Good post....
I find this a little disturbing
- Thread starter DanyalSAC
- Start date
Good post....
MohammedMaksudul
May Allah Forgive us
:salam2:
Situations like this remind me of the saying of Prophet
that there will be a time when the number of the Muslims will be like the foam of the sea but they will still be oppressed by the disbelievers.
Islam does not need quantity, it needs quality!!!! Sahabas (May Allah be pleased with them all) were only a handful compared to the disbelievers, but their quality was such that they were more than enough for the world. Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (May Allah be pleased with him) drove out the jews from the whole of Arabian Peninsula, and look at us today. Can't even protect our lands! Trying to hide behind forced and bought fatwas. SubhanAllah, we should only try and communicate Islam in the manner the best of generations did. Islam does not need us, we need Islam so we have to learn to change ourselves for Islam and not the other way round.
Situations like this remind me of the saying of Prophet
that there will be a time when the number of the Muslims will be like the foam of the sea but they will still be oppressed by the disbelievers. Islam does not need quantity, it needs quality!!!! Sahabas (May Allah be pleased with them all) were only a handful compared to the disbelievers, but their quality was such that they were more than enough for the world. Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (May Allah be pleased with him) drove out the jews from the whole of Arabian Peninsula, and look at us today. Can't even protect our lands! Trying to hide behind forced and bought fatwas. SubhanAllah, we should only try and communicate Islam in the manner the best of generations did. Islam does not need us, we need Islam so we have to learn to change ourselves for Islam and not the other way round.
Assalaam walaikum,
Nobody is wanting to change Islam. I do not understand where everyone is getting this notion.
Yes, we need quality. A person who wishes to Believe must have a fundamental understanding of Islam. Piety is a life long ambition.
When we have a party we decorate. We make our home beautiful. We make it inviting. We make our guests comfortable. We make our guests feel at ease. Ease to the point they can feel at home.
That is all the imam is doing. The prelude to the symphony. He is using a vocabulary that is unfamiliar to readers outside the US. It is laden with symbols of cultural identity. The vocabulary makes sense to the young men.
Nobody is wanting to change Islam. I do not understand where everyone is getting this notion.
Yes, we need quality. A person who wishes to Believe must have a fundamental understanding of Islam. Piety is a life long ambition.
When we have a party we decorate. We make our home beautiful. We make it inviting. We make our guests comfortable. We make our guests feel at ease. Ease to the point they can feel at home.
That is all the imam is doing. The prelude to the symphony. He is using a vocabulary that is unfamiliar to readers outside the US. It is laden with symbols of cultural identity. The vocabulary makes sense to the young men.
I wasn't seeking a debate on Music, I warned forum members it contains a loud drum (and probably other background sounds which I didn't notice) but my main point was that its wrong for the reasons already mentioned by me in this thread. Its a clear disrespect to our deen, which you have yet to admit.
Wa-salaam
Assalaam walaikum,
Sister,
I have mentioned the reasons why this is not bad for our deen over and over and over again.
This is simply being blow out of proportion. In simple words it ain't no big deal. We have to look at the bigger picture.
We practice our faith with firmness when understanding comes to us. Whereas we can have the ritual down to perfection but the motions are empty without understanding.
Islam teaches us to be tolerant. It wishes for us to seek knowledge and then apply knowledge.
Be patient with the new foundlings. Let the roots of the faith grow with them. Islam is not stern. It is total and that includes joy.
Let me illustrate. The imam used the name of singer who is well known and respected. All he was implying is think of the number of people who would listen to a beautiful voice and follow it to the masjid. Now, here he is with a group of young men and they listen to the adhan and go to the masjid without any frills. They do their duty. Why can't we celebrate that we have young men flocking to the masjid. These young men do not need celebrities to take them to the masjid. They are going out of the Love and Fear of Allah.
You have a chilled jumma.
Sister,
I have mentioned the reasons why this is not bad for our deen over and over and over again.
This is simply being blow out of proportion. In simple words it ain't no big deal. We have to look at the bigger picture.
We practice our faith with firmness when understanding comes to us. Whereas we can have the ritual down to perfection but the motions are empty without understanding.
Islam teaches us to be tolerant. It wishes for us to seek knowledge and then apply knowledge.
Be patient with the new foundlings. Let the roots of the faith grow with them. Islam is not stern. It is total and that includes joy.
