: Was Islam spread by sword and imposed?:

It is said that you can take a horse to the pond but surely you can't make it drink water from the pond. Similar is the case as far as forceful conversions, or conversions by sword, is concerned. It is not a matter of a few moments, it is the matter of the whole life of an individual. Who do you think stood guard for the whole life of those converted to Islam for the whole of their lives to ascertain that they did not get converted back to their old faith. C'mon, brush off these gimmicks and be bold enough to accept that they converted because they found a better alternative. Who is using swords now a days? How is it that so many people around the world are converting to this faith? Ask yourself, there won't be many replies. May Allah Taala bless you. Naveed Abbasi
 

kashif_nazeer

~~~Alhamdulillah~~~
My own view have now changed and it says Islam was imposed in India rather than preached.

Regards.
:salam2:

According to some historians, Islam reached India, during the life of the prophet :saw: . The arabs preached and people accepted Islam and the first mosque was built. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_South_Asia

What happened with comming of the mughals, etc is debated. However it is clear that Islam was not forced, since most of the people in India are still non-muslims.


:wasalam:
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Assalamu Alaikum: Dear Kashif.

I appreciate your response.Convincing.

What I think: Use of force to spread Islam can be easily justified. When monarchies prevailed round the globe,the state religion used to be the one practiced by royal family. In such cases it wasn't easy at all to preach Islam at any land. There were no sources for communications other than physical efforts to spread word of Allah. The only choice remains first invite a monarchy to deen of Allah through preaching by sending envoys. Undoubtedly in almost all cases no monarchy was going to allow spread of word of Allah. Hence the last option which remained was to use power to conquer a land and establish an Islamic state there.

Regards.

:salam2:

According to some historians, Islam reached India, during the life of the prophet :saw: . The arabs preached and people accepted Islam and the first mosque was built. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_South_Asia

What happened with comming of the mughals, etc is debated. However it is clear that Islam was not forced, since most of the people in India are still non-muslims.


:wasalam:

Where all Religions meant for both state and Individual?? Or were only a few capable of that?? [guess a different topic by itself]

.. So the monarchy's family religion , influenced the kingdoms then most religions spread because of state patronage. History is full of proof about this. So does state patronage mean sword? Does it mean all religions were forced? Missionaries/ evangelist had state patronage, Zoroastrianism its same, Jainism is no different am told, Buddhism too has a similar history....

Even if one were to peek into the last 400 years of documented history [remember its Europeans who documented it], a good insight would emerge with evidence on how religions spread. Was there any Muslim kingdom, during this perion, in any part of world ,that had the clout and might to force it? How honest where the european historians in writing their own history? The spread of spanish in the americas, english in australia is proof enough. The crusaders propaganda about Islam, is so well documented. is it not? To drive home point, lets come to the world wars, how honestly is the hiroshima act accepted? How are the recent american transgressions projected??

Same cannot be said about Muslim spread for last 400 years, the indigenous population internalized Islamic way of life. The Muslim population there is said to be very ethnic. The spread was gradual.Infact its said in sub-continent the local practices influenced. The traders, the seers, the religious dialogue, the divide among the sections of society, the weakening budhism, Zoroastrian followers, jainism followers, the historically weak economic section of their society, they needed enlightenment, their souls needed the Imaan. they wanted peace. ... these are the pointers... for the muslim growth during middle age in sub-continent, indonesia, china...

When recent events are so incorrectly projected, little chance of arriving to right conclusion. History books, have failed to say the truth. That is the calamity we humans have brought on ourselves, in addition to many other....!

 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Islam in Sub-continent during Prophets SAW time

:salam2:

Adding further reference to topic


South tip of sub continent
Mapilla Community - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mappilas
Mosque: Cheraman Juma Masjid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheraman_Juma_Masjid)
Built: 7 Hirji
By: Malik lbn Dinar (RA)
Operational: Yes
Location: kodngalur, Kasargod, India
(The place has an ancient port doing trade right from Roman era. The local king is said to be a witness to splitting of Moon miracle, travelled to arabia and accepted Islam)


Beary Community - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beary
Mosque: Zeenath Baksh
Built: 22 Hijiri
By: Habeeb Bin Malik
Operational : Yes
Location: Mangalore, India

East of Sub-Continent [Bangladesh and sourrounding]:
615AD
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Asia

Islam in Indonesia
Wahab bin Qabishah Mursala landed on Barus, North Sumatra Province, in 627 AD (before Rasulullah SAW passed away in 632 AD). Later Sheikh Ismail went to Samudera Pasai and stopped at Barus around 634 AD. Since then, the Arabs established Muslim colony in Barus long before Admiral Zheng He come to Indonesia.
