In Search Of Logical Answers?

Discussion in 'TurnToIslam Lounge !' started by uniqueskates, Nov 15, 2012.

  1. Aapa
    Offline

    Aapa Mirajmom

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,991
    Likes Received:
    71
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +150 / 12
    Assalaam alaikum,

    In the US several states have passed laws to teach both Creationism and Evolution in the public school systems. It is the choice of the voters of the states.

    Words have meaning. And the bottom line is it is the Theory of Evolution and not the Law of Evolution.

    The fundamentalist would be very upset that you are not calling them Christians. They are Christians. There are many Catholics who will not allow their children to be taught evolution.

    The Anglican church allows homosexual bishops and female priests. What difference does it make what they allow. They are wrong.

    There is a wonderful childhood story. It is about an emperor. All the citizens go along with his ministers. They sew the most beautiful suit. On the day of the parade everyone is cheering him on with his new suit. Except for one child. He screams out that the emperor is naked.


    Can we move on to the other questions, please.
  2. uniqueskates
    Cool
    Offline

    uniqueskates Rabbe Zidni Illma

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2012
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    169
    Trophy Points:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Java Programmer
    Location:
    Lost In Sands Of Time
    Ratings Received:
    +287 / 1
    Can we stop the thread here?. Please don't make me regret the fact that I started the thread.
    Am no super-human. Even I have got my limits.
  3. Aapa
    Offline

    Aapa Mirajmom

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,991
    Likes Received:
    71
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +150 / 12
    Assalaam alaikum,

    Mohammed,

    Slow down.

    Slow down.

    You are getting very emotional.

    You are on a Muslim website. Slow down. Islam is not arrogant.


    Can we move on, please.
  4. user expired!
    Offline

    user expired! Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    full time Muslim
    Location:
    A lot of places
    Ratings Received:
    +14 / 0
    Sorry guys but people need to stop talking about issues that they have no /limited knowledge of.


    As a Muslim the there are some accepts of evolution we can accept and and some parts we totally reject.

    Firstly we reject any notion that Adam (as) came into existence from the standard model of evolution i.e single celled organism - more complex cell - sea creature - land creature- Ape - Man (very simplified).

    Secondly we accept that evolution could occur in animals and other forms of life accept humans.
  5. user expired!
    Offline

    user expired! Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    full time Muslim
    Location:
    A lot of places
    Ratings Received:
    +14 / 0
  6. Seeking Allah's Mercy
    sunnah
    Offline

    Seeking Allah's Mercy Qul HuwaAllahu Ahud!

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2008
    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    124
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    Locating. . .
    Ratings Received:
    +220 / 0
    Aapa you sure you got the right name? I've never heard of Al-Hazen.

    Get a mod to close it down?
  7. kiana
    Offline

    kiana Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    This Dunya
    Ratings Received:
    +38 / 3
    earth is not flat!
  8. ubaid88
    Offline

    ubaid88 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2010
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Pakistan
    Ratings Received:
    +1 / 0
    Some empirical aspects of evolution are falsifiable but hypothesis human descent from common ancestor i.e. a single cell can never be empirically proven. We only only have problem with this thing, this will alway remain as hypothesis.
    Btw, that guys is Phd in neuroscience, so I am sure he know what he is talking about.

    How about this link, http://seemyparadigm.webs.com/evolution.htm
    Another revert muslims who is also a scienctist.
    http://seemyparadigm.webs.com/evolution.htm
  9. Aapa
    Offline

    Aapa Mirajmom

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,991
    Likes Received:
    71
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +150 / 12
    Assalaam alaikum,

    Al Hazen is one way to write his name. Look under math; optics; astronomy, Occams razor; first law of motion; they even have a coin in Iraq; crater on moon named after him:Abu Ali al-Hasan ibn al-Hasan ibn al-Haytham.

    He is the father of the scientific method.
  10. Seeking Allah's Mercy
    sunnah
    Offline

    Seeking Allah's Mercy Qul HuwaAllahu Ahud!

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2008
    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    124
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    Locating. . .
    Ratings Received:
    +220 / 0
    Wasalamo`Alaykum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakaatuh,

    Oh! you are talking about Ibn ul Haytham.



    _______________________________________________________


    As for the everyone else:

    I asked Br. Uniqueskates to have his thread locked down because he seems upset with how it's turned out. Anyone wishing to discuss it further should open up one.

    For Muslims the word of the Qur'an is final. Humans were created. Adam Alaihisalam was a Holy Prophet of Allah, and was given the honor of being created with Allah's own noble hands. He wasn't a descendant of an ape. We as Muslims have no problem, no shame and absolutely no doubt accepting the word of Qur'an and the hadeeth as final. We are not apologetic of what our deen teaches us.

    A degree has no meaning. My aunty is a Professor, she's done her PhD from Kings College, and her Post doc from Liverpool. She went to Manchester for some more research last year. In about a couple of years she'll get retired and is the senior most professor in her department. All that gives her absolutely NO authority to explain or deal with what contradicts the Qur'an. She may know Zoology but she's no scholar of the Deen. She's not an authority.

    Having said that, it's time to respect Br. Uniqueskates wishes and leave it be. No one is about to change the others mind by being sarcastic and mean.
  11. kashif_nazeer
    No Mood
    Offline

    kashif_nazeer ~~~Alhamdulillah~~~

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,529
    Likes Received:
    34
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    In this world on the land
    Ratings Received:
    +55 / 1
    Assalamu 'alaikum
    My brother you bring out interesting point of view.
    I would like to know what is your take on Adam and Hauwwa (may on them be peace)'s creation as told in the hadith,in the light of evolutionary discoveries.As you must be aware,most atheist /agnostic philosophers ,including Richard Dawkins use this argument of evolution and common ancestory(I think that's it?/I am not sure) to argue against religion and God.