Let me illustrate. The imam used the name of singer who is well known and respected. All he was implying is think of the number of people who would listen to a beautiful voice and follow it to the masjid. Now, here he is with a group of young men and they listen to the adhan and go to the masjid without any frills. They do their duty. Why can't we celebrate that we have young men flocking to the masjid. These young men do not need celebrities to take them to the masjid. They are going out of the Love and Fear of Allah.
You have a chilled jumma.
hayat84
I'm not what you believe
I don't want to fall into the polemic,but if for example some one comes to my home,I surely make him feel comfortable,but about my religion I never trasgress,neither to make the guest to feel "at home",because Islam has its rules,if I talk with too much confidence about the Islam,he may understand a distorted thing.I can't say to my parents that if a woman makes the Adhan I would be in the first row.which kind of lesson could they learn?they may understand that a woman could really make the Adhan(and it's not possible,I hope it will be always as it is nowdays)and they may start a discussion in which it may be thought that woman isn't allowed to do so.the Imam must make his duty of Imam and the young student as well.The Quran is the way to start learning Islam.
Assalaam walaikum,
Sister you are not falling into debate.
What the imam was saying is : Think of how many people would attend prayers if all they heard was a very popular song...people would flock to hear her. However, the Muslims do not need to be entertained. No matter who calls the adhan the Muslims go to the masjid.
There must have been a misunderstanding about a woman calling the adhan. No one is suggesting that a woman do this. It is not in the Sunna.
Sister, you have to want to read the Quran. You have to open yourself to receiving the Gift of Allah.
As to making a guest feel welcome. We look to the Arabs for their hospitality.Of all peoples they are renowned for their graciousness. Did the Prophet, may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, not tell us to be gentle with everyone and especially those who are new.
When people enter my humble home I treat them as I have been taught to be the best of hostesses.
This is all the imam is suggesting..be gentle and guide youths to become strong Muslim men.
Sister you are not falling into debate.
What the imam was saying is : Think of how many people would attend prayers if all they heard was a very popular song...people would flock to hear her. However, the Muslims do not need to be entertained. No matter who calls the adhan the Muslims go to the masjid.
There must have been a misunderstanding about a woman calling the adhan. No one is suggesting that a woman do this. It is not in the Sunna.
Sister, you have to want to read the Quran. You have to open yourself to receiving the Gift of Allah.
As to making a guest feel welcome. We look to the Arabs for their hospitality.Of all peoples they are renowned for their graciousness. Did the Prophet, may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, not tell us to be gentle with everyone and especially those who are new.
When people enter my humble home I treat them as I have been taught to be the best of hostesses.
This is all the imam is suggesting..be gentle and guide youths to become strong Muslim men.
Abdul Hasib
Student of Knowledge
اَلسَّلامُ عَلَيكُم وَ رَحْمَةُ اللهِ وَ بَرَكَاتُهُ
As for me, I feel that there's nothing wrong with Shuyukh/Lecturers teaching Islam to fit modern situations (like mentioning NBA Basketball players or mentioning names like LiL Wayne, Justin Biebers, etc.) as long as they do not do استحلال (Istih-laal). which means that they make the Haram to be Halal, and the Halal to be Haram. Like if they say that it is Halal for a person to get intoxicated/not lower the gaze, or if they say that it is Haram to marry more than one women (with no ifs, ands, or buts)**.
Because by teaching the youth in that manner, many of them (the youth) will feel comfortable listening to those Shuyukh, and the "barrier" that the youth feel with Shuyukh will start to disappear because they will feel like that the Shuyukh can relate to way that they, the youth feel/experiance, especially in the West (and many youth also feel entertained when Shuyukh mention stuff such as getting "bigmoney" or "hip hop lifestyle," because to them, it sounds funny that religious people would know things like that).
As for me, I feel that there's nothing wrong with Shuyukh/Lecturers teaching Islam to fit modern situations (like mentioning NBA Basketball players or mentioning names like LiL Wayne, Justin Biebers, etc.) as long as they do not do استحلال (Istih-laal). which means that they make the Haram to be Halal, and the Halal to be Haram. Like if they say that it is Halal for a person to get intoxicated/not lower the gaze, or if they say that it is Haram to marry more than one women (with no ifs, ands, or buts)**.
