India No Threat, Terrorist Kashmiris: Zardari

[Ghareebah]

salam alaykum

update:

Pakistan Shocked by Zardari's Stances

ISLAMABAD — Pakistan’s political and religious parties were shocked to the bones by the new foreign policy stances announced by newly-elected President Asif Ali Zardari on India, Kashmir and US strikes inside Pakistan.
"Nobody in Pakistan takes his words seriously," Raja Zafar-ul-Haq, the chairman of two-time former premier Nawaz Sharif's Pakistan Muslim League (PML-N), told IslamOnline.net on Monday, October 6.

"His statements will not help Pakistan but rather increase our problems on the diplomatic front."

Zardari, elected the country’s 12th president on September 6, has signaled a dramatic departure from Pakistan's decades-old policies on India and Kashmir.

He told the Wall Street Journal India has never been a threat to Pakistan and Kashmiris fighting Indian rule in the disputed Himalayan region are "terrorists".

"Kashmiris are being subjected to the worst type of state terrorism. They are not terrorists, but the victims of terrorism," insists Zafar-ul-Haq, the PML leader.

"They have the right to struggle for their freedom under UN charter."

Kashmir is divided into two parts and ruled by India and Pakistan, which have fought two of their three wars since the 1947 independence over the region.

Pakistan and the UN back the right of the Kashmir people for self-determination, an option opposed by New Delhi.

Zafar-ul-Haq also took issue with Zardari's claim that India has never posed a security threat to Pakistan.

"If India has never been a threat, then why Pakistan has developed its nuclear program?

"Everybody knows about that. Nobody will take this statement seriously."

New Musharraf

Asadullah Bhutto, a senior lawyer and deputy chief of the Jammat-e-Islami, Pakistan's largest religious party, does not see Zardari’s disclosure about consenting to US strikes as something new.

"This is not a disclosure for us. We believe that there is only change of face in the president house," he told IOL.

"Instead of Musharraf now there is Zardari. If the Pakistani government had not allowed the US drones to trespass, they would never had the courage to enter and attack our areas," he insisted.

"This is highly dangerous for our security, if it is the case. Zardari must clarify his words otherwise we will be compelled to think that tomorrow the US can attack our nuclear assets too."

Bhutto believes Zardari has backtracked on the traditional stand of his party on Kashmir.

"The base of Zulfikar Ali Bhutto’s (the PPP founder and former premier) politics was Kashmir. And there is a national consensus on this issue. By declaring freedom fighters terrorists, Zardari has injured the feelings of the whole nation. He must reverse his words."

Professor Hafiz Mohammed Saeed, the chief of the outlawed Lashkar-e-Tayyeba group which is currently operating under the banner of Jammat-ul-Dawa, accuses the government of toeing the policies of ousted Musharraf.

"It is highly deplorable that the President of Pakistan declares (Kashmiri) freedom fighters terrorists. He must revert his words," he stressed.

"The people of Pakistan saw a glimmer of hope with the change of government, but they didn’t know that the current government would be worst than the previous."

Saeed ridiculed Zardari’s argument that India has never been a threat to Pakistan.

"India has been trying to turn Pakistan into a barren land by building dams on River Indus in contravention of the water agreements between the two countries and Mr Zardari says it’s not a threat to us. How ironic?"

Saeed also took storing issue with Zardari’s admission that US airstrikes inside Pakistan are done with Islamabad's consent.

"We had been blaming dictator Musharraf for allowing the US drones to kill our people, but he never admitted that. Now, Zardari’s confession has proved that we ourselves are behind the killings of our own people," he fumed.

"Zardari must clarify his statement because it is the issue of country’s sovereignty. If it is a realty, then our nuclear assets are in danger."

Damage Control

MP Farzana Raja, a leader of Zardari’s ruling Pakistan Peoples Party (PPP), claims the president has never made such statements.

She insisted he has been "misquoted" by the Wall Street Journal.

"As far as Pakistan’s consent to US attacks are concerned, this is totally untrue," Ms Raja told IOL.

"President Zardari has already made it clear in his address to a joint parliamentary session that we will never compromise on our sovereignty even in the name of combating terrorism.

