Dawah with a Born-Again Christian

nobbyv

Abu Maryam
Dear brothers/sisters,
Assalamualaikum...

I have been talking to a Born-Again christian and have a couple of questions.

Are there any reverts who were former Born-Again christians? or
Has any of you had previous experiences discussing with Born-Again christians?

if yes, i'll pose the questions...

Jazakallah kyer...

 

palestine

Servant of Allah
salam

Dear brothers/sisters,
Assalamualaikum...

I have been talking to a Born-Again christian and have a couple of questions.

Are there any reverts who were former Born-Again christians? or
Has any of you had previous experiences discussing with Born-Again christians?

if yes, i'll pose the questions...

Jazakallah kyer...


what's a born-again christian? salam.
 

blackivy393

Junior Member
well im a born again christian. its a christian that has accepted Jesus as lord and savior and is committing to having a personal relationship with jesus christ
 

nobbyv

Abu Maryam
what's a born-again christian? salam.

born-again christians are people who have left the traditional christianity and born-again with the Spirit of God!! These people claim that they have different "gifts"..such as talking in different languages, having visions, intrepreting dreams and visions etc...

Hope it clarifies...

walaikum assalam
 

nobbyv

Abu Maryam
Every born-again Christian claims to be filled with the Holy Spirit. Apparently, using the power of the Holy Spirit, these Christians are able to see visions, speak in tongues / languages, and interpret different dreams and visions.

The Question: These “gifts” like speaking in tongues, seeing visions etc; are they from Allah? Most of the born-again Christians confess that being born-again has actually changed their characters from Bad to GOOD!! The Quran states that “All Good is from Allah”…

PLEASE EXPLAIN WHETHER THESE GIFTS ARE FROM ALLAH or NOT??
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Salaam,

The born again revival started in the US in the late 60's and early 70's. It was part of the moral majority agenda. The born againers ( my word) targeted youths as a response to the hippie momements. They had cafe's and youth services using contemporary language. Many of the born againers rejected the doxology of the traditional churches i.e. communion. They are varied in range of belief. They do have a very heavy evangecial message. They will attack you in the stores and public places by asking if you have been saved or have you found Jesus. There is limited intellect. They will not listen to anyone. They are quite ignorant about church history from the Anglican or Catholic perspective. I am sure many are unaware of Martin Luther.
They will persist and not leave you be. As you can tell over the years I have had many interactions and actually spent time talking to many for hours. Some are practicing in the traditional churches. They believe in tithing. They believe in waiting for marriage before sex, many have rituals where the girl and boy are allowed to see each other before marriage under strict guidance. They do not drink nor do they take drugs. They are against homosexuality.
The women are very modest in dress and many girls are not allowed to wear make-up. The children are very polite. Many home school their children as they do not wish for their children to be polluted by the thoughts of others.
They are hard working people who do not believe in public assistance all the time. They attend church between 3 to 7 days a week.
Oliver North was a born again Christian. There is quite an ornate ritual for the 'batismal' ceremony.
 

Sa'diyah

New Member
asaalamu alaikum

If we really do not know something it is best not to criticize. Why some christians speak in tongues, dance in the holy spirit, prophecise etc. I do not know. Maybe we should pray to Allah about this, if it is of him he will give it to us. God (Allah) loves everybody regardless of religion, race, culture etc. He is the judge. Who are we to judge. Only He knows who will enter paradise. Right?
 

Munawar

Striving for Paradise
Salaam,

The born again revival started in the US in the late 60's and early 70's. It was part of the moral majority agenda. The born againers ( my word) targeted youths as a response to the hippie momements. They had cafe's and youth services using contemporary language. Many of the born againers rejected the doxology of the traditional churches i.e. communion. They are varied in range of belief. They do have a very heavy evangecial message. They will attack you in the stores and public places by asking if you have been saved or have you found Jesus. There is limited intellect. They will not listen to anyone. They are quite ignorant about church history from the Anglican or Catholic perspective. I am sure many are unaware of Martin Luther.
They will persist and not leave you be. As you can tell over the years I have had many interactions and actually spent time talking to many for hours. Some are practicing in the traditional churches. They believe in tithing. They believe in waiting for marriage before sex, many have rituals where the girl and boy are allowed to see each other before marriage under strict guidance. They do not drink nor do they take drugs. They are against homosexuality.
The women are very modest in dress and many girls are not allowed to wear make-up. The children are very polite. Many home school their children as they do not wish for their children to be polluted by the thoughts of others.
They are hard working people who do not believe in public assistance all the time.
They attend church between 3 to 7 days a week.
Oliver North was a born again Christian. There is quite an ornate ritual for the 'batismal' ceremony.