(Picked from another forum)
Sahabi in China
the oldest masjid in China (Huaisheng Mosque) was built in 650s AD after Khalifah Uthman ibn Affan RA sent an envoy to invite the Emperor Gaozong of the Tang Dynasty to join Islam. The Emperor declined the invitation, but respected Islamic teachings, and believed it to be compatible with his Confucian life philosophy, later granted permission for the Muslim envoy to build a mosque in the city. Means, it was about 20 years after Muslim first arrived at Barus.
(Picked from another forum)​
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Assalaam walaikum,

Question: What would be so wrong Islamically if it were spread by sword and imposed. Think about it. Just a thought.
 

Hard Rock Moslem

I'm your brother
Yes, Islam was spread by many "swords of Allah" or known as "Syaifullah" in Arabic.

Ok let assumed Islam was spread by threat of swords as alleged, who is stopping millions of Muslims in Indonesia, India, and China from converting to other religion? Or which sword stopping them in this secular and communist countries
 

sachin4islam

Junior Member
Assalaam walaikum,

Question: What would be so wrong Islamically if it were spread by sword and imposed. Think about it. Just a thought.

Walikum Assalam: Respected Aapa.

I would go with your words. Our warriors didn't take the swords for material gains. If humanity is to be brought back to serve purpose of life and to abide by Divine code of conduct,there can be no blame against use of power. And this use of power was limited to grasping of truth by masses with utmost follow of rules of war.

Those killers of humanity for expansion of their colonial regimes can't equate our use of power with their's.

Regards.
 

HinduForLight

New Member
Islam spread both ways - through the use of sword and through peaceful means. In India Islam marched in with armies but advanced through the womb - often Turkic sultans and Mughal kings in India had Hindu wives. Their kids prefered to stay in Islam instead. They did not feel that their mothers were wronged against. Dhimmi status was offered to those who did not wish to convert. Some converted, the rest had their heads rolled. War happens for all kinds of reason. What is wrong when the reason is showing the path to Allah?
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Assalaam walaikum,

Question: What would be so wrong Islamically if it were spread by sword and imposed. Think about it. Just a thought.
:salam2:

Writing/speculating a story about a period of time, with no reliable sources to suit ones taste, is not history. And using this fabricated story in future to justify more atrocity is the way of the Evil. We see that happening to current affairs, in our own eyes... Matters are deeper than it seems, see the last comment, dont think about it think deep into it :)

A forced conversion is never digested. Lack of Imaan is a matter of soul, and it does not budge to the fear of sword, let me remind you...
 

kalamazoo

'Millat "IBRAHIM" {AleyhiSalaam}
asalaam aleykum


Was Islam spread by sword and imposed?:

:::::::::::::::::::::::::

For SURE this question was put forward ;INTENTIONALLY
and we all know that and it has YES been spreading for long time and many websites.

Yet to whatever reply no satisfactory answer will be admitted by them.

So it for us to exchange what we understood, and or BELIEVED regarding this matter.

here i go:::::::: NO
Islam was not spread and or imposed by sword.

( have my say but Why Not first give chance to the old mates as ~~~~~ <I AM NEW AND OLD MAN:>:-....
SO>here the cards are laid for every to pick one..
then tel us hear What it
READS.

..

thank you.
 

sachin4islam

Junior Member
asalaam aleykum


Was Islam spread by sword and imposed?:

:::::::::::::::::::::::::

For SURE this question was put forward ;INTENTIONALLY

and we all know that and it has YES been spreading for long time and many websites.

Yet to whatever reply no satisfactory answer will be admitted by them.

So it for us to exchange what we understood, and or BELIEVED regarding this matter.

here i go:::::::: NO
Islam was not spread and or imposed by sword.

( have my say but Why Not first give chance to the old mates as ~~~~~ <I AM NEW AND OLD MAN:>:-....
SO>here the cards are laid for every to pick one..
then tel us hear What it
READS.

..

thank you.

Assalamu Alaikum:

Old brother read the parent post carefully. What if I am a Muslim and have a query regarding Deen?. Should I sit quite and senselessly?. Should I deeply bury the springing questions into a sand dune?. I can't blindly take anything preached to me. I will definitely dig up for answers to my queries,may you take these puzzling questions as intentional postings,you affair and your brain think in the way that pleases you.

