Husband or wife travels to work with another women or man??? Haram??

[I.Iman]

Assalam Aleikom wa ramatullah wa barakatho

Is it Haram for a husband or wife to go to work in the same car with the opposite sex alone? (another women or vice versa another man) every day? Is there any difference if that women or man is a muslim or not?

How to handle a situation like this?

Barak Allah feekom!

 

[Asif1]

We have to first understand that women are commanded in the Shariah to remain fixed within their homes. If there is a need to travel a short distance and if there is no imminent danger or fear of Fitna then they may do so without a Mahram on condition she adheres to the laws of Hijaab. If there is an imminent danger or fear of Fitna then they may not do so without a Mahram. In the case of a long distance, whether there is a fear of Fitna or not, they may not travel without a Mahram. When a woman leaves her hometown she should be accompanied by a Mahram.

It is not permissible for a woman to be in seclusion with a ghair Mahram under any circumstances.

If a woman travels within the town with a ghair Mahram in a car and other women are present then this will only be permissible if there is no imminent danger. The moment any factor arises which indicates a danger, this permissibility will fall away.

However circumstances outside the town are generally such that they themselves constitute a danger, hence the need for a Mahram at all times. The differences between the town and countryside were more evident in former times where the towns were places of security, and the countryside desolate, inhabited by highway robbers etc.

And ALLAH knows the best

 

[Precious Star]

We have to first understand that women are commanded in the Shariah to remain fixed within their homes. I

what do you mean "remain fixed in their homes"?? How are they supposed to attend school and then te workplace if they are fixed in their homes?

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

Whether women can go to work or not, it is another matter. The original question is, can she goes to work with another man in a car? Well, if she has to work better she travel with a crocodile rather another (non mahram) man. Did I answer your question?

 

[Ayyub]

Wa'alaikoum assalam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh

bismillahi rahmani rahim

sister the prophet sallahu alayhi wa salam said:

No man should stay with a lady in seclusion except in the presence of a Dhu-Mahram. A woman should not travel except with a Dhu-Mahram. [1]

1. Muslim no. 1341

Hadith - Ahmad and Al-Tirmidhi 3118, Narrated Umar ibn al-Khattab radhiallahu anhu , Tirmidhi transmitted it.

The Prophet sallahu alayhi wa salam said, "Whenever a man is alone with a woman the Devil makes a third."

So it is for both for the muslim man and the muslim woman to be alone with a non mahram. And it doesn't make a difference if your co-worker is a muslim or not cause the hadith of Mohamed salallahu alayhi wa salam doesn't mention any exception.

A solution to this proplem is:
1. Take the bus
2. Use your own car
3. Use your bycycle etc.

BTW a woman is allowed to work in islam. I don't know how people come up with the idea that women aren't allowed to work in Islam.

 

[Precious Star]

I agree with you, but the brother above made a statement that women should be "fixed inside their homes." There are many women onthis forum and I think it behooves him to clarify that statement, with appropriate authority and appropriate authority for any exceptions.

If i remained "fixed inside my home" i would not be able to earn money, I would not be able to buy food, I would not have people to talk to during the day, etc.

 

[Ayyub]

Women working without being in need of it.
Imam Abdul-Aziz bin Abdillah bin Baz

Question:
Does a woman follow her whims and desires if she's working without being in need of the money ?

Answer:
No, she is not. She doesn't follow her whims and desires if it is a noble and respected work with no free mixing. If she only works amongst women without any unjustice taking place and hostility, all while her husband is allowing her to work if she is married, then she is not following her whims and desrires.

There is different kinds of work. If it maintains disobediance to Allah, then it is obligatory on her to leave it. If the job leads to free mixing between men and women and showing her beauty, then this is also haram.

But if it is allowed and Sharýah-based, as being a teacher for girls, or a nurse, doctor for women. Then it is a permissble act. Alhamdulillah.

Question :

If she isn't in need of the money, is it still permissble ?

Answer:
Yes it is. She might for example, want more money, or need it to give away in charity etc.



Source: http://www.binbaz.org.sa/audio/noor/033907.mp3

 

[Precious Star]

Can someone please define "free mixing" and "showing their beauty". Please cite sources (quran or sunnah).

Also, the prohibition against "free mixing" applies to MEN as well. Men are not allowed to freely mix with women. In other words, they must work in an environment that is either male-only or where they will not have contact with females.

