Sister in an occupational dilemma (halal or haram Job?)

UmQassim

New Member
Asalam alaykum to all here. I am in a little bit of a dilemma (a psychological/emotional one) and need some suggestions as to what I should do or who to talk to about this.

I have been working for the Salvation Army for quite some time as a supervisor for the suicide prevention services. I basically work from home and my daily work constitutes talking to clients on the phone or supervising shifts of other volunteers on the crisis line. people who are depressed/suicidal or in a crisis normally call the line for help.

What I do is basically assess the suicide risk, provide the necessary intervention whether it is supprt and connecting the individual to community resources or call the ambulance and convey the relevant information to the police.

My entire Job is done at home and although the Salvation army is an explicit christian based organization, I work remotely from home and the job does not require me to give "christian" advice and does not interfere with my Islamic values and practices.

I have to admit that when I forst started working for them, I was concerened about the nature of Job in terms of its implications with respect to my deen. But now Alhamdullilah, by the mercy of Allah, I started to become more serious about my deen and am making an effort to change my life so that it revolves around my Islamic practices/obligations.

Nowi am very very worried that may be this is a bad job for a sister like myself.

The reasons are:
1. Some ofthe clients are males. although I keep it to the point and professional, it does not change the fact that they are males. My husband has not discouraged but i am starting to feel uncomfortable.

2. I spend most of my time listening to clients complain about their life. the clients' problems range from addictions and abuse to relationship problems (unlawful haram relationships) and some other problems that i am too embarrased to even mention. so this may constitute as listening to haram therefore is wrong?

3. the Salavation Army as a whole is an international Protestant church with its own "members". I am not considered a member as I am a Muslim and they are fully aware of that but i am part of the suicide prevention staff which fall under their umbrella. The senior staff there have never tried to impose their values or beiliefs on me and have never questioned mine. But it is still a christian based organization- this may be a problem?

I feel so torn. I am not sure if I should quit my job. I only have a BSc degree and no other work experience. If this job is wrong, I will definitely quit for the sake of Allah. I want to discuss this with a scholar but I am having a hard time finding a reliable source that offers timely service.

If this job is not suitable for a muslim sister, can anyone suggest some modest jobs for muslim sisters that are halal? I have three children and my husband does not make so much and so we help each other out.

Anyone have any advice as to how to handle this? Do you think this is a haram job? anyone has access to any fatwa's on this?

Thank you all for taking the time to read my post. May Allah reward you for your help. jazaka allah Kheir.
Ramadan Mubarak to you all.
 

Keen4Deen

New Member
Assalamu Alaikum,

Sister my advice to you would be to send your question and explain your situation on islamqa.com, they will better provide you with a conclusive answer.

I feel that you need to talk to an imam, scholar or someone who is very well versed in the deen. Everyone on this forum will give you their opinion however, what you need is a definitive answer not just an opinion. Sister, I advise you to seek people of knowledge.
 

JenGiove

Junior Member
Asalam alaykum to all here. I am in a little bit of a dilemma (a psychological/emotional one) and need some suggestions as to what I should do or who to talk to about this.

I have been working for the Salvation Army for quite some time as a supervisor for the suicide prevention services. I basically work from home and my daily work constitutes talking to clients on the phone or supervising shifts of other volunteers on the crisis line. people who are depressed/suicidal or in a crisis normally call the line for help.

What I do is basically assess the suicide risk, provide the necessary intervention whether it is supprt and connecting the individual to community resources or call the ambulance and convey the relevant information to the police.

My entire Job is done at home and although the Salvation army is an explicit christian based organization, I work remotely from home and the job does not require me to give "christian" advice and does not interfere with my Islamic values and practices.

I have to admit that when I forst started working for them, I was concerened about the nature of Job in terms of its implications with respect to my deen. But now Alhamdullilah, by the mercy of Allah, I started to become more serious about my deen and am making an effort to change my life so that it revolves around my Islamic practices/obligations.

Nowi am very very worried that may be this is a bad job for a sister like myself.

The reasons are:
1. Some ofthe clients are males. although I keep it to the point and professional, it does not change the fact that they are males. My husband has not discouraged but i am starting to feel uncomfortable.

2. I spend most of my time listening to clients complain about their life. the clients' problems range from addictions and abuse to relationship problems (unlawful haram relationships) and some other problems that i am too embarrased to even mention. so this may constitute as listening to haram therefore is wrong?

3. the Salavation Army as a whole is an international Protestant church with its own "members". I am not considered a member as I am a Muslim and they are fully aware of that but i am part of the suicide prevention staff which fall under their umbrella. The senior staff there have never tried to impose their values or beiliefs on me and have never questioned mine. But it is still a christian based organization- this may be a problem?