"He repeated this stand during his visits to the US and UK various times. How can you expect such statement from a person like this who has taken a strong stand on this issue, and even convinced the British Prime Minister Gordon Brown," she said.

The PPP leader also insisted that Pakistan's decades-old stance on Kashmir remains the same.

"We always support the Kashmir issue on diplomatic and political fronts."

Asked whether her party considers the freedom struggle in Kashmir as a terrorist movement, she said: "We have always supported the freedom struggle. But simultaneously, wee never ever opted for militancy as a solution. President Zardari simply stated that militancy is not a solution whatsoever the problem."

Raja Zafar-ul-Haq, the PML leader, is ready to give Zardari the benefit of doubt.

"He (Zardari) seems to be so overwhelmed by the economic crisis in the country. He is going all out to overcome the crisis and in this desperate move he is trying to woo the international community by any means," he explained.

"We understand his conception and desperation but he should understand that such tactics won’t work."

 

[saif]

I have to speak out

This is extremely disgusting, that instead of showing some respect to the political struggle of the people of Pakistan against a dictator, we are pointing fingers on them. Yes, Zardari is worst but who is to blame that all those corrupt politicians were bailed out? And yes Zardari is a wrong choice but he has the legitimacy of "amruhum shura baynahum". It is never claimed that people will always come to a correct decision after shura. But it is a way for "fasl-e-naza'" (resolution of the conflict). I am more willing to accept him as an azaab of Allah than a saviour from army.

For Allah's sake, don't make fun of the decision of the people. Criticize it, enlighten people to make a better decision for the next time, but don't tell them that a dictator was better for you and by struggling against him, you have committed a sin or you have done something against salaf assalehin. This is so disgusting.

If Zardari is a Rafidi, who do you think Musharraf was? And by the way, we in Pakistan consider shias our muslim brothers. This imported takfiri mentality by lashkar-e-jhangwi or lashkar-e-tayyeba (which is a salafi group) has caused enough bloodshed. Please keep it in the desert of Arabia, we don't need it in Pakistan.

Yes, many people in Pakistan do bid'at, many others do shirk and many others are sinful. But this is a separate issue. What has that to do with the political struggle of the people? For your information, Pakistan is already making a lot of positive progress. Brailawis are already a minority and deobandis (which are closer to you, yet you reject them ) and ahl-e-hadith are gaining more and more popularity. Does that mean, that Pakistanis deserve a punishment from Allah? Who are you to decide about that? Fear Allah, when you consider the misery of other people to be a punishment of Allah. Our Salaf assalehin had spared such thoughts for their self purification. Pointing fingers on people in difficulty and telling them, it is a punishment of Allah on you is such a sick and disgusting idea. Keep this ignorance to yourself and don't ascribe it to our Salaf assalehin.

 

[saif]

Sorry for missing salaam in my last mail. Assalamu Alaikum to everybody in the forum.

 

[saif]

:salam2:

I have just seen a comment on Muhammad Ali Jinnah in brother Mabsoot's post. You don't know, who he was? Isn't it enough for you, that he had the trust of the muslims of subcontinent? Is it just a small thing to ignore? I am hearing for the first time from you that he drank alchohol. And even if he did that in some part of his life, how can you be sure, that he never did taubah for that? In whatever family he was born, his thoughts about Islam and politics were far superior than all other nationalist leaders of the islamic world of his time. His thoughts about Islam and politics were far superior than all those thoughts developed under hundereds of years of mulukiyat. Fear Allah, before you defame a person. (I was inclined to write "a muslim" instead of a person but then I thought, that would be asked too much, if you had to consider him a muslim)

 

[saif]

salam alaykum

i realise the whole ummah is a mess, the point of this thread is to show that removing one bad leader, will not bring about a good one to power. the muslims are focused on the FAULTS of their leaders, wether its hosni mubarak the president of egypt or king abdullah of saudi. these leaders (may allah guide them) are here because they reflect the society as a whole. if the society becomes correct in their belief and are upright are leaders will be too and vice versa. try seeing the situation as though your looking in a mirror, if you see a bad image of yourself then that will reflect on the whole of society as a whole. so oh muslims lets focus on our problems and fix it, and donot point fingers, because when you do, know that three fingers are pointing back.

wasalam

I respectfully disagree. The ruler is only then a reflection of the society, when the society is ever asked before appointment of a ruler. Only if a society elects a bad leader, you can blame them. Bani Israel were not be blamed for Pharao but they were to be blamed, when they followed Samiri.