Regards,
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Think : 'our king became good ruler under XYZ religion'

Assalaam walaikum,

Question: What would be so wrong Islamically if it were spread by sword and imposed. Think about it. Just a thought.
"Well our king became a good ruler, after following such and such religion" Does it ring bell?

Early settlers sahaabis reached these part of world. They were upright humans, whom the rest of world looksed up to, they were exemplary humans of virtue and justice who set a new standard and renewed the message of almighty, and just like the inhabitants of arabian peninsula saw the light 'noor' in Imaan, the inhabitants of Indian, Malay peninsula, Indonesian Island too were influenced and started to follow the true path.

Tough to grasp? Lets take a look at the last two centuries acclaimed influencers. Mahatma Gandhi and Marti Luther King. Yes offourse while the world thinks and approved of Gandhi, the extreme right from Sub-continent has a tough time digesting a human who stood for non-violence. The right extreme projects Gandhi as a womenizer. Its same with some of extreme rights in US, they could not digest or approve, the sane voice of Martin Luther king.

Now thats on wordly matters, And the Sahaabah, were spreading message of creator on a matter that concerns both the here and there here-after... There is a difference, Sword is not capable of that. its the written words in Quran, The lifestyle of a pious truthful human , that brings the difference...

There are documented facts of how entire villages accepted the Shahaada, out of pure will, no force in recent century... There also are stories of Traders, accepting Islam, seeing the pureness with which a pious person goes about his affairs... There are urban stories, about a non interest taking, fair dealing, humble living walking pious muslim fellow colleague making the others eyes-pop out in disbelief...

Reason enough to change souls, soften a mind , and see the divine message

"Well our king became a good ruler, after following such and such religion" Does it still not ring a bell?

P.S: And well such men are around, but they do not make to top of pyramid, in our times where the evil network is expanding and conspiring... Its unfortunate, we get to hear less about such folks .... And those who are good , get killed first . Irony.
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Islam spread both ways - through the use of sword and through peaceful means. In India Islam marched in with armies but advanced through the womb - often Turkic sultans and Mughal kings in India had Hindu wives. Their kids prefered to stay in Islam instead. They did not feel that their mothers were wronged against. Dhimmi status was offered to those who did not wish to convert. Some converted, the rest had their heads rolled. War happens for all kinds of reason. What is wrong when the reason is showing the path to Allah?

There is a creator, he created jin/humans, gave them will to choose and told them to worship him. There also is a shaytaan, who did not obey and vowed to take as many as possible in the wrong path. So Adam(a) the first Man and first prophet descended, with a message to Worship and bow to Almighty. Adam[a] had kids his descendents to this day and in future untill dooms day, will continue to spread. The message diluted and Humans/Jinns turned to polyetheism and worshipping their own creations. Some of them were made God, The high priests made a good business human business in name of God... Almighty sent another messenger with renewed message. It kept repeating, this trend and cycle. So there were prophets like nooh [A], Moosa [A], Isa[A] and final Mohammed :saw: , none of them said or did beyond what Almighty ordered them to do... But the ego of those hell bent, set them on wrong path.... The purpose of life is not bloodshed, the purpose of life is submission to will of Almighty out of choice.

Shaytaan is answerable to Almighty Allah on judgment day, So am I and so are you.
Lies would not be tolerated... So that's where the wrong is, let the ego go... do not fabricate, when its not known...

A future generation too will blame us, for lying about their past history...
 

strive-may-i

Junior Member
Islam spread both ways - through the use of sword and through peaceful means. In India Islam marched in with armies but advanced through the womb - often Turkic sultans and Mughal kings in India had Hindu wives. Their kids prefered to stay in Islam instead. They did not feel that their mothers were wronged against. Dhimmi status was offered to those who did not wish to convert. Some converted, the rest had their heads rolled. War happens for all kinds of reason. What is wrong when the reason is showing the path to Allah?
War happened during prophets time out of sheer compulsion, but heads never rolled, other than in battlefield. The pious had the light, had the lifestyle that made the message clear.

And to your point, specific point the Mughals and the Rajputs, Making a martyr out of Queen that contemporary writers said converted to Islam? The mughals and the turks did not reach the southern part of india nor the eastern part of india. These two regions contribute for close to 40% of Muslim population in India and they are distinctively different from the the Hanafi school of thought. For a moment remove the country barrier, Islam is Global, so the muslim communities in Bangladesh, Myanmar, Indonesia, Malaysia , Srilanka thats the direction and region you also need to look into to get real insights.
unbiased analysis requires one to be really humble and accept facts as facts... Read history in an unbiased manner...

