but by ME. A prayer to say to accept JESUS is this: Dear GOD, I admit I have been a sinner. I know I need a Savior and right now JESUS I ask you to be my Savior. I believe you died on the cross for my sins and that you arose again on the third day. Come into my heart. Wash me in your blood. Forgive me my sins. Thank you JESUS for my salvation.
If a person prays this prayer and means it they will know beyond a shadow of a doubt they are right with GOD and on the way to heaven.



2) I asked her that her recommendation is to buy the Old King James Version of the Bible, not the New King James. How many Holy Books are existing? Can I have the right to chose any of them?

No, we just don't choose any one we want. GOD authorized the Old King James Version of the Bible. The new translations are the work of man alone. Things have been changed and left out. They are counterfeits. Many people use them but they are not the True Word of GOD.



3) Did the message (Holy Books) or messengers (GOD, LORD or someone else) mention anything about Islam or Prophet Mohammed?

No, the Bible does not speak of Islam or Mohammed. The Bible warns us to beware of false prophets like Mohammed. Also....the Bible warns of running off to serve false gods like Allah.
When we pray we direct our prayers to Father God and then close in the name of JESUS. JESUS said if we ask the Father anything in His name He will do it.

So a prayer could go like this, Dear Heavenly Father God, I am asking you to help me know the truth about you and your Son, please reveal yourself to me, in JESUS's name. Amen.

Thank you for your cooperation. I look forward to your reply soon.

 

[mhamzah]

:salam2:

Thanks God, these are only three questions, last time I remember one brother was asked 10 questions.

Reply to point 1:

The first Question is not whether Jesus, Peace be upon him is God. The first question is whether he said that he was equal to God. The Bible record of sayings credited to Jesus is quite few. None of this handful of texts is an explicit claim of deity.

The term "Son of God" cannot have a literal interpretation. Sonship and divine nature would be necessary attributes of such an actuality, but these are incompatible. The first describes a recipient of life while the second describes One who received life from no one. These are mutually exclusive requirements then. To be a son is to be less than divine, and to be divine is to be no one's son. Jesus himself speaks of the peacemakers as "sons of God" (Matthew 5:9).

The same word translated as "only-begotten" is found at Hebrews 11:17. In this verse the word refers to Isaac. The Bible itself shows that Isaac's older brother Ishmael outlived his father (Genesis 25:9). Therefore, at no time was Isaac, strictly speaking, the only-begotten son of Abraham. Recognizing this, Christian scholars qualify the meaning of the word in this case and give it a less than literal interpretation. But if the meaning is subject to interpretation here, why not also in the passage of John 3:16?

Christians say that God is "immutable", i.e. unchanging. How then can it be said that He passed through the state of death? How could He grow in knowledge? (Luke 2:52).

When we forgive a debt it means that we expect no payment. "The Lord's Prayer" asks God to forgive our debts and sins the way we forgive our debtors (Mathew 6:12 and Luke 11:2). Why then does Jesus' have to pay a price for our sins? And if something is paid for than it is not forgiven.

So did God forgive her sins or did Jesus, pbuh, died for her sins. She cannot have it two ways?

The egg example is a false analogy because the shell, yolk and the white egg on their own is not the egg itself. Secondly like brother Yusuf Estes likes to point out what if it's a double yolk or what if it is rotten.

Born Again part:

Ask her if she is born again, who is her father. The reply you will get is 'God', Than Ask her who is her mother, 'Most probably you will get an answer, 'what makes you think I will have a new mother.'

Remind her bible speaks of the new mother of born again; its in book of Galatians (4:26)

But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

Than ask her why did the Holy spirit forgot to mention this to her.

Reply to point 2:

When and where did the God authorized the old king james version of the bible. The bible does not have self reference i.e. the word bible is not in the bible. Ask her to bring one verse in the bible where the entire bible is authorised as the word of God.

Reply to Point 3:

5 Pillars of Islam and the Bible

1 (a). Shahadah: There is no God but God (Allah)

Judaism and Christanity: (Old and New Testament)

(Deut 6:4) Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

(Isaiah 43:11) I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

(Isaiah 45: 5) I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me.

(Isaiah 46:9) Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,

3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me. 4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; (Exodus 20:3-5)

7. Thou shalt have none other gods before me. 8 Thou shalt not make thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the waters beneath the earth: 9 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me, (Deut 7-9)

(Mark 12: 29) And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:

1 (b). Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is the messenger of Allah:

Judaism and Christanity:

Deuteronomy (18:18):

"I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him."

It is mentioned in the book of Isaiah chapter 29 verse 12:

"And the book is delivered to him that is not learned saying, ‘Read this, I pray thee’; and he saith, ‘I am not learned’.

