What does women and driving have to do with Islam?

Ibn Uthaymin

Junior member
I am a Muslim and I'm not allowed to marry a Saudi woman according to Saudi Law. But no one asks if this is what Islâm teaches. Because we know it doesn't.

al-Bukhaari (5365) and Muslim (2527) narrated from Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “The best women who ride camels are the women of Quraysh.”

What's more concealing riding camels or driving cars?

Mashaa Allah Idris going in.
 

Um Ibrahim

Alhamdulilah :)
REally?!

I am a Muslim and I'm not allowed to marry a Saudi woman according to Saudi Law. But no one asks if this is what Islâm teaches. Because we know it doesn't.

al-Bukhaari (5365) and Muslim (2527) narrated from Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him) that the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “The best women who ride camels are the women of Quraysh.”

What's more concealing riding camels or driving cars?

That's crazy, I never knew that subhanalaah. Goodness, so many messed up things in Muslim countries. That's just encouraging racism.
 

hayat84

I'm not what you believe
:salam2:
I'm reverted muslima and I sometimes drive the car for necessity,and I don't judge myself to be like those who rode the camels.would you insinuate that every muslim woman driving a car is a "woman of quraysh?".if my husband allows me to do it,why should I deny this thing to myself?in many situations my husband was out for work and he left me the car to make the commissions he could do and none thought so badly:SMILY23:
 

RawTruth

New Member
Its all culture and the women there are the only ones who can stand up and change it.:tti_sister:
:salam2:

I just read yet another news article discussing Saudi women not being able to drive. IT says a Saudi woman was arrested because she disobeyed the laws and drove and encouraged other women to do the same thing in her country. Now most of the non-Muslims hearing about this news are blaming Islam of being a backward, barbaric religion! of course nothing new, but still subhanalaah! Just gets me annoyed to see our beautiful religion being blamed for every little mistake that happens. This is the one thing I don't understand about Saudi Arabia, what does Islam have to do with women driving? I really don't think that rule has anything to do with Islam. The main concern is that the women will drive to haraam places and mix with men, one does not only have to drive to do haraam things, they can do it anywhere @ anytime. The other thing is these women are adults and should be responsible for their own actions--that's what the authorities are missing.

Is this law forbidding women really Islamic? it's seems to be more traditional than Islamic.
 

ahmed_indian

to Allah we belong
The same could be same for men as well, why are woman always singled out as the ones who will do this? That is my issue with it, Men and Woman both do evil but it seems that woman are the ones singled out. Woman should be allowed to drive to get jobs, get an education and such. To not allow them to drive puts restrictions on how they are able to better themselves and their families.

:wasalam:

its not about blaming women only for the acts done by both genders. its about keeping segregation.

or we have one more option, let the women drive and ban the males :D
 

arzafar

Junior Member
:wasalam:

its not about blaming women only for the acts done by both genders. its about keeping segregation.

or we have one more option, let the women drive and ban the males :D

how about separate public transport for women and also separate lanes for M and F drivers. Not very difficult to do this - IF there is a will.
 

JenGiove

Junior Member
:salam2:

It also potrays the moral fiber of the males as being weak...too weak to curb their own desires and behavior. What does that say about the opinion being held about the males? Nothing very good I'm afraid.

So, because men can't control themselves the women have to pay the cost by being denied the ability to drive? How does THAT make sense....punish the innocent for the sins of the sinners? It seems to be loop-sided policing.

ban the men, make them walk everywhere and let the women drive! They would be better able to escape an attack, they would have a weapon if needed <of the car>, and the number of accidents would go down.

Here's a thought....enforce the driving laws!
 

Aroosak

Junior Member
:salam2:

ban the men, make them walk everywhere and let the women drive! They would be better able to escape an attack, they would have a weapon if needed <of the car>, and the number of accidents would go down.

Here's a thought....enforce the driving laws!