 

[PeacefulHumanity]

We have to first understand that women are commanded in the Shariah to remain fixed within their homes. If there is a need to travel a short distance and if there is no imminent danger or fear of Fitna then they may do so without a Mahram on condition she adheres to the laws of Hijaab.

What exactly qualifies as a "short" distance? I live in New York, so does that mean my mom can't travel from Queens to Manhattan to go to work or see a doctor or something. Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[Ayyub]

Can someone please define "free mixing" and "showing their beauty". Please cite sources (quran or sunnah).

Also, the prohibition against "free mixing" applies to MEN as well. Men are not allowed to freely mix with women. In other words, they must work in an environment that is either male-only or where they will not have contact with females.

Assalamou Alaikoum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh

Sister there are two benifical fatwa's about free mixing from Shaykh Ibn Baz and Ibnul Qayyim rahimahum allah.
The texts are a bit long so I will only copy the link.

Beneficial Speech from Ibnul-Qayyim Concerning Mixing Between Men and Women

Danger of Women Freely Mixing with Men, especially in their Participation in the Work Arena of Men

This is what Ibn Baz rahimahullah said about free mixing which he supports with an ayah from the Quran in his Fatwa:

The meaning of Allaah's Ordering a woman to be settled in her home and forbidding her from At Tabbaraj (i.e. for a woman to display of her beauty that which evokes the desires of men, and which it is obligatory for her to veil) is the prohibition of Al Ikhtilaat, which is the mixing of men and women in the same place of work, buying and selling, picnics or travel and so forth. This is because the plunging of women into this arena leads to her falling into that which is forbidden, and that is a violation of Allaah's command and the neglect of His Law, which it is obligatory for a Muslim woman to abide by.

And Allahs knows best

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam alaikum,

Let me attempt to simplify this.

You carpool with someone. You become familiar. You get into the routine of what we call "soft talk". You do this for a while and the next thing you know you become very familiar.

The boundaries that have been established for us, Sunna, become very fuzzy. And this can lead to a path of self-destruction. It sounds so bold doesn't it. But, it happens. You relax and joke to pass the time. You may stop after work to grab coffee, this extends the communication...

The boundaries of Islam are there to protect you from temptation. The Creator knows the nature of His Creation. He knows us.

Not everyone that carpools is going to hop into bed with each other. But why put yourself through this. Why give shytan an invitation when the best is there for you.

Same thing with a job. I have worked in all kinds of places. A work place that is all women is wonderful. We can't all stay home. I would die to be able to stay home. I am tired. Some of us have to work...but, we have to examine what are we doing and why are we doing this.

We all do this..we put the fear of loss of money over the fear of Allah subhana wa taala.

( it takes a lot to have the most unpopular view on the site)

 

[Um Ibrahim]

Whether women can go to work or not, it is another matter. The original question is, can she goes to work with another man in a car? Well, if she has to work better she travel with a crocodile rather another (non mahram) man. Did I answer your question?

Lol loved that response. To come back to the question though, if it can be avoided it should be because it's haraam. But sometimes it's necessary especially if the sister doesn't know how to drive or is new to the city and doesn't know any other women/ or have any immediate family to take her. I knew a girl who was in that kind of situation and she used to ride with a man to work who was not her mahram.

 

[Precious Star]

Assalamou Alaikoum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh

Sister there are two benifical fatwa's about free mixing from Shaykh Ibn Baz and Ibnul Qayyim rahimahum allah.
The texts are a bit long so I will only copy the link.

Beneficial Speech from Ibnul-Qayyim Concerning Mixing Between Men and Women

Danger of Women Freely Mixing with Men, especially in their Participation in the Work Arena of Men

This is what Ibn Baz rahimahullah said about free mixing which he supports with an ayah from the Quran in his Fatwa:


And Allahs knows best

The attachments pertain to married women with children and homes to run.

Not all women have the luxury to sit at home and play with their babies and rely on hubby's paycheque. Islam is for all women, not just the mothers. The sad truth is that MOST Muslim men do not follow the command of Allah and fail to maintain and protect their sisters and daughters. Some ladies and I were talking bout this just the other day, that as Muslim women born in the west because our parents chose to immigrate, the burden in us is enormous. We have to make sure we are well employed and that there is enough money for housing costs, food, basic expenses, transportation, etc. I would never take the bus to work because usually the buses are packed and I have to rub against all sorts of people -- yuck. So I drive, but while my married sisters have husbands who tke care of car maintenance, get the tires changed, get the oil changed, I do all that myself. And sometimes I'm sitting in the waiting area of the garage in a room full of men.