 

[Mabsoot]

Sorry for missing salaam in my last mail. Assalamu Alaikum to everybody in the forum.

Wa alaykum salam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh wa maghfiratuh,

welcome brother Saif. I feel that you should not get so emotional on these issues. Nobody is against Pakistanis here. We are all one Ummah of Muslims.

Yes, many people in Pakistan do bid'at, many others do shirk and many others are sinful. But this is a separate issue. What has that to do with the political struggle of the people?

My brother, the Tawheed and Aqeedah is the only way possible for the Muslims to succeed. This is the ultimate and best way, a way told to us by our creator, Allah.

Allah has told us in the Qur'aan:

Allâh has promised those among you who believe, and do righteous good deeds, that He will certainly grant them succession to (the present rulers) in the earth, as He granted it to those before them, and that He will grant them the authority to practise their religion, that which He has chosen for them (i.e. Islâm). And He will surely give them in exchange a safe security after their fear (provided) they (believers) worship Me and do not associate anything (in worship) with Me. But whoever disbelieved after this, they are the Fâsiqûn (rebellious, disobedient to Allâh). Surah Nur Ayah 55

This is a clear evidence from Quran, that our way is with Islam.

Islam clearly states how we are to live and base our lives and this was covered in my post, which I feel you took some offence to. I apologise if this was the case, my post was not intending to offend anyone.

Rather, it points out the clear issue of importance of Tawheed in reviving the Ummah. Just as the Prophet strove in establishing the Tawheed throughout his life. We did not hear back then people saying that Shirk and Bidah had no place in "political struggle". Shirk is shirk, whether committed by the Quraish or by Raafidah or the Sufiyyah.

Please keep it in the desert of Arabia, we don't need it in Pakistan.

I think you should think carefully what you write, this is racist rhetoric.

- Secondly, those people and groups that you claim are Salafi are not Salafi. Extremism of any sort is not allowed in Islam. The Salaf were our Sahaba, Tabi'een and Atba' Tabieen. They never did any bad things such as killing innocent peopel. - So therefore, even if people claim to be "Salafi", they can not be associated with them due to their beliefs or actions.

This lampooning of people together as being takfiri is propoganda instigated by the enemies of Islam. Not just the disbelievers but also the Raafidah ("Shia") and the Grave worshipping Sufis.

Da'wah salafia is about sticking to the Quran and the Sunnah. - And this is the right way, the middle way. It is not a sect. It is infact the same meaning as "Sunni", "Ahlul Hadith" or any other description of the correct methodology that a Muslim should possess.

The Shia are not our brothers. Nor should we accept to be ruled by them. Nor can they establish shariah principles due to their disbelief in the sayings of the PRophet . - Often, they cover their disbelief with Taqiyyah lying in order for Muslims with little knowledge of Quran, Sunnah and shakey aqeedah to believe them.

Imam Abu Haneefah: It is reported that often Imam Abu Hanifah used to repeat the following statement about the Raafidi Shia; "Whoever doubts whether they are disbelievers has himself committed disbelief."

Imam Ash-Shafi'i: On one occasion Imam Shafi'ee said concerning the Shia, "I have not seen among the heretics a people more famous for falsehood than the Raafidi* Shia." and on another occasion he said; "Narrate knowledge from everyone you meet except for the Raafidi* Shia, because they invent ahaadeeth and adopt them as part of their religion." (Minhaj as-Sunnah an-Nabawiyyah)

Abu Zur'ah ar-Razi: He said of the raafidi Shia doctrine of cursing the Sahâbah, "If you see someone degrade any of the companions of the Prophet SAWS know that he is a disbeliever. Because the Prophet SAWS was real, what he brought was the truth and all of it was conveyed to us by way of the Sahâbah. What those disbelievers wish to do is cast doubt on the reliability of our narrators in order to invalidate the Qur'an and Sunnah. Thus the disbelievers are the ones most deserving of defamation."

