atheist looking to have answers about islam

[db92509]

hello forum. could someone please help with the following question. As I understand it the kaaba is a pre islamic monument utilised by pagans. why do muslims revere it it considering its roots. the defacto answer i have previously had is that abraham built it as a muslim building but that doesnt hold much credence with me. is it not more realistic that it was a political move to unite the tribes of the time considering jerusalem was the original epicentre of the muslims. How do you feel about prostating towards a pagan polyestic symbol whenever you pray?

regards

 

[kiki18]

why doesn't it hold much credence with you? this would be good to know to help you. if we new it was a pagan symbol we wouldn't prostrate towards it. plus we do it only as a uniform thing for unity, not to worship the building alone.

 

[Rashadi]

greetings and welcome to the site, you brought up a good point and you deserve an answer to ur question. first of all, the kaaba was built by abraham(as) and this was old news which the pagan arabs knew about but had long corrupted. it had been thousands of years since abraham and a lot happens in such long time. even the jews were aware of this and they used to mock te pagans and say 'look what they have done to the house of God'. there were even times where jews and christians prayed there as well. it was nothing political but the will of the Creator. the pagans never disputed that it was the house of God nor the fact about abraham cuz they knew already. muslims were only ordered to face jerusalem at first as test for the jews of madina who respected and recognized muhammad(saaws) at first and only rejected later out of arrogance, enmity and the revelation revealed to him. i tried to be brief and didn't want take up a lot of time with details which may bore u. take care!

 

[db92509]

thank you for taking the time to respnd, much appreciated. As i understand it the kaaba was a pagan monument i dont think there is much dispute aout that as it confirmed in islamic writing, and i know you are aware that jerusalem was the original direction that muslims prayed towards it was only subsequently changed to mecca and the kaaba, i was just interested in your thoughts as the reasons for that.

regards

 

[Shamim56]

thank you for taking the time to respnd, much appreciated. As i understand it the kaaba was a pagan monument i dont think there is much dispute aout that as it confirmed in islamic writing, and i know you are aware that jerusalem was the original direction that muslims prayed towards it was only subsequently changed to mecca and the kaaba, i was just interested in your thoughts as the reasons for that.

regards

Feel free ask more questions, we love to answer them.

And to your question the Kaaba was before Jerusalem (during time of arabraham) they only prayed toward there because the power was in the hand's of the pagans(correct me if im wrong)

 

[db92509]

thank you for making me feel welcome on this forum. I have many questions to ask and i hope to ask them in the following days. this particular question was prompted as i was watching a video of the kaaba on youtube and felt the need to get some answers from muslims.

it just seemed very convenient to say that abraham built the kaaba but it still doesnt explain why it was changed from jerusalemit seems very political rather than a religious decision. what was to stop the muslims praying towards mecca fro the very beginning as muslims do today from where ever in the world

regards

 

[Shamim56]

why it was changed from jerusalem

From the very beggining the Kaaba was considered the most holy site. After Abraham it went through many changes in societes. Since it is considered the most holy site why let the pagans destroy it's original image by placing more than 300 god's in it. The Prophet didnt have enough power revive the original image of the Kaaba until later on

I dont think i completly understand your question, but i hope my answer helped

 

[Rashadi]

thank you for taking the time to respnd, much appreciated. As i understand it the kaaba was a pagan monument i dont think there is much dispute aout that as it confirmed in islamic writing, and i know you are aware that jerusalem was the original direction that muslims prayed towards it was only subsequently changed to mecca and the kaaba, i was just interested in your thoughts as the reasons for that.

regards

u very welcome. the kaaba was used by pagans but had not always belonged to them nor was it for them. the kaaba and rituals were taught by abraham to the ppl there and over the thousands of year they wer corrupted. their rituals became contaminate, forgotten and idols were worshipped along side God which is a big no no. it is of course ur choice on what u want to believe but i am obliged to be honest. it isn't difficult for us and the more i study ancient religions, the more it confirms the quranic claims and elevates my faith.