I feel so torn. I am not sure if I should quit my job. I only have a BSc degree and no other work experience. If this job is wrong, I will definitely quit for the sake of Allah. I want to discuss this with a scholar but I am having a hard time finding a reliable source that offers timely service.

If this job is not suitable for a muslim sister, can anyone suggest some modest jobs for muslim sisters that are halal? I have three children and my husband does not make so much and so we help each other out.

Anyone have any advice as to how to handle this? Do you think this is a haram job? anyone has access to any fatwa's on this?

Thank you all for taking the time to read my post. May Allah reward you for your help. jazaka allah Kheir.
Ramadan Mubarak to you all.

:salam2: Sister, I must admire you for your courage and inner strength. Not everyone can do what you are doing.

Keen4Deen mentioned sending your question to Islamqa but I have one slightly better...Islamqa has a Facebook page where you can pose your concerns and when I posted questions, I received a response within a day or two...granted, I also mentioned that I was non-Muslim so that may have caught their eyes and nudged them into a quick response for the sake of Dawah...only Allah knows.

Beyond that the circumstances are so complex that I think you definitely need to be in a deep conversation with a scholar. I think my biggest concern is that YOU are feeling uncomfortable...and that is what needs to be fixed first.

Let us know how you do...

:)
 

UmQassim

New Member
Thank you for taking the time to read my post. I will get in touch with a scholar and Imam and hopefully get some perspective on my situation Insha-allah.

Jazaka Allah Kheir.
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
salary dilemma...

Greetings to you and your family.

Well you should take help / guidance, as suggested in previous comments. Your dilemma I guess is in difference you perceive between
b. Salaried in your current organization.
(The organization hired you to take care of its patients who need counselling )
v/s
a. earning as individual practitioner for suicidal patient
(Patient comes to you out of choice, you stick to ethics of profession and treat the patient. So, this is fine. )

There are many aspects - your role, how crucial the job is for your family, negative effect the stories have on you, a healers ethic, the organizations mission..whether your role is humane or evangelical. Since you work there you would know better, about their motive - evangelical or social. And also assess your roles nature, incase the personal details of their life, brings discomfort, you might want to look for a job elsewhere.

Inspite of learned-ones say in this matter, incase you are not very comfortable, you should discontinue, because your peace of mind matters. From clarity of your writing, you will am sure, find a similar or better role in another organization. Insha Allah!

Happened to come across a past court decision related to salvation army's mission statement - Google Search "Dodge v/s salvation army"
Salvation Army - are second largest charity organization in US as per wikipedia, Forbes (Search: "200 largest US Charities"). They surely have done good, while sticking to a christian mission .
Present mission statements
- salvationarmy.org/ihq/www_sa.nsf/vw-sublinks/2AF3956053A88A5E80256D4E003B4965?opendocument
- salvationarmy.org/ihq/www_sa.nsf/vw-sublinks/ABF2735652E0FF3980256DF6007C3875?openDocument
- salvationarmy.org/ihq/www_sa.nsf/vw-sublinks/7ACD09BD8ABFA928802573A80051F0CD?opendocument

 

Killi_Feyzo

Junior Member
Subhanallah may Allah (swt) bless you in this Life and in achira

Allah (swt) will bless inshallah everyone who try hard for the sake of Allah
and may give you inshallah something better
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Assalaam walaikum,

Sister,

I have been a crisis counselor and therapist. I have had male clients face to face in those crisis. I am also a marriage counselor. ( at this stage of my life..its more like what have I not done).

The mere fact that I presented myself in hijab was a blessing to me. The clients took my role more seriously. I often used the forbidden "God" word in my therapy.

I would not try to convert anyone to Islam. I found the comfort level of my clients. And those who were success within the duration of therapy always always told me it was because of my faith that they could see a way out of their problems. It was not the therapeutic modality that I necessarily used but the fact that a Muslim showed them the light.

The field is difficult. And an undergraduate degree in the field is not going to give you many jobs. The Salvation Army is a good organization. They take care of people and have been since the 1840's. They do not ask too many questions. They are good. There is a depression here. Jobs are hard to find.

I never saw myself as a woman interacting with a man. I am a professional who can make assessments and diagnosis. In many areas where I worked there was a paucity of clinicians who were willing to travel to the areas I serviced. My clients were grateful. The men took me seriously.

If all you are doing is giving referrals from home there is no sin. How can there be a sin if you save someone from making mistakes? You have a dream job in a tough economy. On most jobs there is some interaction with men. You keep it sweet and short.
 

abdul-aziz

Junior Member
Asalam alaykum to all here. I am in a little bit of a dilemma (a psychological/emotional one) and need some suggestions as to what I should do or who to talk to about this.

