PLEASE DON'T COME TO THE MOSQUE!!!

[saifkhan]

as salam 'alaikum

I've never seen a parent not embarrassed and saying nothing to their children. I've seen even shouting for their over actions.

however it is us, other brothers and sister, made him calm and let them go.

yes, in our mosque, parents are well aware of what their little kids do and they are quite in the time of salah and then they are free or when the masjid is almost vacant.

I;m not saying they can do whatever they want.
but what they do?

laugh a bit, run with sound, sometimes screaming
but what is their age? 3, 5 or 7........


subhan Allah if they receive shouting and bashing, what will happen just they will get apart.

we can make them understand, we can call them near and just make them understand with love and affection.

sometimes, i tell them, after salah and when ppl will leave i'm gonna play with you.
and the most interesting thing is, neither i speak their language, nor they speak mine.

i give them chocolates, toffees and they are okay with that, when i say I'll give you but you have to be silent.

i dont know wht happens to other mosques, and i guess all over world 3,5,7 yrs old children are same or similar.


however,

wassalam

 

[esperanza]

IT STARTS AT HOME
IT STARTS WITH THE PARENTS

i totally agree wiht the brother...young children can be taught at home by the mother until old enough to go to the mosque

organising events or study groups etc for older children is a different issue

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam walaikum,

WOW...you who want to make the whole world Muslim can not even tolerate the sweet smell of basil at the masjid.

Children are the blessings of this life. You want quiet you stay at home...the masjid is alive..we are not empty buildings with children who are sodomized by priests and rabbis. That is why they are quiet.

Give me a child with energy. Give me a child that is full of live and I am grateful.

The most pious Believers I know tolerate children at all times..they are called role models. As the brother wrote. children love to please...tell them to behave..

But I think enough has been written on this very sad state of affairs. How can anyone think of dahwa when we can not love our own children.To change the intellect the heart has to be wide open.

 

[msmoorad]

Assalaam walaikum,

WOW...you who want to make the whole world Muslim can not even tolerate the sweet smell of basil at the masjid.

Children are the blessings of this life. You want quiet you stay at home...the masjid is alive..we are not empty buildings with children who are sodomized by priests and rabbis. That is why they are quiet.

Give me a child with energy. Give me a child that is full of live and I am grateful.

The most pious Believers I know tolerate children at all times..they are called role models. As the brother wrote. children love to please...tell them to behave..

But I think enough has been written on this very sad state of affairs. How can anyone think of dahwa when we can not love our own children.To change the intellect the heart has to be wide open.

salaams to all

the musjid is supposed to be quiet- its only in the west that the musjids are not respected as they ought to be.
now youre jumping to sodomy.

and how can disciplining our children be a sign of not loving them?
actually its quite the opposite.
the musjids are supposed to be alive with a'maal like tilaawat of Quran, salaah, duah, halqas of learning n teaching-like Musjidun Nabwi(SAW)
not alive with children running & playing & disturbing others.

one of the reasons this problem also exists is sisters feel they have to come to the musjid.
when they have little children under 7-8, they should be at home making their childrens tarbiyyah-
its not not the adults who want to be able to concentrate on their ibaadat that should stay at home- you got it all mixed up.

seriously- youre very deluded when it comes to this issue.

may Allah ta'ala grant us all proper understanding of his deen & not allow emotions & sentiments to cloud our judgement.

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam walaikum,

I am not deluded.
I am sensitive to the needs of children. Children are not at the masjids all the time.

However, it saddens me that we have Muslim adults who can not discipline children in a loving manner.

We should rejoice that children attend the masjids.

If I am deluded I am in good company. The Prophet, may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, had compassion.

You are getting a little sexist here aren't you? Women feel they can attend the masjid...no we do not feel ...we are entitled.

And I will make dua that each one of you impatient adults is given a little patience. InshaAllah, each masjid will get 500 additional children each jumma.

 

[ShyHijabi]

:salam2:

Whoa! We got people name calling "deluded" and people thinking children are being sodomized if they aren't in the masjid. Seriously people, all we need to do is make sure parents are responsible for discipling their children. I will raise my daughter to be respectful of the mosque and act appropriately.

I won't keep her home because someone has some cultural belief that females shouldn't go to the mosque. Quite the opposite, Rasool forbid men from keeping women from the mosque. We all need to just clam down here.

