Is it permissible to tour Pyramids, Egypt and Petra, Jordan?

ahmed_indian

to Allah we belong
:salam2:,

is it allowed to tour those places knowing they were disobedient to Allah.

pharoah in Egypt....pyramids

thamud tribe ....petra, jordan

:confused:

i think we were told to visit those places crying.........but now ppl are visiting them as tourism and fun.

any fatwa or authentic opinion?
 

weakslave

Junior Member
Regarding the places of the people of Hijr:

"Ibn Shihab reported, and he had been talking about the stony abodes of Thamud, and he said: Salim b. 'Abdullah reported that 'Abdullah b. Umar said : We were passing along with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) through the habitations of Hijr, and Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Do not enter but weepingly the habitations of these persons who committed tyranny among themselves, lest the same calamity should fall upon you as it fell upon them.He then urged his mount to proceed quickly and pass through that valley hurriedly. "

But I do not know that any curse had befallen the pyramids area.

Some of the things we do as muslims really do need some answers. Imagine the Prophet Muhammad (SAAWS) said:

Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet said, "Do not set out on a journey except for three mosques i.e. Al-Masjid-AI-Haram, the Mosque of Allah's Apostle , and the Mosque of Al-Aqsa, (Mosque of Jerusalem)."

To reiterate the hadith "do not set out to visit any building or structure other than these three masaajid".

And Allaah knows best.
 

Al-Kashmiri

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Regarding the places of the people of Hijr:

"Ibn Shihab reported, and he had been talking about the stony abodes of Thamud, and he said: Salim b. 'Abdullah reported that 'Abdullah b. Umar said : We were passing along with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) through the habitations of Hijr, and Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Do not enter but weepingly the habitations of these persons who committed tyranny among themselves, lest the same calamity should fall upon you as it fell upon them.He then urged his mount to proceed quickly and pass through that valley hurriedly. "

But I do not know that any curse had befallen the pyramids area.

Some of the things we do as muslims really do need some answers. Imagine the Prophet Muhammad (SAAWS) said:

Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet said, "Do not set out on a journey except for three mosques i.e. Al-Masjid-AI-Haram, the Mosque of Allah's Apostle , and the Mosque of Al-Aqsa, (Mosque of Jerusalem)."

To reiterate the hadith "do not set out to visit any building or structure other than these three masaajid".

And Allaah knows best.

As-salaamu `alaykum

A very important hadeeth maa shaa' Allaah, which I would cite all the time when thinking of the pyramids. The pyramids are the tombs of the mushrikeen, the worst of them who use to call to the worship of themselves, the sun and others... I don't understand why we would want to visit them and look at these structures of shirk in awe, they are tombs of the tawaagheet. Also, they are built such that when one enters, he must "bow" his way in. Would we want to bow for a single second to anyone other than Allaah? Another thing, the environment there isn't very ideal for us, it pretty much resembles a beach.

One of my friends asked Shaykh Majdi Sultaan (a Doctor from Al-Azhar, student of Shaykh Ibn Baaz, Al-`Uthaymeen and Aadam Al-Ethiopee) of Egypt this question. The answer was a clear no. My friend mentioned that some people say that we should visit them based upon a general aayah of the Qur'aan, and his reply was, to the effect of, "whoever has said that is an idiot". That's the only answer I know of a Shaykh.
 

Janaan

ربنا اغفر لنا ذنوبنا
Staff member
Wa'laikum salaam

Akhi, don't take it the wrong way but there are much better place to visit...
 

um_mustafa

sister in Islam
Salams , thought this was intresting,


Obligation to destroy idols
Is it obligatory to destroy statues in Islam, even if they are part of the legacy of human civilization? Why is it that when the Sahaabah conquered other lands and saw statues there they did not destroy them?.


Praise be to Allaah.

The evidence of sharee’ah indicates that it is obligatory to destroy idols, for example:

1 – Muslim (969) narrated that Abu’l-Hayaaj al-Asadi said: ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib said to me: “Shall I not send you with the same instructions as the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) sent me? ‘Do not leave any image without defacing it or any built-up grave without leveling it.’”

2 – Muslim (832) narrated from ‘Urwah ibn ‘Abasah that he said to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “With what were you sent?” He said, “I was sent to uphold the ties of kinship, to break the idols, and so that Allaah would be worshipped alone with no partner or associate.”

The obligation to destroy them is even stronger if they are worshipped instead of Allaah.

3 – al-Bukhaari (3020) and Muslim (2476) narrated that Jareer ibn ‘Abd-Allaah al-Bajali said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to me: “O Jareer, will you not relieve me of Dhu’l-Khalsah?” That was a house (in Yemen) belonging to the (tribe of) Khath’am, which was called Ka’bat al-Yamaaniyyah. I set out with one hundred and fifty horsemen. I used not to sit firm on horses and I mentioned that to the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). He struck me on my chest with his hand and said, 'O Allaah! Make him firm and make him one who guides others and is guided on the right path.' " So Jareer went and burned it with fire, then Jareer sent a man called Abu Artaat to the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). He said, “I did not come to you until we had left it like a scabby camel.” Then the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) blessed the horses of (the tribe of) Ahmas and their men five times.