"When Archangel Gabriel commanded Muhammad (pbuh) by saying ‘Iqra’, he replied "I am not learned".

A Prophet like Moses

In the Bible, in Deuteronomy chapter eighteen, we have the words of Moses who reports that God told him that He would raise up a prophet, from among the brothers of the Israelites, like Moses.

Christians wish to apply this to Jesus, to say he was the prophet like Moses. It is uncomfortable for them to recognise, however, that Jesus was not very much like Moses and Jesus had no father, no wife, no children; he did not die of old age, and he did not lead a nation; all these things Moses had or did. But they say, well, Jesus will return; he will return as a victorious person, and so he will be more like Moses. Do they really expect he will return to also acquire a father and a wife and children and then die of old age? Not usually. Moreover, Jesus was an Israelite. The passage of scripture says that this prophet that was foretold would be raised up among the brothers of the Israelites, not from the Israelites.

In the third chapter of Acts, the disciple Peter speaks to a crowd of people and explains that Jesus has been taken up and he is in heaven. He will remain in Heaven and he cannot return until all the things that were promised by God come to pass. So what are we still waiting for, does he tell the crowd? He quotes this very saying of Moses, saying.

"For God will raise up a prophet from among the brothers of the Israelites like Moses..."

The point is very clear. Christians like to see this prophet as being Jesus. But read carefully Acts chapter three, what it says is that Jesus awaits a return. He cannot return until the fulfilment of this prophecy that another prophet has to come. Jesus spoke of it himself and the words survived, just barely, but they survived in the Bible. Jesus spoke of God sending another "Paraclete".

Paraclete

There is a lot of argument over the meaning of this word "Paraclete". For now we can leave that aside. What is a "Paraclete"? It does not matter. The first letter of John shows that Jesus was a "Paraclete". He is called a "Paraclete" and we have Jesus promising another "Paraclete" is going to be sent.
We lose a lot by this word "another" in English because it is ambiguous. If someone’s car breaks down, and it is a Toyota, and I say, "I'II go and get you another car," maybe I mean, "I'II go and get you another Toyota because this one you have is broken," or maybe I mean, "Forget Toyota, they're no good; I'II go and get you a Datsun." It is an ambiguous word.
But the Greeks had a word for it. When they meant "another" of the same kind, they said aloes. When they meant another of a different kind, they said heteroes. The important thing here is that, when Jesus, who was himself a Paraclete, said "God will send you another Paraclete" he used the word aloes, not heteroes.

Christians want to say that this other "Paraclete" that has been sent was different from Jesus. It was not a man, it was a spirit. What Jesus said was: "God will send you another one like me, another man." Muslims believe that Muhammad is the fulfilment of this prophecy by Jesus. The Qur'an says that this man is mentioned in the scriptures of the Jews and the Christians (see 7:157).

Christians came to expect the return of Jesus because of a Jewish misunderstanding. "Messiah" and "Son of Man" have been given special significance by the Jews, even though many people were called by this same name as in the Bible. The Jews came to expect a victorious leader. When Jesus did not turn out to be quite what many expected, they hatched the idea that he would return some day and fulfill all these prophecies.

Prayer and Fasting

Prayer and fasting are mentioned both in Old and New Testament a number of times.

Hajj:

4 Blessed are they that dwell in thy house: they will be still praising thee. Selah. 5 Blessed is the man whose strength is in thee; in whose heart are the ways of them. 6 Who passing through the valley of Baca make it a well; the rain also filleth the pools. (Psalms Chapter 84: 4-6)

The first House (of worship) appointed for men was that at Bakka (Makkah): Full of blessing and of guidance for all kinds of beings. (Quran 3:96)

Criteria to be successul: Both Faith/belief and works/good deeds

Islam

By (the Token of) Time (through the ages), Verily Man is in loss, Except such as have Faith, and do righteous deeds, and (join together) in the mutual teaching of Truth, and of Patience and Constancy. (Quran 103: 1-3)

Judaism and Christanity:

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. (Book of James 2:26)

Islam and Bible:

1. God is not a man: Hosea 11:9
2. Halal & Haram Food: Acts 15:29, Deut 14:8, Proverbs 20:11, Ephesians 5:18

More on Islam in the Bible:

http://www.thedeenshow.com/show.php?action=detail&id=36

Regarding Calling God as Allah, this she first needs to argue with the Millions of Arabs Christians and Jews who have been calling God, as 'Allah' for centuries.

I had youtube link, where a Jew was explaining this really well, however youtube have removed the video.

 

[mhamzah]

Follower of Jesus

The Bible says very clearly that Jesus used to fast. Do Christians fast? Muslims fast; aleast one month every year.