I have been working for the Salvation Army for quite some time as a supervisor for the suicide prevention services. I basically work from home and my daily work constitutes talking to clients on the phone or supervising shifts of other volunteers on the crisis line. people who are depressed/suicidal or in a crisis normally call the line for help.

What I do is basically assess the suicide risk, provide the necessary intervention whether it is supprt and connecting the individual to community resources or call the ambulance and convey the relevant information to the police.

My entire Job is done at home and although the Salvation army is an explicit christian based organization, I work remotely from home and the job does not require me to give "christian" advice and does not interfere with my Islamic values and practices.

I have to admit that when I forst started working for them, I was concerened about the nature of Job in terms of its implications with respect to my deen. But now Alhamdullilah, by the mercy of Allah, I started to become more serious about my deen and am making an effort to change my life so that it revolves around my Islamic practices/obligations.

Nowi am very very worried that may be this is a bad job for a sister like myself.

The reasons are:
1. Some ofthe clients are males. although I keep it to the point and professional, it does not change the fact that they are males. My husband has not discouraged but i am starting to feel uncomfortable.

2. I spend most of my time listening to clients complain about their life. the clients' problems range from addictions and abuse to relationship problems (unlawful haram relationships) and some other problems that i am too embarrased to even mention. so this may constitute as listening to haram therefore is wrong?

3. the Salavation Army as a whole is an international Protestant church with its own "members". I am not considered a member as I am a Muslim and they are fully aware of that but i am part of the suicide prevention staff which fall under their umbrella. The senior staff there have never tried to impose their values or beiliefs on me and have never questioned mine. But it is still a christian based organization- this may be a problem?

I feel so torn. I am not sure if I should quit my job. I only have a BSc degree and no other work experience. If this job is wrong, I will definitely quit for the sake of Allah. I want to discuss this with a scholar but I am having a hard time finding a reliable source that offers timely service.

If this job is not suitable for a muslim sister, can anyone suggest some modest jobs for muslim sisters that are halal? I have three children and my husband does not make so much and so we help each other out.

Anyone have any advice as to how to handle this? Do you think this is a haram job? anyone has access to any fatwa's on this?

Thank you all for taking the time to read my post. May Allah reward you for your help. jazaka allah Kheir.
Ramadan Mubarak to you all.

:salam2:

I wanted to relay to you differently than what was posted for you to ask; it may not be applicable to your situation. Of course everybody can only answer with their knowledge doesn't mean it is the only or right answer though.

You see the internet has made information span the globe. No doubt sheik Manajjid of islamQA, hiftha Allah, is one of the sheiks who is posting fatwas on the internet. In fact you will find among forums it the most quoted collection. It seems to appeal to those who only search via English and don't understand Arabic.

However, there are many sheiks who can be termed as scholars. In fact we have a number of sheiks here in the USA who are "scholars." It would make more sense for you to go and ask a sheik here in the USA, they will be more suited to address domestic USA issues better than someone where you don't even know where they are at. Also the sheiks here in the USA are in constant communication with other Muslim scholars accross the globe.

Your situation needs a little more thought than the average because you are doing something that is very good for mankind. Whoever saves a life is as if they saved all of mankind 5:32. So your job function is great one.


in the mean time for now here are some references of some great sahaba you may have not heard of, ra:

article about the First Muslim Female Officer (she also taught others of curing):
http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49956&highlight=shifa+bint+abdullah

and here is the video about her:

http://www.mashahd.net/video/bccd49f5ed69f316d86

wa Allah ya'lam

:wasalam:
 

IHearIslam

make dua 4 ma finals
Assalamu alaikum,

I am not going to get into the Islamic ruling and stuff because I am not that knowledgeable.....however, I wanted to say that I do admire your job and would actually LOVE to have that kinda job. Suicide is a problem for both Muslims and non-Muslims, and if we can save a life.....why would it be against Islam? imagine the difference you're making? think about all those lives you've saved and will continue to save? of course your clients are male but the job is all professional....consider yourself a doctor, one who by the his knowledge and practice can save a life, would you pass that JUST because that life might be in a male's body??

Allah has made this deen easy, so I think that as long as you keep it professional you're ok. Also please do it for Allah's sake, insha'Allah you will be rewarded.

Didn't Allah say He who saves a life is like he saved the whole humanity??? subhana'Allah, many people would love to be in your position sister....well at least I would!! I feel like your job is a rewarding job!!! you must feel happy everytime you talk someone outta suicide :)
 
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