Because by teaching the youth in that manner, many of them (the youth) will feel comfortable listening to those Shuyukh, and the "barrier" that the youth feel with Shuyukh will start to disappear because they will feel like that the Shuyukh can relate to way that they, the youth feel/experiance, especially in the West (and many youth also feel entertained when Shuyukh mention stuff such as getting "bigmoney" or "hip hop lifestyle," because to them, it sounds funny that religious people would know things like that).
Abdul Hasib
Student of Knowledge
And the other thing that such Shuyukh must be careful about is that if they try to present Islam in a "Modern Way," then they can NOT say/call towards Nifaq (Hypocrisy).
Like one example, many of the Modernists beleive that, "It is not obligatory to follow all the orders of Allah and his Rasul (SAW)."
And by saying that, they are also saying that, ""It is not Fardh to follow the way of Rasulallah (SAW); nor is it Fardh (and obligation) to wear the beard (up to a fist) or cover the hair and dress modestly (as long as one who doesn't cover their hair is not "trying to dress in a seductive and vile manner") (even though Rasulallah (SAW) and Allah (SWT) ordered the beleiving men to keep the beard (Ref:Bukhari and Muslim) (and atleast to a fist length (Ref: Ibn Majah)), and the women to wear their headscarves and make it cover their chests) [Surah Noor ( Chapter 24) and Surah Ahzab (Chapter 33)] "
And Rasulallah (SAW) stated (reported by Bukhari/Muslim): "Jannah is for ALL, except for those who refuse. The Sahabi asked, "Ya Rasulallah (SAW), who are those who refuse?" (He, (SAW) replied) Those who accept to follow my Way (of doing things, Sunnatur Rasulallah SAW) are of those who accept Jannah. And those who refuse my Way have refused Jannah (Paradise)."
And so as Beleivers, we must ALL beleive that it is Fardh to obey Allah (SWT) and follow/obey Rasulallah (SAW). So:
-Those who do beleive (in the correct way above), they are from the Mumineen (and whoever falls short in doing the above, then they should make Tawbah (Proper Repentence), because Allah (SWT) will ( باذنه ) forgive them.
-Those who do NOT beleive in the above [that it is Fardh to obey Allah (SWT)/ Rasuallah (SAW) and follow Rasulallah (SAW)'s way], then such a person would be considered a Munafiq.
To learn more, I suggest (maybe the moderators) to look through the Book, Nawaqid al-Iman (By Sh. ibn Abdul Wahab), and also the story of Umar (RA) executing a Munafiq from which Allah (SWT) revealed Ayaat Testifying to Umar (RA)'s innocence.
** As for the "marrying more than one women is concerned," there is no problem with a person marrying more than one women, as LONG AS there are no "side effects," like fighting between the wives, not giving each of the wives their rights, not being just with one's wives, etc.
On the other hand, Allah (SWT) says in the 2nd Ayat of as-Suratun Nisa (Chapter 4: The Women),
"....Marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then marry only one women (whether they are free or if they are slaves). That is nearer to prevent you from doing injustice."
Like one example, many of the Modernists beleive that, "It is not obligatory to follow all the orders of Allah and his Rasul (SAW)."
And by saying that, they are also saying that, ""It is not Fardh to follow the way of Rasulallah (SAW); nor is it Fardh (and obligation) to wear the beard (up to a fist) or cover the hair and dress modestly (as long as one who doesn't cover their hair is not "trying to dress in a seductive and vile manner") (even though Rasulallah (SAW) and Allah (SWT) ordered the beleiving men to keep the beard (Ref:Bukhari and Muslim) (and atleast to a fist length (Ref: Ibn Majah)), and the women to wear their headscarves and make it cover their chests) [Surah Noor ( Chapter 24) and Surah Ahzab (Chapter 33)] "
And Rasulallah (SAW) stated (reported by Bukhari/Muslim): "Jannah is for ALL, except for those who refuse. The Sahabi asked, "Ya Rasulallah (SAW), who are those who refuse?" (He, (SAW) replied) Those who accept to follow my Way (of doing things, Sunnatur Rasulallah SAW) are of those who accept Jannah. And those who refuse my Way have refused Jannah (Paradise)."
And so as Beleivers, we must ALL beleive that it is Fardh to obey Allah (SWT) and follow/obey Rasulallah (SAW). So:
-Those who do beleive (in the correct way above), they are from the Mumineen (and whoever falls short in doing the above, then they should make Tawbah (Proper Repentence), because Allah (SWT) will ( باذنه ) forgive them.