The Bible says that Jesus prayed by touching his forehead to the ground. Do Christians pray in this manner? Muslims do.

According to Jesus, he told his disciples to greet one another with the expression, "Peace be with you." Do the Christians do that? Muslims do, universally, whether they speak Arabic of not. The greeting for one to another is Assalamu' alaikum (peace be with you).

The brother of Jesus in the Book of James, stated that no man should suggest what he is about to do of highlight his plans for the next few days in anyway without adding the phrase "if God wills." Do not say "I will go here and there do this and that" without adding the phrase "if God wills." Do Christians do that? Muslims do, whether they speak Arabic or not. If they so much as suggest they are going downtown to pick up some groceries, they will add Insha-Allah, which in Arabic means, "If God wills."

So who really is trying to follow Jesus, Pbuh.

http://www.mydeviant.com/miller/gary_miller.html

May Allah guide us always closer to the truth.

 

[gazkour]

Assalamo alikom wa rahmato Allahi wa barakato

1) Simple logic: 3 cannot be equal to 1. The shell is not equal to the yolk, or to the white, the yolk is not equal to the shell or to the white either,or viceversa. They will also say: one man=body+spirit+soul. But the body is not as the soul is it? And so on.

*Jesus(alehi salam) never said in his own words : Worship me, or I'm God or the only way of salvation is receiving me as saviour. On the contrary he always emphasizes :

* His docrine is not his but his father's :John7:16

*"I have not come of Myself, but He who sent Me is true" :John7:28

*"I speak to the world those things which I heard from Him" : John 8:25-30

*"As You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him. 3 And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent". John 17:3

*"Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, ‘I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.’” :John 20:17

*"But if I cast out demons with the finger of God" Luke 11:20

*"Jesus answered him, “The first of all the commandments is: ‘Hear, O Israel, the LORD our God, the LORD is one": Mark 12:29

*So the scribe said to Him, “Well said, Teacher. You have spoken the truth, for there is one God, and there is no other but He. And to love Him with all the heart, with all the understanding, with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love one’s neighbor as oneself, is more than all the whole burnt offerings and sacrifices.”
Now when Jesus saw that he answered wisely, He said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” :Mark 12:32-34

*“But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father" : Mark 13:32

* So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.” :Matthew 19:17

Other verses throughout the Bible are also saying that there's no other than God, here are just some of them :

*"I am the LORD, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images: Isa.42:8

*"Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the LORD, And besides Me there is no savior. " :Isa. 43:10

*"I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God" :Isa. 44:6

*"To whom will you liken Me, and make Me equal and compare Me, that we should be alike?" :Isa.46:5

*"Therefore know this day, and consider it in your heart, that the LORD Himself is God in heaven above and on the earth beneath; there is no other" : Deut 4:39

*“God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent. Has He said, and will He not do? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?" : Num. 23:19

When Jesus says the the Father and him are One, bear in mind that the biblical language is not always literal but figurative. If it was always literal we could also say from the Bible that Satan is God! (staghfirullah!) : see 2 Cor. 4:4

"whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe.."

Then Moses could be also God (staghfirullah): Exodus 7:1 :

So the LORD said to Moses: “See, I have made you as God to Pharaoh, and Aaron your brother shall be your prophet.

We can be God as well(staghfirullah): Jhon 17:11 :

"Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me (believers and disciples), that they may be one as We are.

So "being ONE" with the "father" means one in PURPOSE not in essence!

2) When did God say that he authorized the Old King James Version?

3) The Bible did warn against false prophets. It says in 1 John 4:1-3 :

"Beloved, do not believe every spirit (prophet), but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that[a] Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.

So according to this, then prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) is indeed from God!

May Allah guide us all.

Assalamo alikom wa rahmato Allahi wa barakato

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

Brother mHamzah, Gazkour and Ayman, mashAllah. I do not have much to say but allow me to add few things:

2) I asked her that her recommendation is to buy the Old King James Version of the Bible, not the New King James. How many Holy Books are existing? Can I have the right to chose any of them?

No, we just don't choose any one we want. GOD authorized the Old King James Version of the Bible. The new translations are the work of man alone. Things have been changed and left out. They are counterfeits. Many people use them but they are not the True Word of GOD..

This is an admission from her that bibles are not true word of God. Compare with Qur'an, she can pick up from any country they will be the same Qur'an.

3) Did the message (Holy Books) or messengers (GOD, LORD or someone else) mention anything about Islam or Prophet Mohammed?

No, the Bible does not speak of Islam or Mohammed. .