Al-Haafiz Ibn Hajar said:

This hadeeth indicates that it is prescribed to remove things that may tempt or confuse the people, whether they are buildings, people, animals or inanimate objects.

4 – The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) sent Khaalid ibn al-Waleed (may Allaah be pleased with him) on a campaign to destroy al-‘Uzza.

5 – and he sent Sa’d ibn Zayd al-Ashhali (may Allaah be pleased with him) on a campaign to destroy Manaat.

6 – And he sent ‘Amr ibn al-‘Aas (may Allaah be pleased with him) on a campaign to destroy Suwaa’. All of that happened after the Conquest of Makkah.

Al-Bidaayah wa’l-Nihaayah, 4/712. 776. 5/83; al-Seerah al-Nabawiyyah by Dr. ‘Ali al-Salaabi, 2/1186.

Al-Nawawi said in Sharh Muslim when discussing the issue of image-making:

They were unanimously agreed that whatever casts a shadow is not allowed and must be changed.

Images that cast a shadow are three-dimensional images like these statues.

With regard to what is said about the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them) not destroying idols in the conquered lands, this is merely conjecture. The companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) would not have left idols and statues alone, especially since they were worshipped at that time.

If it is asked, how come the Sahaabah left alone the ancient idols of the Pharaohs and Phoenicians? The answer is that these idols fall into one of three categories:

1 – These idols may have been in remote places that the Sahaabah did not reach; when the Sahaabah conquered Egypt, for example, that does not mean that they reached every part of the land.

2 – These idols may not have been visible, rather they may have been inside Pharaonic buildings etc. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) told us to hasten when passing through the abodes of the wrongdoers and those who had been punished, and he forbade entering such places. In al-Saheehayn it is says: “Do not enter upon those who have been punished unless you are weeping, lest there befall you something like that which befall them.” He (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said that when he passed by ashaab al-hijr [the dwellers of the rocky tract – see al-Hijr 15:80], in the land of Thamood, the people of Saalih (peace be upon him).

According to another report narrated in al-Saheehayn, “If you are not weeping, then do not enter upon them, lest there befall you something like that which befall them.”

What we think is that if the companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) saw a temple or building belonging of these people, they did not enter it or even look at what was inside it.

This will dispel any confusion about why the Sahaabah did not see the Pyramids or what is inside them. There is also the possibility that their doors and entrances were covered with sand at that time.

3 – Many of these idols that are visible nowadays were covered and hidden, and have only been discovered recently, or they have been brought from remote places that the companions of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not reach.

Al-Zarkali was asked about the Pyramids and the Sphinx etc: Did the Sahaabah who entered Egypt see them?

He said: They were mostly covered with sand, especially the Sphinx.

Shibh Jazeerat al-‘Arab, 4/1188

Then even if we assume that there was a statue that was visible and not hidden, then we still have to prove that the Sahaabah saw it and were able to destroy it.

The fact of the matter is that the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them) would not have been able to destroy some of these statues. It took twenty days to destroy some of these statues even with tools, equipment, and explosives etc that were not available to the Sahaabah at all.

This is indicated by what Ibn Khuldoon said in al-Muqaddimah (p. 383), that the caliph al-Rasheed was unable to destroy the estrade of Chosroes. He started to do that, and he gathered men and tools, and burned it with fire, and poured vinegar on it, but he was unable to do it. And the caliph al-Ma’moon wanted to destroy the Pyramids in Egypt and he gathered workers but he could not do it.

With regard to the excuse that these statues are part of the legacy of mankind, no attention should be paid to such words. Al-Laat, al-‘Uzaa, Hubal, Manaat and other idols were also a legacy for those who worshipped them among Quraysh and the Arabs.

This is a legacy, but it is a haraam legacy which should be uprooted. When the command comes from Allaah and His Messenger, then the believer must hasten to obey, and the command of Allaah and His Messenger cannot be rejected on the grounds of this flimsy excuse. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“The only saying of the faithful believers, when they are called to Allaah (His Words, the Qur’aan) and His Messenger, to judge between them, is that they say: “We hear and we obey.” And such are the successful (who will live forever in Paradise)”

[al-Noor 24:51]

We ask Allaah to help the Muslims to do that which He loves and which pleased Him.

And Allaah knows best.


Islam Q&A
 

um_mustafa

sister in Islam
The hadeeth forbids taking a journey to any mosque except one of the three it mentions. The hadeeth does not prohibit a journey to all other places. The pyramids have never been claimed to be mosques by anybody. The punishment of Pharaoh did not happen at the pyramids, it happened at the Red Sea.

The pyramids are not structures of shirk. Nobody has ever prostrated to the pyramids or begged them for forgiveness!