Lol Word... I always wondered why is it that women have to pay the consequences... In an ideal world maybe things would work fine with women not HAVING to drive but circumstances are not perfect and economic needs should lead to equal rights and options for both sexes...
 

abu'muhammad

Junior Member
saudi scholars have opined that if women are allowed to drive, cases are chasing girls, men and women meeting in secluded places, etc. will take place. its not that everybody will misuse this freedom, but a part will do it.

one can see such examples in muslim countries where its allowed to drive.

Assalamu alaykum

See some truth in the above post. It would had been much better to see and read the arguements,opinions and reasons put by saudi scholars in this regard. thanks.
----
It’s been a gut question for me that - whether its good that sisters have to sit and the drivers have to mess around on the road or the sisters driving and doing the same ? perhaps in some countries people doubt drivers as owners though. they might be driving own tavera car but might be asked ' can you inform us who is the owner of the car ?' :) so this ain't problem for saudi sisters,lol ... still its personal abc and yes sisters have all rights reserved on here, lol. Sisters from saudi could help better to understand, inshaAllaah. If then please come forth.
 

Um Ibrahim

Alhamdulilah :)
:wasalam:

its not about blaming women only for the acts done by both genders. its about keeping segregation.

or we have one more option, let the women drive and ban the males :D

I don't think that's an option because men have to work to provide for the family so they need to get to farther distances from home maybe. But maybe they should try that for a week just so they can feel what the women go through!:lol:

About the segregation part, I understand what you're saying but how will women NOT being able to drive keep segregation? Don't some of the women have to ride with drivers who are not related to them sometimes, alone? lol that would beat the whole point of segregation wouldn't it?

Anyway as some of the brothers and sisters mentioned Allah knows what is best, maybe that is what is best for Saudi women but in my personal opinion it's not a very good law. It's an inconvenience to women to always depend on male family members anytime she wants to go anywhere! I would be irritated to be honest.:girl3:
 

ayesha.ansari

Junior Member
Islam have given rights to every one, to women, men, children, parents and All. and i thing in the world, only Saudi govt. have applied these rules over there... i wish each and every Muslim Country manage every thing according to Quran and Islam.
 

Um Ibrahim

Alhamdulilah :)
Islam have given rights to every one, to women, men, children, parents and All. and i thing in the world, only Saudi govt. have applied these rules over there... i wish each and every Muslim Country manage every thing according to Quran and Islam.

Yes indeed Islam has given rights to everyone. May Allah forgive our mistakes and guide all the Muslims to be better in their religion and as human beings. Allahuma Amin.
 

A Kashmiri

Junior Member
Unfortunately the western media is too blind to understand the issue.

Govt and Shoura council in Saudi Arabia is not saying it is haram to drive and it should be forbidden.

What they are saying that it is not the right time yet to allow women driving on roads as the country law forbid mixing of sexes it would mean a whole end to end infrastructure and departments for women driving. It would mean setting up female emergency road service/ police/ driving institues/ accident insurance claims/ workshops/ etc etc .

Secondly Saudi Arabia is not like Kuwait , qatar, bahran , jordan which are not bigger than jeddah city alone. It is a very big country.

Also yes there is a part of culture involved but we cant expect them to wake up one morning and start living like others.

At the end it is there country and they should choose what is best for them. I think the women live far better in Saudi than any other country in the world.

Wasallam
 

Ahsen

Junior Member
leaving your wife,daughter,sister alone with a male driver who is not in anyway related to her is not a good thing.Why don't people see that when they hire drivers for their wives?
 

al-fajr

...ism..schism
Staff member
:salam2:

It also potrays the moral fiber of the males as being weak...too weak to curb their own desires and behavior. What does that say about the opinion being held about the males? Nothing very good I'm afraid.

So, because men can't control themselves the women have to pay the cost by being denied the ability to drive? How does THAT make sense....punish the innocent for the sins of the sinners? It seems to be loop-sided policing.

ban the men, make them walk everywhere and let the women drive! They would be better able to escape an attack, they would have a weapon if needed <of the car>, and the number of accidents would go down.