I do what I do. But it's not easy. According to all these "imams" you keep quoting, I am oh-so-sinful. But where are the brothers? Where is the father? Living their lives, thats what.

So will I be punished for the sins of the men in my family? I would hope not. Surely, God will be merciful and recognize that the men in my family do not wish to be the protectors and maintainers of women.

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam alaikum,

Sister,

That is our test. To maintain and uphold our faith in our Rabb and not depend on the community. We have to accept the fact that we are outside the community. The community has done us a disservice.

But, I know I forgive them. I just try to make it easier on the next sister. We minimize our contact with the world.

We act like a man because our circumstances make us tougher than most men and we uphold our faith out of our Love for Allah. And it is that Love and only that Love that makes the path easier for us.

Tell me the world doesn't want to abuse a single Muslim woman. So it makes more sense for us to seek protection from the Creator at all times. And avoid all unnecessary temptations.

 

[Asif1]

what do you mean "remain fixed in their homes"?? How are they supposed to attend school and then te workplace if they are fixed in their homes?

my dear sister. its for womens and not girls. Womens are considered to be the home minister or most probably home maker.

 

[Ayyub]

The attachments pertain to married women with children and homes to run.

Not all women have the luxury to sit at home and play with their babies and rely on hubby's paycheque. Islam is for all women, not just the mothers. The sad truth is that MOST Muslim men do not follow the command of Allah and fail to maintain and protect their sisters and daughters. Some ladies and I were talking bout this just the other day, that as Muslim women born in the west because our parents chose to immigrate, the burden in us is enormous. We have to make sure we are well employed and that there is enough money for housing costs, food, basic expenses, transportation, etc. I would never take the bus to work because usually the buses are packed and I have to rub against all sorts of people -- yuck. So I drive, but while my married sisters have husbands who tke care of car maintenance, get the tires changed, get the oil changed, I do all that myself. And sometimes I'm sitting in the waiting area of the garage in a room full of men.

I do what I do. But it's not easy. According to all these "imams" you keep quoting, I am oh-so-sinful. But where are the brothers? Where is the father? Living their lives, thats what.

So will I be punished for the sins of the men in my family? I would hope not. Surely, God will be merciful and recognize that the men in my family do not wish to be the protectors and maintainers of women.

Assalmou Alaikoum Wa Rahmtullahi Wa Barakatuh

Sister first of all the scholars that I quoted didn't came up with these ideas but rather that's what we get when we read the sunnah of our prophet muhammed salallahu alayhi wa salam. And one thing all muslims should do is to treat our scholars with a lot of respect.

Why do you blame all the muslim men when the males in your family fail to protect you. According to my knowledge when the female sins like in your case and the mahrem's of her are responsible for it cause they are negleting their duty's then most of the sin is on them and a little part is on you.

Don't change the tires and make your brother, father, uncle etc do it for you. Advice the males in your family that you have the right that they do all these things for you in a good and respectful manner.
Ask Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala that He will make the males take care of their responsiblty that they have over the women.

 

[Hajjerr]

I agree with you, but the brother above made a statement that women should be "fixed inside their homes." There are many women onthis forum and I think it behooves him to clarify that statement, with appropriate authority and appropriate authority for any exceptions.

If i remained "fixed inside my home" i would not be able to earn money, I would not be able to buy food, I would not have people to talk to during the day, etc.

salam aleikum wa rahmatulahy wa barakatuh

Some young revert muslimahs have the same problem, Allah knows best, if a woman with muslim parents and brothers find herself in the situation to sustain herself and needs to work, even more to live with non-muslim parents can be hard, especially since girls are encouraged and pushed to have professional career and to show how much succes can they have outside their homes..and in other religions, like for example christianity, the prohibition of free-mixing in work places does not exist, at least not in the days we live in. You can not advice the members of your family to follow islam and to support you, when they are not even muslims...
Can be temporarly situation until with help of Allah they marry or move, but it is never easy.
I married alhamdullilah but i have a revert friend in the situation where she can not relly on anyone, but herself, now what sin can she be blamed of when goes work...?..

There are no excuses and the Law of Allah is clear and just, but not only are failures in the muslim comunitys as i read from members of this site, but also we have muslims living in non-islamic familys and countrys.
May Allah guide us all.

