Dawah with a Born-Again Christian

[TheHumbleWun]

well since christians believe Jesus is the word of God which became flesh(came to earth), which is stated in the bible as well. the voice of God walking in my opinion of would be that of Jesus before he became flesh, how can a "voice walk" otherwise. plus God is seen here interacting with them in a physical level plus didnt know of them eating of the tree. God knows that they ate from the tree because they stated that they were naked and before they ate of the tree had no knowledge or shame.
the tree was going to make whoever knowledgable and since adam and eve wasnt blessed by God with this, there was no where else w

but before anyone screams Jesus wasnt said in the old testament; God is often expressed as elohim, which is the plural and not as eloh- the singular. so God is often refers to himself as we. so elohim is the pluralness of God not , pluralness of Gods

Is this all based on all of your opinon or some priests? How do you know that your God knew that? Give me some proof. How come Adam & Eve didn't know that then? What knowledge do you possess that Adam & Eve didn't attain? Did your God know that he was going to be crucified?

Eloh, Eloh is from Hebrew and when prounced you get Allah, Allah.

lā ilāha illā-llāh

I testify that there is no god (ilah) but God (Allah)....you can see the word in here except it's spelled a little differently but prounced the same.

Please see these notes by Ahmed Deedat:

http://media.isnet.org/off/Islam/Deedat/whatishisname/Chapter4.html

 

[blackivy393]

Is this all based on all of your opinon or some priests? How do you know that your God knew that? Give me some proof. How come Adam & Eve didn't know that then? What knowledge do you possess that Adam & Eve didn't attain? Did your God know that he was going to be crucified?

Eloh, Eloh is from Hebrew and when prounced you get Allah, Allah.

lā ilāha illā-llāh

I testify that there is no god (ilah) but God (Allah)....you can see the word in here except it's spelled a little differently but prounced the same.

Please see these notes by Ahmed Deedat:

http://media.isnet.org/off/Islam/Deedat/whatishisname/Chapter4.html

if you read the whole passage beginning from when God created Adam/Eve ( what abilities they were givin , him discussing the tree ( what power the tree posses) and then what happened. it doesnt take rocket science

 

[TheHumbleWun]

if you read the whole passage beginning from when God created Adam/Eve ( what abilities they were givin , him discussing the tree ( what power the tree posses) and then what happened. it doesnt take rocket science

You said "in my opinion" that is why I questioned if every Christian has the same answer. Something might be "rocket science" to you but maybe not to others ...it's relative.

Did you see how the word Alah was replaced by Elohim in the Genesis?

 

[blackivy393]

You said "in my opinion" that is why I questioned if every Christian has the same answer. Something might be "rocket science" to you but maybe not to others ...it's relative.

Did you see how the word Alah was replaced by Elohim in the Genesis?

no i said throughout the old testament both elohim and eloh is used. the main arguements of muslims always used is that the bible or torah must be changed in order to justify their religious text are true because facts about the basic prophets dont match. i say my opinion, because i have never heard anyone even address the issue but in later text jesus is referred to in the bible as the word of God or voice of God; other wise stating a voice is walking around is bizarre. people saying that the torah (original first 5 books) have been altered thats fine, just produce a copy older than the 2000 year old version that is in world's possesion, otherwise it just heresay.

 

[Imad]

hello Leandra,

you said:

Secondly, I did not read those websites I just copied and pasted

Thank you for your effort

Take care,

Imad

 

[beliefinone]

SALAAM,

I just wanted to point out some things to our non muslim researchers? of Islam. This is in a nutshell nothing in depth due to time. I really like your personality Blackivy, you kind of remind me of myself when I was much much younger always searching for the truth, and wanting to really implement “can’t we all just get along” (smile). Anyway, keep posting on here and reading, and eventually you will see something different than what you’ve been taught. Study with an open mind. You definitely have the makings to be a Muslim Novice. (smile).

