Raped and killed 14 yr old, but no death penalty

[mhamzah]

I used the word debate because I though "Chatting" would be to informal.

Ok I'll give you that (benefit of the doubt).

I'm trying to undertand Islamic belife by asking questions and questioning the answers because I don't undertsand.I seem to be incapible of just reading the Koran and accepting it for what it is saying, I guess I can't get out of my non-mulsim, western cultured brain. The question "Why" seems more important to me than "Accept" I'd make a rubbish muslim but I don't drink so that's a start![/B]

As if none of us here have never asked that question 'Why'. The Quran does not demand belief, it invites belief. It is not simply delivered as: here is what you are to believe, but throughout the Quran the statements are always: Have you O man thought of such and such, have you considered so and so. It is always an invitation for you to look at the evidence; now what you believe. That is what Quran asks you to do thinks, reason and try to understand. Most of the Quran came in response to question people had. That is why two statement to be found throughout the Quran are 'They say', meaning they ask you oh Muhammad (pbuh) and 'Say' i.e. tell them.

I guess I can't get out of my non-mulsim, western cultured brain.The question "Why" seems more important to me than "Accept" I'd make a rubbish muslim but I don't drink so that's a start!

Where did the west got this concept of asking the question 'WHY' in first place???? Hopefully I wont have to tell you that.

 

[vegangoth]

Let me be blunt here. You don't but I DO believe that mainstream Media has been, and does, spread the hate against Muslims whenever find the chance. Every single chance is not being missed, I think.

Hate is spread on all sides sadly.

...And, you might not agree with me cos you intentionally repeat their words what they spread. You need to learn about Islam, debating won't get you see the right Islam - but Quran and Sunnah. BUT then I have just read:

I don't actually repeat their words, My own thoughts are if i see a muslim on TV acting like an idiot I say well it's that particular muslim. I try not to judge a person by their religon nor do I judge a person by the actions of their fellow musliml,chritians etc.

If you can't agree with what Quran says, I am afraid you might not find yourself agreeing with real Muslims on most of the topics because of a very simple and clear reason: They speak Quran!

It's not my intention to agree with Muslims ( on everything) it's my intntion to learn so that I can challange wrongly held belifes. I don't persoanlly have to agree with it to help correct ironious beleifes.

This isn't the route you take to enter Islam, NOT even in jokes.

I'm not wanting to enter Islam.

 

[mhamzah]

I guess I can't get out of my non-mulsim, western cultured brain. The question "Why" seems more important to me than "Accept" I'd make a rubbish muslim but I don't drink so that's a start!!!

Its interesting you say that but when brothers and sister asked you questions about satanist most of your responses where I do know, I can't prove that.

 

[TeenagerMuslim]

I'm not wanting to enter Islam.

I KNOW you have no such intentions, that was a counter reply to "I'd make a rubbish muslim but I don't drink so that's a start!!!" Nothing more than that.

I can't see how hate is spread on both sides when media has done such a job against ME that just because of few people like Usama Bin Laden people, who I even know who the hell are they, I can be called names by people who don't even know me! It might not be understandable by someone who has never been in the situation. Simple.

I am glad to see that you are like few of my non-Muslim friends; who are smart enough to differentiate between people and won't listen to what other says, but many people I know of ain't like that - I wonder where do they get these ideas from! I and you both know the answer.

Back in days this propaganda was against Russia then it was against Korea. Well, now it's against Muslims, collectively. You can be Next! Who knows...
Not too long ago every other video game used to turn out against Russia and Korea. Then recently it has become against Muslims. These small things can control the mind of people and always have some reaction.

I really hope by "learning" you meant that you will learn about what Muslims think of matters, and then you would correct the non-Muslims in your friends circles. That would be cool, if it really happens.