This here is the Shia who believe according to all the beliefs of the Shia sect. - If a Shia does not do Shirk, does not curse or belittle the Sahaba in any way, if they believe, respect and love the Sunnah of the PRophet ( this mean they accept all the hadith in the Sahih Hadith collections such as Bukhari and Muslim etc) then they are Muslim. - A good test of this is with their belief in Mut'ah Marriage. - The Shia hold onto Fabricated lies, they claim these to be the words of the Prophet . There are many clear Hadith in Bukhari and Muslim, the Shia reject these in favour of things written in their own books (which have no connection to either the family of the Prophet or his companions.

- If the above actions are done, then technically they are not "Shia". Any wise Muslim can see why those beliefs stated in the previous paragraph are the dividing line between a person who can be considered Muslim or a person who falls outside of Islam and is therefore Non-Muslim.

Many of the ruling elite in Pakistan are Shia and also Secular. They do not believe Islam to be of importance.

For Allah's sake, don't make fun of the decision of the people.

Nobody is making fun of anything, this is a dire issue. What was stated, at least in what I wrote, is that Muslims simply have to practise Islam properly for everything to be back in place.

Yes, many people in Pakistan do bid'at, many others do shirk and many others are sinful. But this is a separate issue. What has that to do with the political struggle of the people?

Your comment sounded like a pro-secular argument. Islamically, this is a very incorrect statement.

As the Ayah I quoted earlier:

Surah Noor Ayah 55:
(( Allâh has promised those among you who believe, and do righteous good deeds, that He will certainly grant them succession to (the present rulers) in the earth, as He granted it to those before them, and that He will grant them the authority to practise their religion, that which He has chosen for them (i.e. Islâm). And He will surely give them in exchange a safe security after their fear (provided) they (believers) worship Me and do not associate anything (in worship) with Me. But whoever disbelieved after this, they are the Fâsiqûn (rebellious, disobedient to Allâh). ))

Here belief has to be belief that is Correct belief ! That is not merely having a Muslim name and not following the Quran and Sunnah. Righteous deeds is not when people do Shirk or bid'ah. Both of which are widespread throughout the world.

Allah, the Most High's statement:
..(provided) they (believers) worship Me and do not associate anything (in worship) with Me.

Shows that we must not do Shirk. It is a vital clause which must be fulfilled for our success.

This is a Promise of Allah. That once the Muslims are upon Islam properly, that He will come to our aid. This is our belief, and to not believe in this is kufr, due to the fact Allah tells us:

"The promise of Allaah is true. And who is more truthful in speech than Allaah" (Soorah an-Nisaa 4:122).

So, those who believe in secular or other way OTHER than the true Islamic way for Muslims to succeed are deluded and are on wrong way. They need to be taught the importance of Tawheed and they need to realise how the early Muslims lived and indeed how every Prophet who ever came to mankind taught.

Allah, our Creator and Lord, (the Most High) told us in the Quran:

“And We sent a messenger to every nation (proclaiming): 'Worship Allaah and shun false deities!'” [Surah An-Nahl: 36]

Again, this is evidence, for those who ponder the words of Allah with the clear Sunnah and Fahm (understanding) of the Salaf, that all goodness in our life is rooted through Tawheed.

Those who disagree after the proofs are established from Quran, commit kufr (disbelief) and it can make someone outside of Islam.

" Verily, Allaah will Most certainly support him who supports His cause; verily, Allaah is Most Powerful and Almighty." (surah al-Hajj 22:40).

" Verily, Allaah does not change : people's condition unless they change what is in themselves." (Soorah ar-Ra'd 13:11).

This change in condition, is to be upon Islam properly. To be against Shirk and Bidah and despise that.

- I agree with you about the extremist groups, nobody should be doing violent acts of terrorism against any Shia or other sect. This is unjustified to be killing innocent people and not from Islam.

My statement dear brother, are simple ones. I do not like to get involved in political discussions, because people always bring to the table their own ideas, philosophies or dare i say diatribic ramblings that achieve nothing.

These issues are not merely for Pakistan, these are for Muslims wherever they are. We are all needing to change ourselves. We are as an Ummah weak, because of our lack of implementing the correct and real Islam.