As for Petra, is it established that it's the town of Thamood? If it is then we can visit but pass by it quickly and seek refuge in God from His punishment, as the prophet, peace be upon him, did when his caravan passed by the town of `Aad, Iram.

If we are not allowed to visit places of punishment, then what is the meaning of the many verses of the Quran that recommend us to go visit them, such as,
30_42.gif
"Say, [O Muhammad], "Travel through the land and observe how was the end of those before." Most of them were associators [of others with God in worship]." (30:42)

Mashallah brother that is also very intresting as I was wondering the same thing, as we visited the dead sea and then thought that maybe we shouldn't be there, Allah ualiam, inshallah we can do a bit more reserch in to this, to find out , where we can visit and where we can not inshallah.
w/salams
 

weakslave

Junior Member
If we are not allowed to visit places of punishment, then what is the meaning of the many verses of the Quran that recommend us to go visit them, such as,
30_42.gif
"Say, [O Muhammad], "Travel through the land and observe how was the end of those before." Most of them were associators [of others with God in worship]." (30:42)

I think you are interpreting the verse using your own opinions. It is very clear that Allaah says when you travel to observe those places where destruction was sent, but you cannot take that verse to say "you should go visit these places"! There is a clear distinction.

I am a traveler, I come across these places I would remember what Allaah had done to them and I would weep as Muhammad (SAAWS) ordered me to do. But I would not pack my bags leave my house and set out on a journey just to see these places.

Jazaka Allaahu Khairan for your efforts, but it is best to avoid personal interpretation of the verses. And Allaah knows best.
 

weakslave

Junior Member
If it's any other interpretation then we must conclude that the prophet prohibited visiting any place that is not one of the three mosques. This cannot be true because he visited At-Taa'if which is not one of those three places and didn't even have a mosque when he visited it. He and many Muslims frequented Syria and Yemen and as I mentioned in my earlier post, he also visited Iram (in today's Oman).

You don't really believe that it is forbidden for a Muslim to visit any place other than the three mosques, do you?

At-Taa'if is a city not a structure.

Firstly, if you read back carefully, no one has claimed it is haram to visit these places.

Secondly, the Prophet SAAWS's hadith is mentioning buildings/structures. And if you were to consider a masjid a building or a structure, then the prophet SAAWS said do not pack your bags and set on a journey to any other structure or building. This is why I requested you look up the interpretation of this hadith from a scholar, otherwise we will continue to make assumptions.

And if you think about it, it makes perfect sense. You are going to spend tens of thousands of dollars, potentially, to visit a man-made structure in which shirk may have been committed? As I mentioned before, anyone who does this has a lot of explaining to do to Allaah subhanahu wa-taala.

And Allaah knows best.
 

almanar

Seeking Allah's Love
it's nice to visit petra
i have visited it once not because in fond of the beliefs of the late people
but because of the amazing nature and the buildings make us feel great about Allah.
 

Al-Kashmiri

Well-Known Member
Staff member
The hadeeth forbids taking a journey to any mosque except one of the three it mentions. The hadeeth does not prohibit a journey to all other places. The pyramids have never been claimed to be mosques by anybody. The punishment of Pharaoh did not happen at the pyramids, it happened at the Red Sea.

The pyramids are not structures of shirk. Nobody has ever prostrated to the pyramids or begged them for forgiveness!

As for Petra, is it established that it's the town of Thamood? If it is then we can visit but pass by it quickly and seek refuge in God from His punishment, as the prophet, peace be upon him, did when his caravan passed by the town of `Aad, Iram.

If we are not allowed to visit places of punishment, then what is the meaning of the many verses of the Quran that recommend us to go visit them, such as,
30_42.gif
"Say, [O Muhammad], "Travel through the land and observe how was the end of those before." Most of them were associators [of others with God in worship]." (30:42)

As-salaamu `alaykum

I meant the other hadeeth about al-Hijr. I should've made that more clear since the other hadeeth was in bold. And there was no indication of mine to claim it was the Pharoah of the Exodus, but generally we know that they claimed themselves to be deities, or worshipped the sun, and various other deities.

The fact that when you enter, you are required to bow and venerate them, is enough for me to label them as structures of shirk, because entrance pretty much requires your bowing to be offered to them, unless you decide to walk in backwards lol.

Allaah knows best about this affair, I just dislike how the Muslims rush to these sites, behaving all touristy and naive, not even taking a lesson from the visit. They visit only because they are from the "7 Wonders of the World". The questioner asked for a Shaykh's fatwa, and that's what I gave. Despite my opposition, I'm as unclear on this issue as the question, as the fatwa isn't convincing enough in light of the aayah. How the `Ullemaa' reconciliated between the aayah and the ahaadeeth regarding Al-Hijr, I would like to know.

Was-salaam
 

Al-Kashmiri

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Baarak Allaahu feekum.

Making something haraam is a serious thing. I believe some of the salaf saw it worse than making an affair halaal.

Allaah knos best.
 
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