First, I just want to say that I am a revert to Islam. I am 33 and I have been a Muslim for about 7 years. I was reared as a Christian, and said many of the same things I read on this thread. I had many of the same thoughts, but ALHAMBULILLAH, praise is to Allah, I discovered Islam. Now, I believe in order to understand Islam and accept ALLAH as one God you have to have a sincere zeal to want the truth, and be willing to go the distance alone. Yes, some Muslims do go back to Christianity, but you have this in every religion. People will be people have their own will. Per the Quran there is no compulsion in religion, this is something that will always exist. In my experience as a women it is alot of people that came to the religion for the wrong reasons ie. to get a spouse and once that goes down hill, so does Islam. Some leave due to lack of understanding or having the feeling that Islam requires alot which it does. We expect many things from ALLAH it’s only befitting that we try our hardest to do our best to live right. Then you have those who just came to Islam to be spectators to get scoop and distort it so they can spread all kinds of misconceptions.

Here is a list of things I read and wish to address in a nutshell again for lack of time:

1. I believe that it was Blackivy that said, Christians do not have to consult a scholar from a certain school of thought or something like that. Well, all religions do this. Muslims consult an imam or other scholars, Christians consult their pastors and other scholars whether it’s in the form of a book or some theology school. This does not mean that one can not gain religious knowledge on his/her own. However, it is a fact that some people are more learnt than others. It is the obligation and responsibility of all the believer to obtain knowledge of their way of life and to teach their families and children.

2. Tongues is between the person and God and no one else understands. This is INCorrect. Christians believe in the gift of discerning of spirits and the interpretation of tongues. After one has completed speaking in tongues another person can come tell the congregation what the (somepeoplesay)“the spirit has to say to the church”. This is what I have experienced in my youth.


3. The Bible is God’s word, and is not corrupt etc. Well let’s examine this. Some of supposedly God’s word is not even recorded in the actual book. Was this God’s divine plan or man’s. It was man’s of course this is not a secret. Christians are reading exactly what the church wanted them to read. The bible is mixed with some truths and some false, some additions and some subtractions. Of course this is beyond the Christians of today control, this was done by a select group of people etc. I will not mention translations because many religions have translated there books into other languages due to people speaking various languages converting to that particular religion. However, in Islam it is recommended that All Muslims learn to speak the language of the Quran in an effort to fully understand Allah’s commands and messages, and that these messages forever be in ones heart where it can never been burned and/or destroyed. It is recorded that many of the believers knew the Quran in it’s entirety. This tradition is still encouraged today. Just in the King James bible version alone there are so many contradictions, and people just skip right over them as if not to see the blatant inconsistencies. I remember, I use to ask about these types of situations, and I was told not to question God. You do just that as a kid and then develop a complex where people can put something right in your face and you reject it. This is what happens to many Christians. Many folks stay in Christianity for fear of rejecting God who they believe is Jesus. No one is saying that Christians are bad folks for this, it is just that they have been conditioned into believing this for so long that they are afraid to say otherwise. However, we as human being have a responsibility to research and study. It is so clear that Isa(Jesus) is not God, but regardless of what Isa has said according to the bible people still believe this. My thing is why don’t Christians know that Jesus was NOT always worshipped as GOD.

Cont.....:tti_sister:

 

[beliefinone]

cont..

4. Someone said that all is now good according to the new testament as it relates to eating pork. This is contrary to what Jesus says in the NT, but folk use the same lines over and over again. Thank Allah that some of my family who are devout Christians stopped eating pork. Anyway, Christians say “We are now under grace, and do not have to abide by the Laws or just say your grace before you eat, and all things that were unclean are now clean”. However, the bible states that Jesus said in Matt 5:17-19 “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am come not to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in NO wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven……..”.
This dietary law was implemented for a reason. All the people of the book including the jews, Christians should not be eating the swine. It is not good for the body and even the secular world knows this. So Muslims abide by this law. Surah 16:114-115 So eat of the sustenance which Allah has provided for you, lawful and good; and be grateful for the favours of Allah, if it is He Whom ye serve. He has only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and any (food) over which the name of other than Allah has been invoked. But if one is forced by necessity, without willful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.

5. Someone said The bible was written by Jesus’s disciples NOT. I believe Leandra said this forgive me if I’m wrong, but who told you this lie. There were 12 disciples according to the bible. Paul was not a disciple, Moses was not a disciple, Luke, Micah, Isaiah etc. The bible is a compilation of 2 literary works. Some say three. Anyway, it was not written by Jesus’ disciples.