We are in the current situation, due to people's ignorance of Tawheed and also ignorance about it's importance. A person defending Islam, defending ALLAH by speaking Against Shirk and Bid'ah is a person doing something even more praiseworthy and honourable than a person who speaks against false accusations of fornication about himself or even his own mother! Would a person allow someone who believed or said things against their own family to be teaching them how to rule their country or their lives? - Likewise, how can a person be happy with someone who does Shirk?? It is something that is much more abhorrent!

Evidence from the authentic Sunnah
((The Prophet was asked : what is the greater sin , he said: To ascribe partners to Allaah even though he created you)), [Transmitted by al-Bukhaaree]

May Allah help us all and Allah make those who uphold Islam and destroy all forms of Shirk and let us be those who are loved by Him. Amin.

"He who disbelieves in Taghoot and believes in Allah has surely grasped a strong handle." (2:256)

wasalam

assalamu alaykum, i saw your newer post.

- On side note, you are right with regards to sins, such as drinking alcohol, these do not bring a person outside of Islam. If Muhammad Jinnah was indeed a Sunni Muslim, then I stand corrected. And I ask Allah for forgiveness. But, from what I know he was a secular Shia.. His family were Ismaili who are not Muslims and he himself was a twelver.


asalamu alaykum

 

[justoneofmillion]

Now i also want to claim that my ancestors came from the prophet lineage - Prophet Adam a.s.

:salam2:lol

wassalaam
jameel

 

[Mabsoot]

:salam2:
I agree with you totally brother Mabsoot.

But Musharraf is not a Qadiani, he is Sunni and he is also a Syed, meaning a descendent of Prophet Mohammad. But as you said he doesn't know what is Tawheed.. or anything about real Islam.

:salam2:

It makes me sick to think that Musharraf can claim to be from the family of the Prophet Muhammad - I am sorry brother, I am sure you just heard this, but it is not true.

As for so-called "Syed" people being from the Prophet , this is nonsense. There is no evidence whatsoever to prove it. Lots of people make this claim and often do so with pride and self praise. It only increases people's ignorances and mistreatment of other people. Often, they only marry in these groups with names. -- basically from Hindu culture.

In Indian subcontinent, people claim to be Syed, Mirza, Mughal, Shaikh, Malk, Khawker, Khawaja, Bhutt, Jutt, Gujjar.. list goes on..

They might as well have Brahmin ! Which is Hindu priest caste.

Whether or not all these things are Caste or tribe etc The discrimination and anti-Islamic attitudes people have are haram and full of ignorance. A lot of people are so deluded, they will jump up to defend these unIslamic practises. They emulate the Hindus rather than Muslims.

Those who have a legitimate claim to the Prophet or the Sahaba's lineage are those with an authentic lineage. I have met people in Makkah and Madinah who have such family trees and it is something their families are known for, by many scholars of past and present.

 

[mmnoorulhaque]

go to hell zardari....we dont want u our president....

 

[Ghareebah]

salam alaykum

to brother saif, i dont need to comment, brother mabsoot has said it all

wa alaykum salam

 

[Munawar]

:salam2: Dear Brother Mabsoot,

I don't think Musharraf claims this lineage, he doesn't even include "Syed" in his name (perhaps because he doesn't desever it). But what can you do with the Shijrah (family tree)? A fact is a fact. And this is also a fact that he is a killer of many Muslims no matter what his lineage is. Like late King Hussain and Prince Hassan are also known to be the descendents of Prophet but their deeds are of a Munafiq.

As for so-called "Syed" people being from the Prophet , this is nonsense. There is no evidence whatsoever to prove it. Lots of people make this claim and often do so with pride and self praise. It only increases people's ignorances and mistreatment of other people. Often, they only marry in these groups with names. -- basically from Hindu culture.

In Indian subcontinent, people claim to be Syed, Mirza, Mughal, Shaikh, Malk, Khawker, Khawaja, Bhutt, Jutt, Gujjar.. list goes on..

They might as well have Brahmin ! Which is Hindu priest caste.

This is coming out of pure ignorance that Syed maybe Brahmin. Frankly I heard this for the first time. Amazing!