 

[msmoorad]

Assalaam walaikum,

I am not deluded.
I am sensitive to the needs of children. Children are not at the masjids all the time.

However, it saddens me that we have Muslim adults who can not discipline children in a loving manner.

We should rejoice that children attend the masjids.

If I am deluded I am in good company. The Prophet, may the peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, had compassion.

You are getting a little sexist here aren't you? Women feel they can attend the masjid...no we do not feel ...we are entitled.

And I will make dua that each one of you impatient adults is given a little patience. InshaAllah, each masjid will get 500 additional children each jumma.

salaams to all

please read & understand properly:
i said they FEEL they have to
they dont have to
me have to
women can IF they wish but when they have little children to look after- its not a sensible thing to do.

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah

 

[ShyHijabi]

:salam2:

It quite snesible to take children to the mosque, you just TEACH them proper behavior. Children and the mosque are not exclusive terms. Rasool held his daughter while he led prayer for goodness sakes! Would you tell him to leave his child home?

 

[strive-may-i]

Assalaam walaikum,
..........
Children are the blessings of this life. You want quiet you stay at home...the masjid is alive..we are not empty buildings with children who are sodomized by priests and rabbis. That is why they are quiet.

Give me a child with energy. Give me a child that is full of live and I am grateful.

The most pious Believers I know tolerate children at all times..they are called role models. As the brother wrote. children love to please...tell them to behave..

But I think enough has been written on this very sad state of affairs. How can anyone think of dahwa when we can not love our own children.To change the intellect the heart has to be wide open.

:salam2:

Please dont come to mosque is totally not valid.

There is a subtle contrast, that we might have missed. Not all communities tend to have loud kids (running around, acrobats, action stunts etc) in mosque, have you noticed that?
The difference seems to be in the background. Can we say that the kids tend to reflect in action, what they see from Idiot box? Just wondering because urban mosques with nuclear family, tend to have kids who run around, play and make more noise. While mosques in small towns or places where TV is not the favorite past time activity tend to be better behaved? It could be a matter of joint family too...
A very subtle point?

If a particular kid is very unruly and does not listen at all, the kids parents should not be blamed. Blaming parents, denies the community the chance to connect/correct. Some thing has to be done about it. Whats best, the parent / community has to decide. It should solve the unruly behavior of kid in question, the course of action should remedy the kid or family, contain the problem. You dont burn a house [Allah's house, by denying people inside], just because there are some kids running around like rats [sorry for the sarcasm, I love kids, the irritated might as well call kids as rats ]

• Mosque belongs to community, its a very public religious place. The question here is how adept the community is in handling the kids, at Mosque. Its a question of brotherhood, how well we join hands , in upbringing the young ones.
• Some Elders, grown ups, highly intellectual etc etc, cant stand sight of kid.

Reflect on these. PERIOD

 

[strive-may-i]

:salam2:
And there is a subtle difference between kid and toddler, I think. Is this where the difference in opinion is raising ? Grown up kids can somehow be managed. Its totally incorrect to expect a toddler to stop crying! If community has no other alternative, then possibly a baby care center in vicinity of mosque makes sense!

Usually I dont see toddlers at mosques. But it might not be the reality in every corner of world. There are some countries where, they appoint a person to take care of the footwear. Its a practical necessity. So similar approach could help here.

And well mates, there always is some difficulty, that we have to put up with. Patience and perseverance helps. And simple solutions are best

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam walaikum,

I am laughing..it is not intellectuals that can not stand children..but old curmudgeons.


( in many communities in the US..the masjid is the only place where Muslims can meet )

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

It seem some of our brothers and sisters could not tolerate kids making noise in the masjid. I respect your views, you have yours and I've mine. I've prayed in masjid where trains passing nearby which shake the whole masjid and also aeroplanes flying low on top of the masjid. I don't think any kids can scream louder than this two machines... yet it seem nobody bothered these noises. I will agree, this is not good analogy because these are not within your control, while we can still prevent the kids from coming to the masjid since they make noise.

Upon reading below hadith, I realised at the end of the day our best qudwah and role model is the Prophet (blessings and peace be upon him).

The Prophet said, "When I start the prayer I intend to prolong it, but on hearing the cries of a child, I cut short the prayer because I know that the cries of the child will incite its mother's passions."