In conclusion, Muslims do believe that Isa(Jesus) existed and was a Man of High statute, a Great Prophet abiding by the will of ALLAH, but he falls short of actually being ALLAH or God. For his own disciple called him Rabbi, and he himself prayed and cried out to Allah. What was the purpose of doing this if he himself had absolute power. For Christians this is hard to grasp because they have been so indoctrinated by religious propaganda. Just like the concoction of Xmas.


In conclusion, the Quran teaches that Allah Guides whom he pleases….InshaAllah, you all will be guided into the light.

If you need assistance or more information in detail email me.

Salaams,
five a day:tti_sister:
G

 

[Munawar]

:salam2:
MashaAllah sister beliefinone

Wonderful post indeed !!!

May Allah bless you and guide those who are interested to make use of your efforts that you put here and learn the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Ameen.

 

[Mairo]

Hi again Blackivy

This being a thread about Dawah to Born Again Christians, I just wanted to respond to some of the things you said in your earlier posts.

jesus is referred to in the bible as the word of God or voice of God

You may be interested to note that Muhammad, peace be upon him, also explained that Jesus was "the word of God made flesh". Please read the following Hadith:

“Whoever testifies that there in none worthy of being worshipped but God, Who has no partner, and that Muhammad is His slave and Prophet, and that Jesus is the Slave of God, His Prophet, and His word[1] which He bestowed in Mary and a spirit created from Him; and that Paradise (Heaven) is true, and that the Hellfire is true, God will eventually admit him into Paradise, according to his deeds.” (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)

However, I hope in time you will come to a clear understanding that this statement DOES NOT EQUATE JESUS WITH BEING THE SAME AS GOD. Just as you may understand the Quran (or the Bible in your case) as the word of God, you should recognize that these books are not the same thing as GOD HIMSELF. The same is true with Jesus, who was the WORD of God personified, but was not GOD HIMSELF. Allah/God alone is the creator of all things. It was by the permission of God alone that Jesus, peace be upon him, was able to perform any miracles at all. THE LORD GOD ALMIGHTY HAS NO PARTNER(S).

As you noted that the Bible refers to God in singular and plural throughout the texts, you may be interested to find the same example in the Quran - sometimes God is presented as plural (English translation we/us) or singular (I/me).

You mentioned that you have read a significant portion of the Quran and you have been studying Islam for some time now. Could you tell me, what is your belief about the Quran, and what do you think of Muhammad, peace be upon him?

God Bless

 

[blackivy393]

Hi again Blackivy

This being a thread about Dawah to Born Again Christians, I just wanted to respond to some of the things you said in your earlier posts.



You may be interested to note that Muhammad, peace be upon him, also explained that Jesus was "the word of God made flesh". Please read the following Hadith:

“Whoever testifies that there in none worthy of being worshipped but God, Who has no partner, and that Muhammad is His slave and Prophet, and that Jesus is the Slave of God, His Prophet, and His word[1] which He bestowed in Mary and a spirit created from Him; and that Paradise (Heaven) is true, and that the Hellfire is true, God will eventually admit him into Paradise, according to his deeds.” (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)

However, I hope in time you will come to a clear understanding that this statement DOES NOT EQUATE JESUS WITH BEING THE SAME AS GOD. Just as you may understand the Quran (or the Bible in your case) as the word of God, you should recognize that these books are not the same thing as GOD HIMSELF. The same is true with Jesus, who was the WORD of God personified, but was not GOD HIMSELF. Allah/God alone is the creator of all things. It was by the permission of God alone that Jesus, peace be upon him, was able to perform any miracles at all. THE LORD GOD ALMIGHTY HAS NO PARTNER(S).

As you noted that the Bible refers to God in singular and plural throughout the texts, you may be interested to find the same example in the Quran - sometimes God is presented as plural (English translation we/us) or singular (I/me).

You mentioned that you have read a significant portion of the Quran and you have been studying Islam for some time now. Could you tell me, what is your belief about the Quran, and what do you think of Muhammad, peace be upon him?