Anyway this is a wrong debate, and being a descendent of Prophet Mohammad doesn't give anyone any advantage, neither in this world nor in the Yum-ul-Qiyamah. Only one's faith and one's deeds will give any advantage. And this is most important thing of all.

 

[believer_15]

Wa alaykum salam,

You can not call them Murtad or munafiqeen if they were not Muslims in the first place.

Zardari is a Raafidi, (Shia) he is not Sunni, ( as the bhuttos were Shia, open alcohol drinkers etc) they do not care about Quran or Sunnah-- well, neither was Musharraf...

infact, I remember seeing Musharraf saying that "we are all Muslims, we are all circumcised."

This is how he defines Islam.. SubhanAllah. It is in a video on youtube where he debates someone. He promotes Sufism a lot, as does rest of the govt there, and he himself is Qadianni. Or if someone knows about this better? -

They dont know what is Tawheed.. or anything.

It is common for them to drink alcohol etc as did Muhammad Ali Jinnah, who was not Sunni either, dont know what he was.

Anyhow, it also is a sign of the state of Pakistan.. and the Muslims there. For these people have a lot of support from the general masses. The various political rallies, often very emotional ralies in their support are a sign of this.

Just look at the rallies which were for Benazhir Bhutto, all those grown men, some elderly, others sporting large beards chanting in favour of her.. They looked so silly and ignorant! What a shame, and people do not find it at all strange.

- It is all fault of people not knowing Tawheed, Aqeedah, and adhering to the Quran and Sunnah.

There is much Shirk, Bidah and Supersticion not just in the Indian subcontinent but throughout the Muslim world. When this is addressed, our situation will also become addressed!

IF people do not give ALLAH, the Prophet Muhammad and ISLAM the respect that is deserved, they will never gain anything, nor respect. For Allah is the Bestower of this. The Muslims will only be raised in this world once they return to Islam.

All those rallies and protests about the Danish cartoons mean little if the people pop down their local Peers or KHanga to often devotion and prayers to other than Allah. This is the most important thing and our way as an Ummah to unite and regain our glory. It is Islam that gives people insight into how to establish everything in their lives in the correct way. If the foundation is sound, then the rest can be sound too, inshaAllah.

Unless this change happens, from me, you, and all other Muslims, then we will continue to have such bad rulers and things happening in our Ummah.

Where did you get this information about Muhammad Ali Jinnah ?
We do know that Quaid-e-Azam used to smoke, but have never heard anything about him drinking.... Why would an alcohol-drinker or anyone like that want to risk his life for Muslims?

..........Oh and like the recent presidents, Zardari is just another puppet of america...

 

[believer_15]

This is extremely disgusting, that instead of showing some respect to the political struggle of the people of Pakistan against a dictator, we are pointing fingers on them. Yes, Zardari is worst but who is to blame that all those corrupt politicians were bailed out? And yes Zardari is a wrong choice but he has the legitimacy of "amruhum shura baynahum". It is never claimed that people will always come to a correct decision after shura. But it is a way for "fasl-e-naza'" (resolution of the conflict). I am more willing to accept him as an azaab of Allah than a saviour from army.

For Allah's sake, don't make fun of the decision of the people. Criticize it, enlighten people to make a better decision for the next time, but don't tell them that a dictator was better for you and by struggling against him, you have committed a sin or you have done something against salaf assalehin. This is so disgusting.

If Zardari is a Rafidi, who do you think Musharraf was? And by the way, we in Pakistan consider shias our muslim brothers. This imported takfiri mentality by lashkar-e-jhangwi or lashkar-e-tayyeba (which is a salafi group) has caused enough bloodshed. Please keep it in the desert of Arabia, we don't need it in Pakistan.

Yes, many people in Pakistan do bid'at, many others do shirk and many others are sinful. But this is a separate issue. What has that to do with the political struggle of the people? For your information, Pakistan is already making a lot of positive progress. Brailawis are already a minority and deobandis (which are closer to you, yet you reject them ) and ahl-e-hadith are gaining more and more popularity. Does that mean, that Pakistanis deserve a punishment from Allah? Who are you to decide about that? Fear Allah, when you consider the misery of other people to be a punishment of Allah. Our Salaf assalehin had spared such thoughts for their self purification. Pointing fingers on people in difficulty and telling them, it is a punishment of Allah on you is such a sick and disgusting idea. Keep this ignorance to yourself and don't ascribe it to our Salaf assalehin.