:salam2:

 

[Precious Star]

my dear sister. its for womens and not girls. Womens are considered to be the home minister or most probably home maker.

So if they are WOMEN, and they stay home, how do they pay for their home if they are not working? I am talking about women who are not married. How do they pay for food, clothing, shelter, etc, if they are "home ministers" ???

 

[Precious Star]

Why do you blame all the muslim men when the males in your family fail to protect you.

Don't change the tires and make your brother, father, uncle etc do it for you. Advice the males in your family that you have the right that they do all these things for you in a good and respectful manner.

Brother, this is not just happening in my family. It is happening to unmarried muslim women throughout the Western world. I have many friends in the same situation - they feel that the burdens never end. Remember, we live in nonmuslim countries, yet we are expected to miraculously come up with muslim husbands while our parents sit back and watch their sons get married, have children, etc, leaving us women to our own devices. There are so many fathers and brothers out there who have failed to live up to the ideals of Islam. It is not just my father and brothers. It is many, many, many. I can give you a list! That is the way Islamic cultures socialize their menfolk, whether it is in the west or otherwise. They want it easy, and because women can easily enter the workforce the men do not think it is a big deal for us to take care of ourelves.

I cannot demand that my father take my car to the garage for servicing. They are all well aware of what the Holy Quran says, they don't need lecture from me. I cannot demand that brother clean my windows. I cannot demand that my father drive me to the airport at 5 am so I don't have to take a taxi there alone.

Muslims are very quick to state that women sin because of this and this and this, but the real sins are being committed by the Muslim men. And most of the muslim men I know work in mixed environments where the women are not covered.

 

[Ayyub]

So if they are WOMEN, and they stay home, how do they pay for their home if they are not working? I am talking about women who are not married. How do they pay for food, clothing, shelter, etc, if they are "home ministers" ???

Brother, this is not just happening in my family. It is happening to unmarried muslim women throughout the Western world. I have many friends in the same situation - they feel that the burdens never end. Remember, we live in nonmuslim countries, yet we are expected to miraculously come up with muslim husbands while our parents sit back and watch their sons get married, have children, etc, leaving us women to our own devices. There are so many fathers and brothers out there who have failed to live up to the ideals of Islam. It is not just my father and brothers. It is many, many, many. I can give you a list! That is the way Islamic cultures socialize their menfolk, whether it is in the west or otherwise. They want it easy, and because women can easily enter the workforce the men do not think it is a big deal for us to take care of ourelves.

I cannot demand that my father take my car to the garage for servicing. They are all well aware of what the Holy Quran says, they don't need lecture from me. I cannot demand that brother clean my windows. I cannot demand that my father drive me to the airport at 5 am so I don't have to take a taxi there alone.

Muslims are very quick to state that women sin because of this and this and this, but the real sins are being committed by the Muslim men. And most of the muslim men I know work in mixed environments where the women are not covered.

Assalmou Alaikoum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuh

Bismillahi Rahmani Rahim

First Quote: The father and brothers are responsible to take care of the living expenses of their daughters/sisters until they marry.

Second Quote:
You are saying it yourself that the parents are to be blamed so how did you come to the conclusion that it is the muslim man. Here where I live and it is in the center of europe the muslim males have a hard time getting married because of two things:

1. The parents of the female want him to be a millionaire even though the brother is still doing his diploma.
2. The parents are traditionalists.Which means you can only marry someone of our homeland or better out from our tribe.
And so on. Besides that out of my expierence from my friends family and my own most of the females get married off first and way laterdo the males get married.

If you don't demand it from your father/brother or any other mahrem the sin lies upon you. Cause your duty is to always advice them about their responsiblety. Maybe and Allah knows best they will start to take care of these matters after a bit of time.

Muslims are very quick to state that women sin because of this and this and this, but the real sins are being committed by the Muslim men. And most of the muslim men I know work in mixed environments where the women are not covered.

This is a complete misunderstanding from your side sister. The man has to provide the financial means for his family and if he lives in the west where there is only mixed working places then he has to take this sin on him cause the sin not to take care of your family would be greater. Naturally the scholars say that he should stay in this workplace until he has enough money to be able to make Hijrah.
Women on the contrary didn't get the command to take care that the family has something to eat, a place to live etc. I hope you see the difference.


Unto you lies to tell them the truth even if you have to tell it everyday.Cause if you do it then the sin lies not on you but rather on the ones who are ignoring their duties even though they got adviced on them more than once.