    As you know many of us who interact with atheist face this dilemma,alhamdulillah it would be great if we found some common grounds.
    (We do have one,of being thinkers/apart from that)
    JazakAllahu khayr.
    Especially if we could dedicate some of our thinking and research into this field ,alhamdulillah wouldn't that be great?
  12. user expired!
    Offline

    user expired! Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    full time Muslim
    Location:
    A lot of places
    Ratings Received:
    +14 / 0
    Brother Muhammed, Our prophet Muhammed (may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) reached the seven heaven in his night journey, now 'scientific theory or general theory' will say it is scientifically impossible for this to occur, im sure all the professors around the world would say the same. Do you believe this or reject this?

    Islam is about submitting to the will of Allah whether your mind agrees to it or not, we believe in the unseen and we believe that anything that opposes the Quran and sunnah is wrong.

    ps
    Actually not all Christians believe in this, be it roman catholics or even church of England, but it is clearly rejected by Muslims and Jews. I remember my last lecture on Evolution by a well respected Professor at the Institute of Education, who himself was a priest and believed in evolution but agreed it is a controversial topic.

    Academic dishonesty does not limit someones freedom of choice, we might be taught many things but it doesn't mean we have to agree to them.

    Islam does not agree with the fact that Adam came from a Monkey, we seek refuge in Allah from such deviation and slander, im sorry but PhD or no PhD, this is just wrong.

    Lastly i have met many non-muslims including priests who have actually commended us Muslim for sticking to our principles even though they disagree with us, and many people are turning to Islam and rejecting this crap of Adam (as) coming from a monkey.
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Aapa
    Offline

    Aapa Mirajmom

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,991
    Likes Received:
    71
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Female
    Ratings Received:
    +150 / 12
    Asalaam alaikum,

    Excellent responses brothers, balanced.

    Francis Bacon was heavily influenced by the great Islamic scientist and thinker.
  14. user expired!
    Offline

    user expired! Junior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2006
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    full time Muslim
    Location:
    A lot of places
    Ratings Received:
    +14 / 0
  15. uniqueskates
    Cool
    Offline

    uniqueskates Rabbe Zidni Illma

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2012
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    169
    Trophy Points:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Java Programmer
    Location:
    Lost In Sands Of Time
    Ratings Received:
    +287 / 1
    Sister SAM.
    JazakAllah Khair for understanding. Appreciate it. :)
  16. John Smith
    Breezy
    Offline

    John Smith Junior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    580
    Likes Received:
    22
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Run my own business
    Location:
    England
    Ratings Received:
    +33 / 0
    Scott,

    Am i understanding you correctly that you beleive Man evolved from the Ape? put it simply.
  17. Seeking Allah's Mercy
    sunnah
    Offline

    Seeking Allah's Mercy Qul HuwaAllahu Ahud!

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2008
    Messages:
    4,290
    Likes Received:
    124
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    Locating. . .
    Ratings Received:
    +220 / 0
    I dislike the nick akh.

    BaraakAllahu feek.

    He does.

    I think we should leave it be. Nothing good it coming out of this thread atm. Give each other some space. To each, his own.
  18. kashif_nazeer
    No Mood
    Offline

    kashif_nazeer ~~~Alhamdulillah~~~

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,529
    Likes Received:
    34
    Trophy Points:
    58
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    In this world on the land
    Ratings Received:
    +55 / 1
    Insha'Allah we'll keep learning new things throughout our lives.

    I hope the mist will clear and more productive things come out of the discussion.Instead of losing our cool we should discuss things so that who don't know may learn new things and those who know may cross check themselves,thus is the way we all can get along in sha'Allah.

    Khayr I was just wishing to know how we can use this theory and find common grounds in sha'Allah,also if I am corrected on few things that would be helpful,as I am not much informed on evolution apart from a few things which I'll have to clarify for myself.Also as many atheists/agnostics use this tool to justify their actions,so it would be great if we could come to a solution through discussion,in sha'Allah.
    Also whilst learning,learning the correct aqeeda(creed) and sticking to it is important .

    May Allah grant us all clearn understanding of His deen and gather us all in jannah.Ameen.
    Jazakomullah khayran
  19. uniqueskates
    Cool
    Offline

    uniqueskates Rabbe Zidni Illma

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2012
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    169
    Trophy Points:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Java Programmer
    Location:
    Lost In Sands Of Time
    Ratings Received:
    +287 / 1
    Sister,
    I will remember not to use the short form in future. InshaaAllah.

    And yes. Bro. John. Just let it go. Please. He does believe in Darwin's theory of Ape to Man. Bro, Scotty is entitled to his freedom, so he can believe in what he wants too. And I don't think we can force him to change his views and vice-versa.

    Thank you all for your inputs. At least I learnt something out of the thread, though am "0" when it comes to biology and related fields. JazakAllah Khair.

    Let peace & harmony prevail between us. InshaaAllah.

    THE END OF THE THREAD.
  20. kiana
    Offline

    kiana Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Gender:
    Female
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    This Dunya
    Ratings Received:
    +38 / 3
    here we go once again. stupid people putting words in scotty's mouth. my English is worse than all of yours but im make sure I read properly. Scotty (brother mohammed) said that we humans are in the ape family. he did not say we came from apes, although some of you think like apes.

Share This Page