Please, in which corner of Pakistan did u see all this progress? Haven't you been to Karachi or Lahore? And if ahl-e-haidth were really becoming popular, how come people are straying away from Islam? How come they are falling for devilish channels like QTV?....and how are sinners like amir liaquat hussain becoming so popular?......... There's no need to get emotional but I don't think what you wrote is really happening.

 

[Al-Kashmiri]

:salam2: Dear Brother Mabsoot,

I don't think Musharraf claims this lineage, he doesn't even include "Syed" in his name (perhaps because he doesn't desever it). But what can you do with the Shijrah (family tree)? A fact is a fact. And this is also a fact that he is a killer of many Muslims no matter what his lineage is. Like late King Hussain and Prince Hassan are also known to be the descendents of Prophet but their deeds are of a Munafiq.



This is coming out of pure ignorance that Syed maybe Brahmin. Frankly I heard this for the first time. Amazing!

Anyway this is a wrong debate, and being a descendent of Prophet Mohammad doesn't give anyone any advantage, neither in this world nor in the Yum-ul-Qiyamah. Only one's faith and one's deeds will give any advantage. And this is most important thing of all.

As-salaamu `alaykum,

Regarding your statement I highlighted, I think you totally misunderstood. And Syed means nothing, the descendants of the Prophet sall-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam as I said, were known, and have been for centuries in the Hijaaz, not scattered over India. Like I said, these people don't even know there own lineage and they jump up and claim to be Syed... There was a time in India, when people started to claim to be from tribes and "castes" that they were not from (due to it's link with power and jobs). Islaam teaches us to not lie about our lineage, and to base knowledge upon proofs and not just claims... So where is this proof?

Was-salaam

 

[Al-Kashmiri]

You know the drill...

...

Closed.

 

[Mabsoot]

Assalamu alaykum,

Really I think we should try and not get angry over these things and discuss in nice manner....

Personally, I feel I should not have made statement about Muhammad Ali Jinnah, as nobody is really sure what he is ! Most people agree his family were Ismaili, but as for him, some say he was a Shia Bohra... So, I take that back.. May Allah forgive him and all Muslims, and give true justice to wherever it is deserved.

I am going to close this thread before it gets out of hand, I would like to say that Brother Saif and others, please do not feel you need to reply to anything here. It is not necessary. There are no winners or losers for this, except when the Quran and Hadith are concerned, it is there that we should remain silent and accept what is commanded.

So, lets put this thing to rest shall we? and rather focus on what is needed for future of all Muslims.. and make some positive steps towards that.

This website is not political one, we just wish for the correct revival of Islam. Simple. And, as I tried pointing out earlier, that is the way me, you, our families and all the Muslims in the world, regardless of race, age or gender, will have true success!

Allah give us that, Amin.

The Current affairs/Politics section is simply for people to be better informed about Muslims and the problems they have around the world. To highlight their problems and to shed a light where there is incorrect coverage.

Take care all, and remember to love each other, give each other a nice hug (brothers only!)

assalamu alaykum!

 

[Mabsoot]

That is why when you look around in Pakistan all you see is either suicide bombings which is against Islam. Killing of Muslim Pakistani SOldiers by people which you Support like the (Taliban), and PLain Shirk which is Promoted by the Vast majority of the people there.

Assalamu alaykum,

Also, I dont think anyone should make blank statement about the Taliban and certainly on issues that are not clear. The Taliban do have issues and problems. I do not agree with many of their things, but, they are our Muslim brothers, we should keep our support for the Muslims, especially if they are being oppressed by disbelievers or those who oppose Islam and give them benefit of doubt on unclear matters..

Certainly, to kill other Muslims is haram and a very big sin. As is kidnapping, killing of civillians (whether Muslim or Non-Muslim) Allah knows best who is responsible for that and circumstances behind it. - A wise man would ask the question, what exactly the various people (i.e. soldiers) involved were doing to have got to the stage of killing each other !