 

[mhamzah]

How that we were on the double standards of the west, let me quote what Carlos Latuff (Non-Muslim Cartoonist) has to say;

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/Islam-and-Holocaust-29665402

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/Hate-speech-41141945

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/Peace-envoy-Tony-Blair-58737578

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/Bush-s-double-standard-96116439

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/Growing-Islamophobia-in-Europe-81241880

http://latuff2.deviantart.com/art/White-washing-war-crimes-43262968

 

[abubaseer]

Vegan,

The mad christians get plenty of coverage they are just not as violent as some of the Muslims have been.


Really?
1. Christains from America (and UK) killed and are killing millions in Iraq, destroyed whole Country of Afghanistaan and are destroying it even as we speak, Yet they are not violent!
2. Christains (and Jews) in South Africa and other African countries used to practice slavery and Apartheild till yesterday. Yet, they are not violent!
3. Christains from USA send shiplaods of weapons to kill inocents in Palestine. Yet they are not violent!
4. Christains like Hitler killed people in gas chambers. Yet they are not violent!
5. Christains like Mussolini are not violent!
6. Christians organizations like KKK and skinheads who kills people just beacuse their skin color doesnot match. Yet they are not violent
7. Not to speak of what Christains have done in the past...enslaving black people from Africa and bringing them to USA. Killing Indians in America. Enslaving women for sex in Asia Pacific and colonizing other countries...Yet it is all non-violence!

Unfortuantley many Muslims live in non muslim countries so they are in a minority and saying thign like every woman should were a burqa


Nudists colonies and street prostitutes in these same countries are no problwm, but if Muslim Woman wants to cover, she is suddenly violent!

 

[vegangoth]

Vegan,

The mad christians get plenty of coverage they are just not as violent as some of the Muslims have been.


Really?
1. Christains from America (and UK) killed and are killing millions in Iraq, destroyed whole Country of Afghanistaan and are destroying it even as we speak, Yet they are not violent!
2. Christains (and Jews) in South Africa and other African countries used to practice slavery and Apartheild till yesterday. Yet, they are not violent!
3. Christains from USA send shiplaods of weapons to kill inocents in Palestine. Yet they are not violent!
4. Christains like Hitler killed people in gas chambers. Yet they are not violent!
5. Christains like Mussolini are not violent!
6. Christians organizations like KKK and skinheads who kills people just beacuse their skin color doesnot match. Yet they are not violent
7. Not to speak of what Christains have done in the past...enslaving black people from Africa and bringing them to USA. Killing Indians in America. Enslaving women for sex in Asia Pacific and colonizing other countries...Yet it is all non-violence!

I take your point about the christians,personally I think the all 3 abrahamic religons have their violent nutters. Why do you think that could be?

.

Unfortuantley many Muslims live in non muslim countries so they are in a minority and saying thign like every woman should were a burqa


Nudists colonies and street prostitutes in these same countries are no problwm, but if Muslim Woman wants to cover, she is suddenly violent!

Did I say Muslim women were violent? I don't think I did but i apologise if I did

 

[vegangoth]

Its interesting you say that but when brothers and sister asked you questions about satanist most of your responses where I do know, I can't prove that.

True but first you have to undertsand what it means to be a Satanist. Satanism is not like many religons, we have things proven to us that we can't prove to others so to try to is just impossible.But if we were to talk to another stanists about our experiance we find that they completey get it and have had similear experiances. It makes us look a bit stupid in the eyes of the non beliver but that's fine.

 

[mhamzah]

True but first you have to undertsand what it means to be a Satanist. Satanism is not like many religons, we have things proven to us that we can't prove to others so to try to is just impossible.But if we were to talk to another stanists about our experiance we find that they completey get it and have had similear experiances. It makes us look a bit stupid in the eyes of the non beliver but that's fine.

Fair enough, but thats not the first time I am hearing that, thats exactly the argument many Christains will tell you, many Hindus will tell you. Give me time I'll bring you some Muslims who will tell that.

WHAT DOES IT PROVE NOW. Let me go back home and I'll send you a link about this.

 

[mhamzah]

I take your point about the christians,personally I think the all 3 abrahamic religons have their violent nutters. Why do you think that could be?