Here's a thought....enforce the driving laws!
Hi JenG,

The ban on women driving could have a number of reasons, and its not just about what you said (the logic in which I think is quite flawed, that set aside though).

I can see why women don’t drive in Saudia, its like asking why a woman doesn’t join the male international football tournaments? Well, its not suitable right? Any other good reason? No.

In the case of driving, they may just not want that sort of interaction going on between men and women in their society, that’s fair enough, their society is for them to make and is nothing like the western societies in terms of gender interactions, so for someone like yourself who has had no exposure to it, you cannot be judging their laws. There are on the other hand, some inconsistencies, in that it exposes women to male drivers who would otherwise be unknown to them; then again, this is exposure to one individual some of the time, not many individuals, all of the time, if you see what I am saying?

I don't necessarily support the law, I think theres a lot of factors to be considered though.

In some places in the world there is no official ban on women driving, but women never ever drive, its not deemed appropriate. When I go to those places, the fact that I have a valid drivers licence is 100% irrelevant, I don’t go near the wheel (and honestly, I don’t miss it much either).
 

JenGiove

Junior Member
Hi JenG,

The ban on women driving could have a number of reasons, and its not just about what you said (the logic in which I think is quite flawed, that set aside though).

Hi al-fajr,
I never said it was.


I can see why women don’t drive in Saudia, its like asking why a woman doesn’t join the male international football tournaments? Well, its not suitable right? Any other good reason? No.


Actually, it's because woman and men's physical strength is mismatched...not because its morally unsuitable.

so for someone like yourself who has had no exposure to it, you cannot be judging their laws.

That's correct but you'll notice that I never made a statement anywhere close to being a judgement. I said that it seems to be lop-sided, not that it was loop-sided. That leaves room for the possibility that I was wrong.

I'll have to use your statement when someone, who has never been to America, makes a judgement about America's laws...Thank you for your help.
 

JenGiove

Junior Member
Activists: Free Saudi woman arrested for driving

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4314100.../activists-free-saudi-woman-arrested-driving/

By MAGGIE MICHAEL
updated 5/24/2011 4:33:08 PM ET

CAIRO — More Saudi women posted video clips online showing themselves behind the wheel of cars after a Saudi woman was arrested for a second time.

Women's activists say the arrest of Manal al-Sherif, 32, is a move by the rulers of this ultraconservative kingdom to suppress an Internet campaign encouraging women to defy a ban on female driving.


Having so far escaped the unrest sweeping the region, Saudi rulers have cracked down harder than usual on 32-year-old Manal al-Sherif after seeing her case become a rallying call for youths anxious for change.
Al-Sherif and a group of other women started a Facebook page called "Teach me how to drive so I can protect myself," urging authorities to lift the ban and posted a videoclip last week of al-Sherif behind the wheel in the eastern city of Khobar.

The page was removed after more than 12,000 people indicated their support for its call for women drivers to take to the streets in a mass drive on June 17. The campaign's Twitter account also was deactivated. Al-Sherif, a 32-year-old IT expert, was arrested at dawn on Sunday and accused of "violating public order," according to a security official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media. She was ordered held for five days while the case was investigated; her brother, Mohammed al-Sherif, who was in the car while she was driving, also was taken into custody.

No women drivers
Saudi Arabia is the only country in the world that bans women — both Saudi and foreign — from driving. The prohibition forces families to hire live-in drivers, and those who cannot afford the $300 to $400 a month for a driver must rely on male relatives to drive them to work, school, shopping or the doctor.

Saudi clerics, from the hard-line Wahhabi school of Islam that is the official doctrine of the kingdom, insist the ban protects against the spread of vice and temptation because women drivers would be free to leave home alone and interact with male strangers. KingAbdullah has promised reforms in the past and has taken some tentative steps to ease restrictions on women. But the Saudi monarchy relies on Wahhabi clerics to give religious legitimacy to its rule and is deeply reluctant to defy their entrenched power.