:salam2: Sister,
Based on what you wrote (in the bold part), it looks like they are kind of Muslims, aren't they, except the Jesus son of god thing.
:wasalam:
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Salaam,

That is the truth. These are very honest and hard working people. They follow a simpler life. For example they have dedications each year with a ceremony. The father and his daughter make a vow that he will help her to remain a virgin until she is married. He will support her and be there for her.
My issue is please don't try to convert me, I wear hijab, is that not enough for a signal that I am content.
 

blackivy393

Junior Member
Every born-again Christian claims to be filled with the Holy Spirit. Apparently, using the power of the Holy Spirit, these Christians are able to see visions, speak in tongues / languages, and interpret different dreams and visions.

The Question: These “gifts” like speaking in tongues, seeing visions etc; are they from Allah? Most of the born-again Christians confess that being born-again has actually changed their characters from Bad to GOOD!! The Quran states that “All Good is from Allah”…

PLEASE EXPLAIN WHETHER THESE GIFTS ARE FROM ALLAH or NOT??

as born again christians we believe you get filled with the holy spirit or God's spirit with the ability of speaking in tongues. and we believe that speaking in tongues is a special language you can pray in and only you and God understands. and we believe u can be blessed with different abilities to help further spread the message of God. and some of these abilities i.e intercessory prayer- thats when you know when to pray when something bad
is going to happen and u can pray so satan or demonies will stop what theyre doing and etc.

since muslims dont acknowledge the holy spirit, i dont know if the quran talks about that.
 

blackivy393

Junior Member
Salaam,

The born again revival started in the US in the late 60's and early 70's. It was part of the moral majority agenda. The born againers ( my word) targeted youths as a response to the hippie momements. They had cafe's and youth services using contemporary language. Many of the born againers rejected the doxology of the traditional churches i.e. communion. They are varied in range of belief. They do have a very heavy evangecial message. They will attack you in the stores and public places by asking if you have been saved or have you found Jesus. There is limited intellect. They will not listen to anyone. They are quite ignorant about church history from the Anglican or Catholic perspective. I am sure many are unaware of Martin Luther.
They will persist and not leave you be. As you can tell over the years I have had many interactions and actually spent time talking to many for hours. Some are practicing in the traditional churches. They believe in tithing. They believe in waiting for marriage before sex, many have rituals where the girl and boy are allowed to see each other before marriage under strict guidance. They do not drink nor do they take drugs. They are against homosexuality.
The women are very modest in dress and many girls are not allowed to wear make-up. The children are very polite. Many home school their children as they do not wish for their children to be polluted by the thoughts of others.
They are hard working people who do not believe in public assistance all the time. They attend church between 3 to 7 days a week.
Oliver North was a born again Christian. There is quite an ornate ritual for the 'batismal' ceremony.


well right now the born again christians do practice communinon and are actually more identified by some liberals or other parties as being evangelicals or "zionists" at the moment, because a lot of us support jewish return to israel. there is differing opinions on the make up issue ( im a girl thats why i say that) and i think most people attend church about 3 days a week, churches are not necessarily open all the time. its popular to home school your children or the mother stay at home and raise kids. have u guys ever seen paula white or juanita bynums thats an example of born again woman ministers. most women think its okay to wear makeup because in our society make up and looking nice (not overly sexy) is okay because adornment in the old testament was only practiced by prostitutes in biblical times. but of course we all know, women who wear makeup doesnt = prostitute. there are a lot of born again or evagelical christians who live in the midwest and of course they dress more casual and are more layed back than say california, so i think region affects their appearance more than anything than i think religion.
 