God Bless

well i have read surah 1 and 2 the second half the quran which is surah 50 until the end. some of the stuff i noticed is very similar to the bible. i noticed to iniquity which is a word i only remember be a few times in the bible but its describes a main scriptures when God will basically say " depart from me ye, who work in iniquity. towards the end, the books are really short like new testment.

prophet muhammad at first i thought was a little weird; i understand that marrying girls @ 9 or older was a common practice basically throughout the world and since he was marrying her and planning to be with her until death; it wasn't necessarily for sexual gratification like that of child molestors who like to come and go. but i would say now if a man has the choice between a 9 year old and 21 year old, and choooses a 9 yearold you have a problem because children are not given the responsibilites of helping raising a family and etc as they did in the past, a 9 year old in most society are not considered women or have reached puberty in order 2 carry a pregnancy, and if you can even get sexually aroused by a 9 year old in order 2 consumate the marriage than someone would say such a person has a problem.

i think i heard prophet muhammad had 9 wives or whatever amount more than 4, i heard the reason for different treaties and political reasons for these marriages; i dont know how many children he had but it made more sense to just marry the children off to other tribes or kingdoms like they did in europe than taking on all these wives.

and can anyone address the wine drinking that will be taking place in heaven ?

 

[Al-Kashmiri]

well i have read surah 1 and 2 the second half the quran which is surah 50 until the end. some of the stuff i noticed is very similar to the bible. i noticed to iniquity which is a word i only remember be a few times in the bible but its describes a main scriptures when God will basically say " depart from me ye, who work in iniquity. towards the end, the books are really short like new testment.

prophet muhammad at first i thought was a little weird; i understand that marrying girls @ 9 or older was a common practice basically throughout the world and since he was marrying her and planning to be with her until death; it wasn't necessarily for sexual gratification like that of child molestors who like to come and go. but i would say now if a man has the choice between a 9 year old and 21 year old, and choooses a 9 yearold you have a problem because children are not given the responsibilites of helping raising a family and etc as they did in the past, a 9 year old in most society are not considered women or have reached puberty in order 2 carry a pregnancy, and if you can even get sexually aroused by a 9 year old in order 2 consumate the marriage than someone would say such a person has a problem.

i think i heard prophet muhammad had 9 wives or whatever amount more than 4, i heard the reason for different treaties and political reasons for these marriages; i dont know how many children he had but it made more sense to just marry the children off to other tribes or kingdoms like they did in europe than taking on all these wives.

and can anyone address the wine drinking that will be taking place in heaven ?

As for this matter, then all praise is to Allaah has made clear to you that no-one from the people of the world ever opposed this act, commented on it up until the times of confusion that we live in. Even the many orientalists who seem to have one goal in life which is to distort and attack Islaam and the Prophet, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam, I haven't found them speaking about this matter with criticism.

However it needs to be said that the Messenger of Allaah, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam was suggested to marry her by someone. In addition, he saw her in some dreams which occured more than once. And we believe that the dreams of the messengers are indeed true, i.e. that they will be fulfilled and are sent from Allaah. Further yet, from that which is well-known is that menses are a clear enough distinguishing factor to indicate that the body is ready to deal with pregnancy. Allaah created us and knows about us best. If what you are saying is the case, then why didn't he cause females to have their menses at a much later date/stage in puberty as oppose to it being an initial one?

A 9 year old in most societies? I'm not sure about that. It is established that in hotter climates, people tend to reach puberty at a much earlier age in comparrison to the UK or even USA. Also in one study, statistics showed that white females were likely to hit puberty later than for instance black females. As we have said, in most societies, rather in probably every society, this was not seen as a problem, even by those who hate Islaam and took every oppertunity to belittle Islaam and the Messenger, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam.

I'll try to reply to your other questions inshaa' Allaah...

 

[blackivy393]

As for this matter, then all praise is to Allaah has made clear to you that no-one from the people of the world ever opposed this act, commented on it up until the times of confusion that we live in. Even the many orientalists who seem to have one goal in life which is to distort and attack Islaam and the Prophet, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam, I haven't found them speaking about this matter with criticism.