HumanRightsWatch warned the arrest will hurt the country's image.
"Arresting a woman who drove her family around in a car and then showed it online opens Saudi Arabia to condemnation — and, in fact, to mockery — around the world," said spokesman Christoph Wilcke. "The longer she stays in prison, the more the kingdom will have to answer for."
A local rights group, the Association of Saudi Women's Rights, visited al-Sherif in the detention center in the eastern city of Dammam where she was ordered held for five days, and urged the Saudi government to "take a decisive stance and give women the right to drive their cars."
"This is a natural right," the group said.


Over the past couple of days, at least two young Saudi women appeared in online videoclips driving their cars in support of al-Sherif and defiance of the ban.


One young woman, identified only as Ruba and dressed in the all-encompassing black abaya all women must wear in public, was shown driving inside a compound in Riyadh. "Ruba drove in Riyadh. Congratulations Ruba," the voice of her female companion is heard saying.


Another, a teenage girl whose name was not given, was filmed by a male companion in the eastern city of Jiddah. "After this car, turn right and slow down," he was heard saying.

Al-Sherif's arrest prompted hundreds of activists to set up Facebook groups and campaigns calling for her release and an end to the driving ban.


"Let Manal al-Sherif and all other women drive their own cars, take their kids to the hospital, buy stuff from the supermarket, go to work without a driver," columnist Khalf al-Harbi wrote in the Al-Watan daily.
Activist Walid Abou el-Kheir posted on his Twitter account a petition signed by 300 Saudi activists appealing to the Saudi king to set al-Sherif free and make a clear commitment to ending the driving ban.

Signs of unease?
Some female activists said the arrest and swift suppression of the campaign were signs of the kingdom's growing unease over the popular uprisings sweeping the region, toppling authoritarian regimes in Tunisia and Egypt. Earlier this year, Saudi authorities moved quickly to put down small pro-reform protests, mainly by the country's Shiite minority, that were organized on Facebook.


"The authorities are worried ... because it could encourage other forms of rebellion especially at a time the whole region is shaking up," said Wajeha al-Huwaide, who was involved in a 2007 campaign that collected more than 3,000 signatures in a bid to try to overturn the ban.


"Whenever the Arab region is shaken with changes, the state feels threatened and surrenders more to the religious establishment to keep its political system intact," said al-Huwaide, who filmed the video of al-Sherif driving.


In Washington, State Department spokesman Mark Toner, said the U.S. administration was seeking more information about al-Sherif's status. "We understand there's an active debate on a lot of these social issues in Saudi Arabia, and we trust the government of Saudi Arabia to give careful consideration to these voices of its citizens as they speak about issues of concern," Toner said.


In the video of her driving, al-Sherif — dressed in a headscarf and the all-encompassing black abaya all women must wear in public — argues that not all Saudi women are "queens" who can afford to hire a driver and says driving for women can save lives, time, and a woman's dignity. Al-Sherif said she learned how to drive at the age of 30 in New Hampshire.

'We are humiliated'
"We are humiliated sometimes because we can't find a taxi to take us to work," she said.

Al-Sherif faces accusations of "violating the rules and the system by driving her car and roaming the streets of the province," the prison chief in Khobar, Ayoub ben Nahit, was quoted as saying in the daily Al-Watan. He also accused her of "inciting public opinion" by posting the video clip.

She had been detained for several hours on Saturday but was released after she signed a pledge agreeing not to drive.


There is no written Saudi law banning women from driving, only fatwas, or religious edicts, by senior clerics that are enforced by police. No major Islamic clerics outside the country call for such a ban.


One prominent Saudi cleric, Abdel-Rahman al-Barak, said in a fatwa posted on his website that women who violate the driving ban are "sinful and are opening (the doors) of evil."


Previous moves by women to overturn the driving ban have been met with swift reprisals by the authorities.


More than two decades ago, a group of women got into cars and drove the streets of Riyadh. The protest cost the 47 female drivers and passengers dearly. They were arrested, lost their jobs for 2½ years, were banned from travel for a year and were condemned by the powerful clergy as harlots.