jamafg

Junior Member
Dear Sis,
I do categorically reject your said (Allah loves everybody regardless of religion, race, culture etc. He is the judge. Who are we to judge? Only He knows who will enter paradise).
Where do you find this? I think you telling yourself to (when you don't know about something, then is better no to talk about it). Listen sis, where do you saw such a text or information?
Allah SWT will never ever love a non Muslim and the non Muslim will never ever could see the shadow of paradise. OK!
Paradise and Love of Allah is only for the peoples who were Muslim at their time (who had accepted the prophet and religion chosen for them by Allah SWT, until the arrival of Islam and Prophet Muhammad PBUH).
After that all other religions were considered as non practicable or cancelled. The only religion and people of paradise and loved by Allah SWT would be Muslims and that’s it.
When you saying that we don’t know who will enter paradise, is something you shouldn't say! Because it's clearly mentioned in Holy Qur'an: who will be entering the paradise and Loved by Allah SWT.
Finally for your more information, I just would remember you that; regardless of being a wonderful person and done a lots of good think for humanity, you can’t be loved by Allah SWT or entering paradise. The only most way and the key for the door of paradise is to be a Muslim. Then you hope to enter it.
Hopefully you understand that and confirm my said by asken a well educated Imam and scholar.
Thanks

asaalamu alaikum

If we really do not know something it is best not to criticize. Why some christians speak in tongues, dance in the holy spirit, prophecise etc. I do not know. Maybe we should pray to Allah about this, if it is of him he will give it to us. Right?
 

Munawar

Striving for Paradise
Hello blackivy393,

I have seen many of your posts here. It looks like you are good Christian girl and I think you also want to know about other religions.

I am curious so I have these questions:

1. How long have you been here on TTI website ?

2. What have you learned about Islam so far ?

My immediate boss is also a born again. He has good moral character, and I tell him that he is very close to being a good Muslim, but he doesn't want to discuss religion at all.
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Salaam,

Blackivy,

Am I correct in understanding that you are a supporter of the zionists? This is quite different than the simple agenda of gaining money for the zionists by telling the evangelicals to support the return to the holy land? Do you understand what zionism is? Are you aware of the rituals of Purim? If you state you are a born again, I strongly suggest you research what I have written before you respond. What makes you want to be on an Islamic site.
What makes you an authority on the evangelical movement which is very different from the born again movements. If you had read my post earlier you would have read that many born again Christians are part of the traditional churches.
As for communion do you really believe in the transubstantiation of the bread to body and wine to blood? This is the Anglican and Catholic interpertation of communion. I know of many churches that are open almost seven days a week. Not all evangelicals speak in tounges. Do you? Do you dance when you speak in tounges?
You have stated that you are a supporter of zionism and you write on an Islamic website. Please defend youself with serious answers. I am very offened by your lack of knowledge. Oliver North did not speak in tounges nor did he dance when he was inspired by the spirit. Please explain to me using the traditional protestant theologians what you mean by the spirit.
 

Munawar

Striving for Paradise
[BDear Sis,
I do categorically reject your said (Allah loves everybody regardless of religion, race, culture etc. He is the judge. Who are we to judge? Only He knows who will enter paradise).
Where do you find this? I think you telling yourself to (when you don't know about something, then is better no to talk about it). Listen sis, where do you saw such a text or information?
Allah SWT will never ever love a non Muslim and the non Muslim will never ever could see the shadow of paradise. OK!
Paradise and Love of Allah is only for the peoples who were Muslim at their time (who had accepted the prophet and religion chosen for them by Allah SWT, until the arrival of Islam and Prophet Muhammad PBUH).
After that all other religions were considered as non practicable or cancelled. The only religion and people of paradise and loved by Allah SWT would be Muslims and that’s it.
When you saying that we don’t know who will enter paradise, is something you shouldn't say! Because it's clearly mentioned in Holy Qur'an: who will be entering the paradise and Loved by Allah SWT.
Finally for your more information, I just would remember you that; regardless of being a wonderful person and done a lots of good think for humanity, you can’t be loved by Allah SWT or entering paradise. The only most way and the key for the door of paradise is to be a Muslim. Then you hope to enter it.
Hopefully you understand that and confirm my said by asken a well educated Imam and scholar.
Thanks [/B]

:salam2: jamafg

I don't think there is any need to scream at each other. (The bold and red color does appear like screaming.)
You are right that that Quran says that "Kafirs" "Mushriqs" and "Munafiqs" will go to hell fire. But I see nothing wrong in the sister's statement:
(Allah loves everybody regardless of religion, race, culture etc. He is the judge. Who are we to judge? Only He knows who will enter paradise).