However it needs to be said that the Messenger of Allaah, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam was suggested to marry her by someone. In addition, he saw her in some dreams which occured more than once. And we believe that the dreams of the messengers are indeed true, i.e. that they will be fulfilled and are sent from Allaah. Further yet, from that which is well-known is that menses are a clear enough distinguishing factor to indicate that the body is ready to deal with pregnancy. Allaah created us and knows about us best. If what you are saying is the case, then why didn't he cause females to have their menses at a much later date/stage in puberty as oppose to it being an initial one?

A 9 year old in most societies? I'm not sure about that. It is established that in hotter climates, people tend to reach puberty at a much earlier age in comparrison to the UK or even USA. Also in one study, statistics showed that white females were likely to hit puberty later than for instance black females. As we have said, in most societies, rather in probably every society, this was not seen as a problem, even by those who hate Islaam and took every oppertunity to belittle Islaam and the Messenger, sal-Allaahu `alayhi wasallam.

I'll try to reply to your other questions inshaa' Allaah...

weight also plays a role in starting menustration and other races that are know for bigger body types probably will start before others. While a young girl starts menustration the curves of a woman dont normally come to years later. is there any men on this site that can actually say someone that is 9 years old would sexually arouse them in order to consumate a marriage because i have also heard in islam you are not " officially considered married" until you have had sex

 

[TheHumbleWun]

Hello BlackIvy,

I'm going to elaborate on your thoughts. When I get a chance, I will inshallah (God willing) answer the rest next time.

prophet muhammad at first i thought was a little weird; i understand that marrying girls @ 9 or older was a common practice basically throughout the world and since he was marrying her and planning to be with her until death; it wasn't necessarily for sexual gratification like that of child molestors who like to come and go. but i would say now if a man has the choice between a 9 year old and 21 year old, and choooses a 9 yearold you have a problem because children are not given the responsibilites of helping raising a family and etc as they did in the past, a 9 year old in most society are not considered women or have reached puberty in order 2 carry a pregnancy, and if you can even get sexually aroused by a 9 year old in order 2 consumate the marriage than someone would say such a person has a problem.

Asslamo Allaikum

1) Did you know that Muhammad Bin Qasim was seventeen years old when he conquered India?

2) Did you know that Tariq bin Ziyaad was seventeen years old when he conquered Spain and entered into Europe (British Island of Gibraltar is actually Jabal-ut-Tariq meaning mountain of Tariq where his army fought from)

Do you know any 17 year old “Teens” today who can command an army and become a general?

The point is my brother that people matured earlier back then so the 17 year olds of today have no resemblance to 17 years old of yesterday…Same obviously goes for women.

I believe that you are trying to compare youngsters of yesterday to our PS2 & XBOX youngsters.

Jazakullah Khairun

[yt]YUjWqRTBRzQ[/yt]

Also take into account that people's life span was much shorter back in those days then it is now. Health, diet, and food nutrion has tremendously changed. They didn't have the choices that we have today.

Please see below the age of consent for just about every country in the world.

Note in Italy for example is 14, Austrailia is 14, Japan 13, Spain 13, Netherlands is 12 (if the participants' ages are less than 4 years apart), in the UK it was set at 12 in 1275 and remained so for six centuries but is now changed to 16.


Age of consent:

http://www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe

Please do not ignore the statistics from the Western world. Who has the highest divorce rates? Who has the highest abortion rate? Who has the highest prostitution rate? Many Western people even have sex before marriage. Look at the pressure the young kids are put on in high school (if not middle school) to have sex. Don't ignore your realities.

Well, I hope this has made you think and has helped answer your concerns on your journey to the path of truth.

 

[Al-Kashmiri]

weight also plays a role in starting menustration and other races that are know for bigger body types probably will start before others. While a young girl starts menustration the curves of a woman dont normally come to years later. is there any men on this site that can actually say someone that is 9 years old would sexually arouse them in order to consumate a marriage because i have also heard in islam you are not " officially considered married" until you have had sex

Nikah, linguistically is said to mean to consummate, or to marry. So if it is said, so-and so performed nikah with his wife, it means intercourse. If we say so-and-so had a nikah with so-and-so, then it refers to marriage. One is officially married when the Nikah is performed, in this sense I'm talking about the marriage contract. However, if the marriage isn't consummated and the pair divorce, the man needs not to play the mahr.