-Those who do NOT beleive in the above [that it is Fardh to obey Allah (SWT)/ Rasuallah (SAW) and follow Rasulallah (SAW)'s way], then such a person would be considered a Munafiq.
To learn more, I suggest (maybe the moderators) to look through the Book, Nawaqid al-Iman (By Sh. ibn Abdul Wahab), and also the story of Umar (RA) executing a Munafiq from which Allah (SWT) revealed Ayaat Testifying to Umar (RA)'s innocence.
** As for the "marrying more than one women is concerned," there is no problem with a person marrying more than one women, as LONG AS there are no "side effects," like fighting between the wives, not giving each of the wives their rights, not being just with one's wives, etc.
On the other hand, Allah (SWT) says in the 2nd Ayat of as-Suratun Nisa (Chapter 4: The Women),
"....Marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then marry only one women (whether they are free or if they are slaves). That is nearer to prevent you from doing injustice."
You don't follow hadiths?
Seeker-of-truth
Junior Member
At a Muslim conference in Long Beach last year, he suggested that mosques adopt a "don't ask, don't tell" policy toward gays. Afterward, he was accosted by a local imam who accused him of poisoning Muslim youth. "I told him, 'Quite frankly, you're going to be irrelevant in 10 years,' " Webb says.
your going to be irrelevant in 10 years? are u serious??? this is the man you are standing up for? an imam said he was poisoning the youths mind and that was his reply? A'oothubillah
your going to be irrelevant in 10 years? are u serious??? this is the man you are standing up for? an imam said he was poisoning the youths mind and that was his reply? A'oothubillah
Asalaam walaikum,
We know that homosexuality is forbidden. That is a given. It is understood.
Yet, we know also that Allah has told us if we repent He Forgives. When a person seeks the path and is seeking forgiveness who are we to say no you can not pray. Only Allah knows the intentions of a heart. There is hope. That is what Islam promises.
For a person to leave the path of destruction and seek the path of forgiveness is a blessing. We as brothers and sisters must with compassion assist and want for brothers and sisters a clean start on the path of righteousness.
Just think of the blessings for everyone. A person who is homosexual may visit a masjid and that simple experience might change a life.
Let us not be so judgmental. Let us try to understand the reasoning behind the statement.
We know that homosexuality is forbidden. That is a given. It is understood.
Yet, we know also that Allah has told us if we repent He Forgives. When a person seeks the path and is seeking forgiveness who are we to say no you can not pray. Only Allah knows the intentions of a heart. There is hope. That is what Islam promises.
For a person to leave the path of destruction and seek the path of forgiveness is a blessing. We as brothers and sisters must with compassion assist and want for brothers and sisters a clean start on the path of righteousness.
Just think of the blessings for everyone. A person who is homosexual may visit a masjid and that simple experience might change a life.
Let us not be so judgmental. Let us try to understand the reasoning behind the statement.
You could not have said it better! I totally agree with the using of innovated techniques to guide.
( I meant I totally disagree with using that technique! ...How do you edit your post on this forum?
Assalaam walaikum,
Sisters..as you are female you do not know nor will you know what a male i.e. Muslim male has to undergo living in a non-Muslim society. There is a "war" on Muslims. The males have it much harder than we do. They are male. There is flagrant racism here.
You serve appetizers to hone the palate for the main meal. Have a candid discussion i.e a comparative discussion on the benefits of seeking the path. But you have to have knowledge of the circumstances of the people who are seeking salvation. You have to be able to communicate and relate and build trust. The youth are the future for Islam. Once trust is established the path is wide open to knowledge.
In a classroom a teacher has to be kind and understanding. You can not teach calculus unless the child knows how to add.
Sisters..as you are female you do not know nor will you know what a male i.e. Muslim male has to undergo living in a non-Muslim society. There is a "war" on Muslims. The males have it much harder than we do. They are male. There is flagrant racism here.
You serve appetizers to hone the palate for the main meal. Have a candid discussion i.e a comparative discussion on the benefits of seeking the path. But you have to have knowledge of the circumstances of the people who are seeking salvation. You have to be able to communicate and relate and build trust. The youth are the future for Islam. Once trust is established the path is wide open to knowledge.
In a classroom a teacher has to be kind and understanding. You can not teach calculus unless the child knows how to add.