Let us take it one by one:

1. Allah loves everybody regardless of religion, race, culture etc. Do you think Allah hates all non Muslims ?
2. He is the judge. Do you think he is not ?
3. Who are we to judge? Do you think we are the judge ?
4. Only He knows who will enter paradise. What is wrong with that?

We should be kind to one another.
:wasalam:
 

jamafg

Junior Member
Request to everyone who really won't to know about other religion then Islam, to read this! Especially "Sa'diyah"

If Islam is the one true religion and all good Muslims will be rewarded in Paradise, then where does that leave the followers of other religions? Will they go to Hell because they are practicing the “wrong” religion? What would happen to a really great man who was born in a very Catholic country
the Qur’an gives a clear answer in the following verses that mean :

1- {Surely Allah does not do injustice to the weight of an atom, and if it is a good deed He multiplies it and gives from Himself a great reward.}* (An-Nisaa’ 4:40) 2- *{These are the communications of Allah which We recite to you with truth, and Allah does not desire any injustice to the creatures.}* (Aal `Imran 3:108) 3- *{Then how will it be when We shall gather them together on a day about which there is no doubt, and every soul shall be fully paid what it has earned, and they shall not be dealt with unjustly?}*( Aal `Imran 3: 25) 4- *{Surely We have revealed to you the Book with the truth for the sake of men; so whoever follows the right way, it is for his own soul and whoever errs, he errs only to its detriment; and you are not a custodian over them.}* (Az-Zumar 39:41) 5- *{Whoever goes aright, for his own soul does he go aright; and whoever goes astray, to its detriment only does he go astray: nor can the bearer of a burden bear the burden of another, nor do We chastise until We raise a messenger.}* (Al-Israa’ 17:15 )

From the foregoing, we can understand the following about Divine Judgment: God does not do the least bit of injustice to anyone. He is All-Merciful and so He doubles the reward of those who do good, out of the bounty of His mercy.

The duty of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him)—or of those who follow in his footsteps—is to invite people to the true guidance of God revealed to the Prophet. Anyone who follows that guidance benefits himself or herself; and anyone who rejects that guidance harms himself or herself. No one can take away the reward of another; nor can a person bear the punishment due to another. And there is no question of God punishing anybody without first sending a warner to them: That is to say, it is only after people have been informed of the true guidance and they have knowingly rejected it, that they are held accountable and judged to be deserving of punishment.

Unlike Christianity, Islam emphasizes personal responsibility and accountability. In other words, the core of Islamic ethics is justice and freedom of choice. That is why the doctrine of vicarious atonement is abhorrent to Islam; and for the same reason sinners cannot be “saved” by punishing the innocent.

From the Islamic point of view, the judgment of an action is dependent, first and foremost, upon the motive derived from the faith of the person. Only God can be the True Judge of our actions, as other humans cannot know the real motive and the impelling faith or philosophy behind it. Suppose a Catholic heard the message of Islam, but did not care to examine it even when he was aware of the chance of it being the truth: he is certainly guilty of rejecting the Truth. The same is true of an atheist or anybody else. For that reason, such people are held accountable for their actions based on the questionable beliefs they hold.

But imagine someone in a remote area (or anywhere) who knows nothing of Islam: He cannot be held accountable for not following Islam. God will judge him by the standard of his conscience or of whatever morality he has imbibed from his native religion or culture. Because there cannot be injustice in the ultimate judgment of God. And for us humans, it is basically a question of our sincerity in seeking the truth and following it.
 

Aapa

Mirajmom
Salaam,

Brother, Balckivy wrote that she is a supporter of zionism. Now, agreed America is the breeding ground for zionism, how can one be ignorant of Islam if the purpose is to collect money to rob and pillage from the People of Palestine? There is a political movement to gain more funds for Israel and this person has written she supports this. Hello. Forgive me but logic was lost somewhere in this thread. I am passionate about justice. Why are we trying to please a supporter of zionism?
 
Top