Atleast your list is growing. What about Hindu, Sikhs and Satanists and Atheists. Want details.

We need to remeber that there are about 1.5 Billions Muslims around the world. Say if about 4% of them don't act like Muslim, at about 60 Million (equals U.K Population) 'so called' Muslim.

 

[IslamicGirl24]

True but first you have to undertsand what it means to be a Satanist. Satanism is not like many religons, we have things proven to us that we can't prove to others so to try to is just impossible.But if we were to talk to another stanists about our experiance we find that they completey get it and have had similear experiances. It makes us look a bit stupid in the eyes of the non beliver but that's fine.

Wouldn't you atleast "try" explaining those experiences?? You will be surprised that some of us will actually believe you. It is possible for humans to communicate with the jinns.

Let me ask you a question...
Do you believe that there are other kind of species like Satan?? I mean, other jinns like Satan? Do u believe that?

 

[IslamIsTheFuture]

Salam Alekum
Am not suprised with this kinda things happening in Iraq... Its very sad what they doing to our brothers and sisters... May Allah destory them and give victory to our Ummah.. Ameen..

 

[FreedomFighter]

The mad christians get plenty of coverage they are just not as violent as some of the Muslims have been.

:salam2:

that is complete rubbish. what do you mean they are not as violent as some of the Muslims have been. you are ignoring all the horrible things they are doing to the Muslims. they are the most violent and are terrorists. they kill innocents, they rape, they occupy, forgot what israel is doing, forgot what america is doing ? they are the most violent people around. and are you forgeting even this topic talks about the most cruel acts and that is done by these non-Muslims.

 

[TeenagerMuslim]

The mad christians get plenty of coverage they are just not as violent as some of the Muslims have been.

:salam2:

that is complete rubbish. what do you mean they are not as violent as some of the Muslims have been. you are ignoring all the horrible things they are doing to the Muslims. they are the most violent and are terrorists. they kill innocents, they rape, they occupy, forgot what israel is doing, forgot what america is doing ? they are the most violent people around. and are you forgeting even this topic talks about the most cruel acts and that is done by these non-Muslims.

May be killing millions of Muslims and occupying their lands isn't any violent act! Strange enough.

 

[vegangoth]

I think we should stop seeing this as a muslim v christian issue and see it as humans killig humans. Who cares what your religon is, being violent to one and other is just wrong. Unfortuantley when ever there is war there is war crimes. I apologise for my lack of history in my posts of course christians have a very,very violent history. It would be hard to find any religon that does not have a violent past.

 

[betty]

American soldiers are held up to standards that are "supposed" to set them apart from militant soldiers. This never should have happened!

I think we should stop seeing this as a muslim v christian issue and see it as humans killig humans. Who cares what your religon is, being violent to one and other is just wrong. Unfortuantley when ever there is war there is war crimes. I apologise for my lack of history in my posts of course christians have a very,very violent history. It would be hard to find any religon that does not have a violent past.

 

[FreedomFighter]

I apologise for my lack of history in my posts of course christians have a very,very violent history. It would be hard to find any religon that does not have a violent past.

:salam2:

no need to talk about history when we can just look at whats happening now, we only need to look at whats happening right now. right these NOW. what are they doing NOW.. ya u name it and add to the history, they've always been that way.. is there any west country that is being occupyd ? now you look at the Muslim countries. the west are too violent. occupying, torture people, kill them, kill the innocents, making peoples life misery. yes being violent to one another is just wrong. but we all know the west is too violent, they just have a good media to make it look like its not violence what they are doing.

 

[Muslimz]

Oh Allah!! Save every one of us from all these evils. I m sure if it hadn't been a Muslim girl who had been raped the sentence would have been different.

 

[believer4life]

dear vegangoth you should be aware this is a muslim website so keep your negative opinions of muslims to yourself

 

[adam_arb]

This is just one of the reasons why we need to defend the muslim lands from them. This is just a small part of what they bring to our lands.