I hope that sheds so light on that last point you made.

It is known that Muhammad, peace and blessings be upon him married a number of women, his first wife being significantly older than him I don't think it is a case of arousal, or rather I don't see the significance of its discussion, since as I said earlier the Messenger married `Aa'ishah as it was part of the revelation, i.e. Jabreel (Gabriel) showed him his wife in a number of dreams.

Thank you for the information.

 

[AliIbanez]

well i guess a lot of people i guess think
if you believe we worship 3 God because polythesim is worship of many Gods, which 1 of the 3 do you worship

Only one, 'cause Allah swt (or God in Christian term) said in the Quran distinctively and with clarity (I've quoted it in bold):

O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His apostles. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah. Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs. [4:171]


We worship Allah swt (or again, God in Christian term). The one who is worthy of worship is the one who can able to create things by just saying only one word ..."Be". 'Cause Allah swt says:

The similitude of Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him: "Be". And he was. [3:59]

 

[blackivy393]

Hello BlackIvy,

I'm going to elaborate on your thoughts. When I get a chance, I will inshallah (God willing) answer the rest next time.







[yt]YUjWqRTBRzQ[/yt]

Also take into account that people's life span was much shorter back in those days then it is now. Health, diet, and food nutrion has tremendously changed. They didn't have the choices that we have today.

Please see below the age of consent for just about every country in the world.

Note in Italy for example is 14, Austrailia is 14, Japan 13, Spain 13, Netherlands is 12 (if the participants' ages are less than 4 years apart), in the UK it was set at 12 in 1275 and remained so for six centuries but is now changed to 16.


Age of consent:

http://www.avert.org/aofconsent.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe

Please do not ignore the statistics from the Western world. Who has the highest divorce rates? Who has the highest abortion rate? Who has the highest prostitution rate? Many Western people even have sex before marriage. Look at the pressure the young kids are put on in high school (if not middle school) to have sex. Don't ignore your realities.

Well, I hope this has made you think and has helped answer your concerns on your journey to the path of truth.

and also hymen repair surgery is very popular in the middle east if not more in than in the US; who knows where all these activities would be an epidemic if the society was to allow such to flourish or that these options were allowedd. and there are many middle eastern countries that have a very high prostitution rate i.e. iran, Indonesia is the 2nd largest consumer of *!*!*!*! if im not mistaken. pointing out pitfalls in one society or the "western world" and ignoring the rest in the rest of the world is a big mistake.

but yes i do recognize islam has many traditions on how marriage, engagement ,and interactions between different sexes, does help to prevent zina

while children in the past had more responsibilities i dont think it was due 2 the fact they looked older, there are regions in the world where the diet is still pretty much the same as it was over 1,000 years ago, and the different militias in Africa that are kidnapping kids and putting them in the military where little of western society has adverse affects , still look like kids.

 

[AliIbanez]

Hi blackivy393

With regards to your question:

and can anyone address the wine drinking that will be taking place in heaven ?

The wine in paradise (or anything in it) is pure and we (as human given by small portion of knowledge save for the things that are unknown to us) cannot compare it from the wine here in this world which is corrupted (i.e. intoxicating). Basically this is only a part (or maybe smaller than that) of the rewards that men will receive in paradise, for those who avoid things that are corrupted and prohibited in this world but will be given in the next life .. contrary and exactly opposite of the things that he or she desire in this world. Everything that Allah swt prohibited in this world is a test for mankind.


Surah 83

22. Truly the Righteous will be in Bliss:
23. On Thrones (of Dignity) will they command a sight (of all things):
24. Thou wilt recognise in their faces the beaming brightness of Bliss.
25. Their thirst will be slaked with Pure Wine sealed:
26. The seal thereof will be Musk: And for this let those aspire, who have aspirations:
27. With it will be (given) a mixture of Tasnim:
28. A spring, from (the waters) whereof drink those Nearest to Allah.

Surah 47

15. (Here is) a Parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised: in it are rivers of water incorruptible; rivers of milk of which the taste never changes; rivers of wine, a joy to those who drink; and rivers of honey pure and clear. In it there are for them all kinds of fruits; and Grace from their Lord. (Can those in such Bliss) be compared to such as shall dwell for ever in the Fire, and be given, to drink, boiling water, so that it cuts up their bowels (to pieces)?