 

[kiki18]

well if you see the timeline you will see that the kaaba was built by Abraham before it was established that jerusalem was the "center" or whatever you want to call it.

 

[db92509]

yes i understand the kaaba predated islam, i mentioned that in the original post. mohammed originally selected jerusalem as the direction of pray, i think we all agree on that. my question relates to why the change? why wasnt mecca the original direction of pray from the very beginning. if god was speaking to mohammed and the kaaba was the original house of god built by abraham then why the change of mind?

thank you for all your replies, i will be asking my next question in a moment on a new thread

regards

 

[Rashadi]

kaaba was built long before any house of worship for the sole purpose of worship God alone. it was the first house of God ever built and jerusalem was never 'originally' but of course it is still important and holy as many great prophets of God lived there. the quran confirms this and also that the arabs had corrupted. it was just a matter of time that the final messenger of God would come and show the right way, confirm the past and re-establish true monotheism and the correct worship of God.

 

[Rashadi]

yes i understand the kaaba predated islam, i mentioned that in the original post. mohammed originally selected jerusalem as the direction of pray, i think we all agree on that. my question relates to why the change? why wasnt mecca the original direction of pray from the very beginning. if god was speaking to mohammed and the kaaba was the original house of god built by abraham then why the change of mind?

thank you for all your replies, i will be asking my next question in a moment on a new thread

regards

kaaba was the original and muhammad(pbuh) was ordered by God to face jerusalem and he didn't 'select' jerusalem but he was only following the orders from God. later on muslims were ordered to return to the original. i can understand ur concerns and i had a lot of questions before and did my research.

 

[a_stranger]

turned away from all that is false

You are most welcome , if you read Quran you will find that Quran wipe any trace of idolatry since it connects hearts of the creatures with the signs and power of their creator

Concerning your qustion <<How do you feel about prostating towards a pagan polyestic symbol whenever you pray?>>

We feel the same as prophet Ibrahim allahi alsalam 6:79 Behold, unto Him who brought into being the heavens and the earth have I turned my face, having turned away from all that is false; and I am not of those who ascribe divinity to aught beside Him." Translation of the meanings of Quran)

 

[a_stranger]

I don`t know how this come, i didn`t put it : astagfuru Allah it is unsuitable to put such things close to the name of a prophet :astag:

 

[db92509]

you should correct your terminology whil talking about Allah taala and his messenger salla Allah alayhi wa sallam , an show respect .

there's no such taught about Allah taala , every thing have a wisdom and knowledges . we just obey .

so take care of what you say .

im intrigued as your quote about terminology, what exactly are you refering to, im not aware of having used any wrong terminology

 

[Shamim56]

Abdalilah he is a athiest. If you are Muslim you have responsibilities and duties that we must follow. He is new to this so let him be. So far he has shown respect on his part

 

[FreedomFighter]

yes i understand the kaaba predated islam, i mentioned that in the original post. mohammed originally selected jerusalem as the direction of pray, i think we all agree on that. my question relates to why the change? why wasnt mecca the original direction of pray from the very beginning. if god was speaking to mohammed and the kaaba was the original house of god built by abraham then why the change of mind?

thank you for all your replies, i will be asking my next question in a moment on a new thread

regards

welcome to the forums. well the brothers and sisters answered your question on why the change, but another reason for the change was so the Muslims wont be praying in the same direction as the jews were.

 

[kiki18]

to be atheist o not mean to not respect others beliefs.

it's just that, that responsability of offering peace is not on him. for exmaple we can respect christianity but we don't go on calling Jesus pbuh son of God just as a sign of respect, as it is not in our beliefs.

 

[Shamim56]

What do you mean abdalilah, he is just trying to clarify things so far i dont see him insulting anything.

 

[db92509]

to be atheist o not mean to not respect others beliefs.

my friend, (hopefully you will not consider that disrespctful) All i have done is pose is a simple question and i am seeking a civil conversation or discussionaround that. I have not disrespected anyone and i think most people on this forum will agree with me on that.

with regards respecting beliefs thats a two way stream i have at no point asked you to respect my belief that there is no god and i do not intend to ask you to do so.

regards