Source: http://www.sahih-bukhari.com/Pages/results.php5

In another hadith, one badwi urinated in the masjid but the Prophet (blessings and peace be upon him) also tolerated. Here, we are talking about innocent kids, let is use some wisdom to tackle kids, I saw in one masjid the guard walking around kids area with stick, I never seen him hitting any kids, he was there just to scare them. Perhaps this will work. Preventing them from masjid is not the answer because it will be too late to repair the damage when these kids become youth and distant themselves from masjid. I'm seeing hundred of them today.

 

[esperanza]

asalam alaykum

why are people reacting so sensitively... people are not saying that children should not come to the mosque,,,,only that youbng children can learn just as well at home wiht their mothers

noone is saying women should not go to the mosque,but it is not compulsary

we cannot make a generalization as the situation is different in different countries

maybe in some countries like usa ,yes the masjud is the place where muslims meet as a community,and maybe have no other contacts,so very important for families to gather there

but in other places ,islamic countries and also countries where there are big muslim communities,,,children can aslo meet up through other familes through women meeting together in their homes

its not a point of not letting children come to the mosque but sometimes there is an alternative

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

No sister, nobody reacting sensitively here. Our Prophet is our role model. We can have opinions yet Prophet's action is indisputable.

Whether it is USA or KSA, the role and purpose of masjid is the same. We must return masjid to it's original role and stop confining it as a place to perform prayers.

Soon after the great hijrah, what was first thing the Prophet built? Masjid. It was the place of worship, school, judiciary court, community and cultural centre, etc. You can read more from below link:

http://islam1.org/iar/imam/archives/1999/10/08/the_role_of_the_masjid.php

 

[msmoorad]

No sister, nobody reacting sensitively here. Our Prophet is our role model. We can have opinions yet Prophet's action is indisputable.

Whether it is USA or KSA, the role and purpose of masjid is the same. We must return masjid to it's original role and stop confining it as a place to perform prayers.

Soon after the great hijrah, what was first thing the Prophet built? Masjid. It was the place of worship, school, judiciary court, community and cultural centre, etc. You can read more from below link:

http://islam1.org/iar/imam/archives/1999/10/08/the_role_of_the_masjid.php

salaams to all

what people who use this argument that Rasullullah(SAW) played with children in the musjid etc-are failing to understand that this was NOT a regular occurance.
also, the homes of Haz Aisha & Fathima (Rad) were very close to the musjid-actually they were almost attached to the musjid.

so if children came crawling while the women were busy with their salaah themselves, thats understanderable.

nowhere in any hadith does it say that the womenfolk of the Sahaba(Rad)brought their children to the musjid to play & run around freely.

and this is exactly what were doing nowadays.

the example of Rasullullah(SAW) is about what to do if small, crawling children had to somehow enter the musjid. and this was not a regular thing.

please show me a hadith where it says the children of the Sahaba(RAD) were running around & playing games in the musjid.

ITS NOT THE SAME THING!

YOU CANT USE THAT AS DALEEL FOR OLDER CHILDREN MISBEHAVING IN THE MUSJID!

(brother,please answer my questions about where in the US do u live now & which country & city are u originally from.)

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

salaams to all

what people who use this argument that Rasullullah(SAW) played with children in the musjid etc-are failing to understand that this was NOT a regular occurance.
also, the homes of Haz Aisha & Fathima (Rad) were very close to the musjid-actually they were almost attached to the musjid.

so if children came crawling while the women were busy with their salaah themselves, thats understanderable.

nowhere in any hadith does it say that the womenfolk of the Sahaba(Rad)brought their children to the musjid to play & run around freely.

and this is exactly what were doing nowadays.

the example of Rasullullah(SAW) is about what to do if small, crawling children had to somehow enter the musjid. and this was not a regular thing.

please show me a hadith where it says the children of the Sahaba(RAD) were running around & playing games in the musjid.

ITS NOT THE SAME THING!

YOU CANT USE THAT AS DALEEL FOR OLDER CHILDREN MISBEHAVING IN THE MUSJID!

(brother,please answer my questions about where in the US do u live now & which country & city are u originally from.)

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah

If you are asking me, the answer is I'm not from US. If you read all my post in this thread, you will notice I keep mentioning about Malaysia, it is located in South East Asia.