Ever given a thought how jainism spread? ever given a thought how Buddhism spread? Ah lets come to a recent history point of sub-continent, Ever given a thought how monoethiestic Veerashaivism quickly spread and then stagnated? Or how Monoetheistic Sikhism quickly spread amidst the Muslim Major Punjab belt? And reason, that I will leave it to you with a hope that good side in you sincerel seeks the truth... the light...

Its not clear what ratio of population was muslim by the time the Mughals arrived.
And why ignore conveniently about the population ratio of muslims in 10 century, 15 century and beginning of 20 century? We donot have numbers ... soo fabricate the way one wants to see it?? ha!

The future generation will point that out, we will be blamed, just like the early European chroniclers are now accused....
 

kalamazoo

'Millat "IBRAHIM" {AleyhiSalaam}
Assalamu Alaikum:

Old brother read the parent post carefully. What if I am a Muslim and have a query regarding Deen?. Should I sit quite and senselessly?. Should I deeply bury the springing questions into a sand dune?. I can't blindly take anything preached to me. I will definitely dig up for answers to my queries,may you take these puzzling questions as intentional postings,you affair and your brain think in the way that pleases you.

Regards,

asalaam aleykum

here i go again "may be my english" is upside down.

and a thousands apoligoies..


....So it for us to exchange what we understood, and or BELIEVED regarding this matter.

here i go:::::::: NO
Islam was not spread and or imposed by sword.
he


those blue in color to me as encouraging with ourselves to reply and that will do but as i have said for THEM ...they will be never satisfied.

Please, say prayers for me.

thank you.>>>>>>>>>>>>>

as u can note~NOW~ how members are really excahnging ideas; Yes let us expect for much better understand within members..Inshaa ALLAH>
 

a_stranger

Junior Member
:salam2:

I think that Islam exits within each soul : Islam is our firta ( inner essance) ,the early muslems used force to remove the obstacles that cover this essance ......when man is left to his true nature he will choose Islam. Now media and many ungodly influences in making rust on human hearts. If those influences are stopped I believe most people will return to Islam.
 

Hard Rock Moslem

I'm your brother
Islam spread both ways - through the use of sword and through peaceful means. In India Islam marched in with armies but advanced through the womb - often Turkic sultans and Mughal kings in India had Hindu wives. Their kids prefered to stay in Islam instead. They did not feel that their mothers were wronged against. Dhimmi status was offered to those who did not wish to convert. Some converted, the rest had their heads rolled. War happens for all kinds of reason. What is wrong when the reason is showing the path to Allah?

Welcome to the forum.

True Muslim will not have wife from another religion. If these invaders were true Muslims, they would have made India an Islamic state. Reality today it is not. Anything done with force will be abandon when the force disappear. India is secular state, it is mentioned in your constitution according to a lawyer. What stopping millions of Indian Muslims there to abandon Islam if it was spread by sword?

M'sia and Indonesia, where the largest Muslims population are today, was invaded and colonialised by Portugese, Dutch and British. We were also occupied by Japan during WW2 before the British came back. But no single Muslim army ever came here for whatever reason. How Islam was spread? Arabic traders, Muslims traders from India and China are the one came and spread the religion. They came not with weapon but deep knowledge about Islam. They came and showed the beautiful way of life according to Islam, our kings reverted and his subject also followed.

The colonial masters, in particular Portugese came to spread their catholic faith, the Dutch tried to convert into Anglican and the British did the same. Our history book which was written by them said they came here for our spices, this is laughable. You will not find a single church in M'sia if not because of this Portugese, Dutch and the British. Islam was here long before they came, although they tried their best to convert the local yet 99.9% Muslims here remain Muslims although we were occupied for more then 200 years.
 

Hatty

Junior Member
I think there is an ambiguity in the question you have posed.

Did Islam was forced upon people to accept as a religion? Or did Muslims conquer and fought battles to rule over other countries?

It is fine to discuss this matter historically, however, it is irrelevant if someone wants to be a Muslim or not. It has nothing to do with accepting or rejecting Islam.

Every other religion and ideology was imposed by the sword. Christians did the same when the church ruled, then they did the same when democracy ruled, they waged wars to spread democracy. Communism the same story. The difference with Islam, when they ruled, they did not demand that everyone must embrace Islam. That is why the Spanish, Portuguese, East Europe, Southern Europe, and India are still practicing their old beliefs.
 
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