So many verses in the bible indicate the attributes of Holy Prophet Muhammad (Allah's blessings and peace be upon him).

e.g. Matt. 28:20, John 14:26,

John 16:13:
"However, when he the spirit of truth is come, he will guide you into all truth for he shall not speak of himself but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak and he will show you things to come".

The above only suitable to Holy Prophet Muhammad (Allah's blessings and peace be upon him). Not Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost because according to them Holy Spirit is part of God in trinity i.e. God. The above words I underlined clearly is not an attributes of God but a Prophet.

 

[mhamzah]

Muhammad, pbuh is his blessed name

:salam2:

You wont be able to prove a lot to her by this, but just for your reference.

Gosepl of Barnabas

`Unworthy though I am to untie his hosen, I have received grace and mercy from God to see him.'

Then answered the priest, with the governor and the king, saying: `Distress not thyself, O Jesus, holy one of God, because in our time shall not this sedition be any more, seeing that we will write to the sacred Roman senate in such wise that by imperial decree none shall any more call thee God or son of God.'

Then said Jesus: `With your words I am not consoled, because where ye hope for light darkness shall come; but my consolation is in the coming of the messenger, who shall destroy every false opinion of me, and his faith shall spread and shall take hold of the whole world, for so hath God promised to Abraham our father. And that which giveth me consolation is that his faith shall have no end, but shall be kept inviolate by God.'

The priest answered: `After the coming of the messenger of God shall other prophets come?'

Jesus answered: `There shall not come after him true prophets sent by God, but there shall come a great number of false prophets, whereat I sorrow. For Satan shall raise them up by the just judgement of God, and they shall hide themselves under the pretext of my gospel.'

Herod answered: `How is it a just judgement of God that such impious men should come?'

Jesus answered: `It is just that he who will not believe in the truth to his salvation should believe in a lie to his damnation. Wherefore I say unto you, that the world hath ever despise the true prophets and loved the false, as can be seen in the time of Michaiah and Jeremiah. For every like loveth his like.'

Then said the priest: `How shall the Messiah be called, and what sign shall reveal his coming?'

Jesus answered: `The name of the Messiah is admirable, for God himself gave him the name when he had created his soul, and placed it in a celestial splendour. God said: "Wait Mohammed; for thy sake I will to create paradise, the world, and a great multitude of creatures, whereof I make thee a present, insomuch that whoso bless thee shall be blessed, and whoso shall curse thee shall be accursed. When I shall send thee into the world I shall send thee as my messenger of salvation, and thy word shall be true, insomuch that heaven and earth shall fail, but thy faith shall never fail." Mohammed is his blessed name.'

Then the crowd lifted up their voices, saying: `O God, send us thy messenger: O Mohammed, come quickly for the salvation of the world!'

http://barnabas.net/chapters/145-97-muhammad-is-his-blessed-name.html

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

I thought the Gospel of Barnabas was rejected by majority of christians?

 

[gazkour]

Assalamo alikom wa rahmato Allahi wa barakato

Yes, it is rejected indeed. That's why is not included in the Bible. I don't know of any christian group that actually believes in the Gospel of Barnabas. Is there any?

By the way... I'm a sister :muslim_child:

May Allah guide us all.

Assalamo alikom wa rahmato Allahi wa barakato

 

[mhamzah]

:salam2:

I know, thats why I said, 'You wont be able to prove a lot to her by this.' apart from the fact that you can tell her there are other gospels apart from the four included in the bible.

Infact the Gospel pf barnabas has had the same fate as the other gospels, in one place 'Its reports Jesus, pbuh as saying that I am not the Messiah', which is of course unislamic.

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

So the Gospel of Thomas - has this being rejected as well or still being reviewed?

 

[fada_all]

Brother mHamzah, Gazkour and Ayman, mashAllah. I do not have much to say but allow me to add few things:



This is an admission from her that bibles are not true word of God. Compare with Qur'an, she can pick up from any country they will be the same Qur'an.



So many verses in the bible indicate the attributes of Holy Prophet Muhammad (Allah's blessings and peace be upon him).

e.g. Matt. 28:20, John 14:26,

John 16:13:
"However, when he the spirit of truth is come, he will guide you into all truth for he shall not speak of himself but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak and he will show you things to come".

The above only suitable to Holy Prophet Muhammad (Allah's blessings and peace be upon him). Not Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost because according to them Holy Spirit is part of God in trinity i.e. God. The above words I underlined clearly is not an attributes of God but a Prophet.

:salam2:

:ma:a very excilent and precise and intelligent answer brother ,:tti_sister: may allah blesses you with his mercy and all muslims.....

i want to add something very important too , allah guide who feels that he wants to be guided not anythings else alhamdoliallah all praise be to allah who guide us to islam alhamdolillah every then and always..........


salam alikom