Brother, regarding the hadith I quoted, I will suggest you consult a sheikh. I'm studying in a university taking Islamic studies... I've opportunity to clarify with learned sheikh about this hadith. I don't want to elaborate more, up to you to find out.

And you also missed a point, at no time I said we should allow children run and disturb everyone in Masjid... all I were saying do not use that as an excuse to prevent them from coming to the masjid. I hope you understand this correctly. I don't like the way you making assumption without properly read all my posts. Unless you not directing this question to me, my apology for that.

 

[msmoorad]

salaams to all

sorry

i was directing the part about children running & playing in the musjid to Aapa.

and you should ask your sheik about this:

Children who do not know ettiquettes of the Masjid and have no knowledge of ritual cleanliness should NOT be allowed to come to the Masjid. Similarly, children who know ritual cleanliness and also know the sanctity and reverence of the Masjid are permitted to come to the Masjid.

The Holy Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) said, 'When the child is seven years old, order him to say prayers and when he is ten years old, CHASTISE HIM TO DO SO.' (Mishkaat). It does NOT mean that when the child is seven years old, EVERY child can pay due respect to the Masjid. The instruction and training for prayer CAN also be given at home. When a child has attained seven years of age AND he can show respect to the Masjid and understand ritual cleanliness, THEN ONLY he is permitted to come to the Masjid. Its in this case that there is no prohibition for such a child.

RASULULLAH (SALLALLAAHU ALAYHI WASALLAM) SAID, 'KEEP YOUR INSANE PEOPLE AND YOUR CHILDREN AWAY FROM THE MASJID' (IBN MAAJAH).
This is also a clear & explicit sahih hadith- why dont people want to follow this one- why only follow the one that they like?
This prohibition is generally flouted nowadays where little children create disturbance in the masjid. Often it has been experienced that little children by their crying distract the father and other Musallees as well. The prohibition is based on the sanctity, reverence and cleanliness of the masjid. It is also improper to bring little children into the Saffs (rows) of adults. Due to parents NOT following the correct guidelines regarding this, scholars have said that those children who cannot behave should be made to stand in between the adults during salaah so that there is less chance of them misbehaving & disturbing others.
The scholars are not advocating bringing these kids to the musjid, its just that they have to do this since parents keep ignoring their advice.

however, your post about the older children is another issue.

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazkallah

 

[Hard Rock Moslem]

I expected you will come with one of the hadith with weak narration. All those oppose child going to masjid will use this hadith to back their argument. Find out, which one is weak hadith. You can't use weak hadith as your daleel.

When the child is seven order him to pray (saheeh), meaning you must start teaching the child prayers before the age of 7, which I will agree with you can be done at home as well as at masjid. That is my wish as parents where I want to do it. I agree the child can learn the same thing at home, show me proof where the Prophet said the same can not be done at Masjid, I don't want weak hadith please?

Wallahi, please accept my apology if I wronged you.

 

[Aapa]

Assalaam walaikum,

We go to pray and ask for forgiveness.

If you concentrated on asking for forgiveness you could overlook and be loving to others.

A person asking for the forgiveness of Allah is so busy cleaning his soul he is not distracted by the noise of innocent souls.

 

[msmoorad]

Assalaam walaikum,

We go to pray and ask for forgiveness.

If you concentrated on asking for forgiveness you could overlook and be loving to others.

A person asking for the forgiveness of Allah is so busy cleaning his soul he is not distracted by the noise of innocent souls.

salaams to all

theres very few of us who are that level like the sahaba(RAD)- that when the imam said Allahu Akbar- they are not conscious of whats going on around them & totally absorbed in their salaah.

still, this does not mean you can bring children into the musjid, who cant behave themselves.

the incident where Rasullullah (SAW) played with the children occured when they came into the musjid WITHOUT the knowledge of their mothers.

here the parent know full well what their children are doing but dont have the sense to not bring them until they are older & able to behave.

and to the brother- i spoke to my imam today & he said its a Fiqhi mas'ala and the jurists of the Hanafi school are clear on this that children who cant behave apprpriately are NOT allowed in the musjid.
as a Malaysian -youre most prob Shafi
i dont know if this means that your scholars have a different view

ive one mistake -the home of Haz Fathima(Rad) was not adjacent to the musjid- it was Haz Hafsah & Aisha (Rad)


i think ive said enough-may Allah ta'ala guide us us all

and Allah ta'ala knows best
jazakallah