Seeker-of-truth
Junior Member
You think a man can be homosexual for a little while and change whenever he feels like? its not like taking drugs its far worse, he gives into his lust once and he is in a very dangerous path. A man feels that he might like other men so he gives into his lust and again and again, he repents but then goes back to his lusts and he repents again then he decides to find compromise.. thats right he looks for gay muslim rights groups they tell him that being gay is alright and the story of Lut (A.S) was emphasis on rape and not homosexuality and the gay is satisfied with these beliefs and loses out in his aakhirah.
its a pretty disgusting statement
Assalaam walaikum,
Yes, a person can make a choice to return to the Path. I believe if you refer to the Quran Allah lets us know He is the Forgiver of Sins. He is Oft-Relenting, Most Forgiving, the Most Compassionate. He tells to call upon Him.
How fortunate is the person who returns to Allah with a contrite heart. How blessed is the person who returns to Allah.
Allah forgives..something about sins piling to the skies and if you ask and repent.
I do believe you have made me smile. Your logic is very flawed. You are stating a person can not change and has hidden motives. I do not understand the rape/homosexuality analogy. That has nothing to do with this post.
Yes, a person can make a choice to return to the Path. I believe if you refer to the Quran Allah lets us know He is the Forgiver of Sins. He is Oft-Relenting, Most Forgiving, the Most Compassionate. He tells to call upon Him.
How fortunate is the person who returns to Allah with a contrite heart. How blessed is the person who returns to Allah.
Allah forgives..something about sins piling to the skies and if you ask and repent.
I do believe you have made me smile. Your logic is very flawed. You are stating a person can not change and has hidden motives. I do not understand the rape/homosexuality analogy. That has nothing to do with this post.
Seeker-of-truth
Junior Member
I wasn't talking about homosexuality as a sin obviously it is a sin but rather as a way of life. its different and you don't just give it up like smoking or alcohol, it goes further than that its bigger than an addiction and way harder to change. I wasn't talking about how big the sin was but how hard it must be to change.
and the rape thing .. well basically there are gay muslim rights groups who think they are muslims but can be gay too.
If you know the story of Lut (A.S) then you would know that the people gave into their lusts which in many tafsirs included rape as well as homosexuality, when the angel Gibrael (A.S) came down. The men wanted to rape him as he was beautiful. The gay rights groups say that Allah showered their lands with stones of baked clay because of the rape and not the homo.
and the rape thing .. well basically there are gay muslim rights groups who think they are muslims but can be gay too.
If you know the story of Lut (A.S) then you would know that the people gave into their lusts which in many tafsirs included rape as well as homosexuality, when the angel Gibrael (A.S) came down. The men wanted to rape him as he was beautiful. The gay rights groups say that Allah showered their lands with stones of baked clay because of the rape and not the homo.
Assalaam walaikum,
If a person can put the brakes on the road to hell and make a U-turn to the road to paradise it is a good thing.
When you are driving and you realize the road is going over a cliff you make a turn so fast the rubber of the tires burn...
I am speaking of the moment of realization that there is an alternative to the road to destruction.
Muslims make a difference.
When the person who has made the U-turn stops shaking they see an inn. They stop to think. And the inn keeper happens to be a Muslim who is making salat. After salat the inn-keeper invites the driver to sit and have a glass of cold water. As the driver gulps the water he suddenly sees the tranquility of the inn. He sees the inn is full of peaceful people greeting each other in the best of manners. The atmosphere is so strong he wants to be a part of this.
That is all I am suggesting.
Some of the worst of sinners have made the best of Muslims. The fear of the road to destruction is enough to make you change and seek repentance and forgiveness.
If a person can put the brakes on the road to hell and make a U-turn to the road to paradise it is a good thing.
When you are driving and you realize the road is going over a cliff you make a turn so fast the rubber of the tires burn...
I am speaking of the moment of realization that there is an alternative to the road to destruction.
Muslims make a difference.
When the person who has made the U-turn stops shaking they see an inn. They stop to think. And the inn keeper happens to be a Muslim who is making salat. After salat the inn-keeper invites the driver to sit and have a glass of cold water. As the driver gulps the water he suddenly sees the tranquility of the inn. He sees the inn is full of peaceful people greeting each other in the best of manners. The atmosphere is so strong he wants to be a part of this.
That is all I am suggesting.
Some of the worst of sinners have made the best of Muslims. The fear of the road to destruction is enough to make you change and seek repentance and forgiveness.