On Monday, another woman was also reportedly arrested, along with two female relatives, after driving to a grocery store in a remote area of al-Ras province north of Riyadh, according to the website of the Al-Riyadh daily.


The paper quoted the woman as saying she doesn't have a male relative to take her shopping and has driven herself to the supermarket in the past. Women in remote desert areas of Saudi Arabia can sometimes drive without authorities noticing.
 

justoneofmillion

Junior Member
:salam2:I think it is better to let Saudis decide among themselves what is best for their society concerning this.Outside interference will not serve the cause of these women.

If they know how to handle it with diplomacy and patience they will have what they want.It is not true that only men can not "control"themselves some women too.

So it is unfair to put the blame on men either,it takes two.In countries like Saudi Arabia we know what would happen to a man who tries to assault a woman without consent...

The pseudo European feminists should better take care of the thousand prostitutes running the street of Amsterdam or Hamburg instead of giving lessons to others.

Look what happened to women elsewhere ,some women they gave them the remote control they took the T.V Subhanallah.Sometimes they are the ones looking for the trouble and then cry and blame it on the men.We all know that com'on be serious folks it is not as onesided as We wish to make believe.

Some women want equal rights only when it suits them, but do not wanna share equal responsibilities and complain no matter what.Watch the video below to understand what am talking about.Saudis know their societies better.I would rather invest in education first.There was a very beautiful lecture I listened to sometime ago If I remember the brother who was lecturing I will post it in here Inshallah.

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for me this kinda woman should be kept in the house, in the kitchen can't let her out in the wilderness, she doesn't behave.:biggrin:
 

al-fajr

...ism..schism
Staff member
Actually, it's because woman and men's physical strength is mismatched...not because its morally unsuitable.

Probably.

My point was that there are a number of reasons, (morally unsuitable could be one of them, yep) but nobody seems to question/assume something like I mentioned as much as they question any Islamic society with regards to such rules affecting women, all the while, assuming the worst conclusion.

I'll have to use your statement when someone, who has never been to America, makes a judgement about America's laws...Thank you for your help.
Sorry, I don't know which American law you're talking about.
 

Abu Talib

Feeling low
:salam2:I think it is better to let Saudis decide among themselves what is best for their society concerning this.Outside interference will not serve the cause of these women.

If they know how to handle it with diplomacy and patience they will have what they want.It is not true that only men can not "control"themselves some women too.

So it is unfair to put the blame on men either,it takes two.In countries like Saudi Arabia we know what would happen to a man who tries to assault a woman without consent...

The pseudo European feminists should better take care of the thousand prostitutes running the street of Amsterdam or Hamburg instead of giving lessons to others.

Look what happened to women elsewhere ,some women they gave them the remote control they took the T.V Subhanallah.Sometimes they are the ones looking for the trouble and then cry and blame it on the men.We all know that com'on be serious folks it is not as onesided as We wish to make believe.

Some women want equal rights only when it suits them, but do not wanna share equal responsibilities and complain no matter what.Watch the video below to understand what am talking about.Saudis know their societies better.I would rather invest in education first.There was a very beautiful lecture I listened to sometime ago If I remember the brother who was lecturing I will post it in here Inshallah.

[yt]UpyTbt3MLGo[/yt]

for me this kinda woman should be kept in the house, in the kitchen can't let her out in the wilderness, she doesn't behave.:biggrin:

Assalamu`alaykum

Why was she not onTIME coverpage and all over the world any guess??

I guess its better for woman not drive after being smacked, tased, handcuffed by male police officer.
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Hey you Saudis you gotta learn how to arrest woman who drive from us. We believe in equality so we kick men & woman who drive not like you just locking up and letting off just because she's a woman. That aint justice Evil must be met with evil
Dang your all over the world for arresting one woman what about us we arrested so many who drive. We don't condemn them when they go against the law we just kick and smack them.
 
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