And again the joy that Allah swt mentioned in the Quran upon drinking wine in paradise is not the same as the joy felt by men when intoxicated here in this world.

Allah swt stated in the Quran:

[32:17] You have no idea how much joy and happiness are waiting for you as a reward for your (righteous) works.

And in some translations this joy is well kept hidden within us and only in the hereafter it will be revealed. The only question is, if we will make it?

 

[TheHumbleWun]

can anyone address the wine drinking that will be taking place in heaven ?

http://www.turntoislam.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6424&highlight=wine+heaven

 

[beliefinone]

Be cautious of the media

As salaamu alaikum, greats post and information my fellow Muslims, I am really enjoying reading your dawah. May Allah ta ala reward you greatly.



Salaam, Black Ivy

I would really like to say be cautious of what you see in the media. What we see is not always how it appears. Without getting in really deep, I would like to encourage you to study world history and events.

If you look at social situations you would see that prostitution has been around for thousands of years. Under different names and titles, temple priestess, women of the night, etc. Some were call harlots some healers etc. Anyway, the point is the difference is the cultures and why people do what they do. In many countries women prostitute due to economical situations and as a means of survival. I am not condoning it, just letting you know the deal. Here it is a mixture of things lust, fast cash, drugs, esteem issues etc.

In other cultures chasity is highly recommended and valued. Unfortunately, you have bad seeds in every culture and often these women are raped by militia, countrymen, soldiers etc. They become embarassed to be presented to a man in such way and do not want to be stigmatized so they try to get this repair. There are may situation as to why one get the private area repaired.

Children in ancient cultures where indeed reared differently because more was expected of them. Female children were reared to be wives and mother, cooks, seamtresses, domestic keepers, nurturers etc. They knew these was noble duties. Research the infux of women going to college back in the day. Even here they had the concept of going to college to find a husband. My aunt got married when she was 13 years old and had twins by 14. This was not out of the ordinary in the 40's and 50's. Men did not always marry for arousal either, they married women for the community that came from "good stock". The reputation of the family and the female was important. They were good wife material so to speak. In Islam add a good knowlege and APPLICATION of the deen to this you have inshaAllah a very stable marriage. There is Hadith that make reference of this can't get it word for word out of my head tonight. In addition, Nowadays, people marry more so because of lust, not every one, but alot of folks do, that's why marriages are foreclosing left and right like houses.


It is still under debate from various scholars ,historians etc as to the age of Aisha. Allah knows best. However female was married OFF at a young age but not necessarily intimate until a while after.

Salaams
G
sorry about the spelling and grammar. LAZ

Five a day :tti_sister:

 

[blackivy393]

As salaamu alaikum, greats post and information my fellow Muslims, I am really enjoying reading your dawah. May Allah ta ala reward you greatly.



Salaam, Black Ivy

I would really like to say be cautious of what you see in the media. What we see is not always how it appears. Without getting in really deep, I would like to encourage you to study world history and events.

If you look at social situations you would see that prostitution has been around for thousands of years. Under different names and titles, temple priestess, women of the night, etc. Some were call harlots some healers etc. Anyway, the point is the difference is the cultures and why people do what they do. In many countries women prostitute due to economical situations and as a means of survival. I am not condoning it, just letting you know the deal. Here it is a mixture of things lust, fast cash, drugs, esteem issues etc.

In other cultures chasity is highly recommended and valued. Unfortunately, you have bad seeds in every culture and often these women are raped by militia, countrymen, soldiers etc. They become embarassed to be presented to a man in such way and do not want to be stigmatized so they try to get this repair. There are may situation as to why one get the private area repaired.

Children in ancient cultures where indeed reared differently because more was expected of them. Female children were reared to be wives and mother, cooks, seamtresses, domestic keepers, nurturers etc. They knew these was noble duties. Research the infux of women going to college back in the day. Even here they had the concept of going to college to find a husband. My aunt got married when she was 13 years old and had twins by 14. This was not out of the ordinary in the 40's and 50's. Men did not always marry for arousal either, they married women for the community that came from "good stock". The reputation of the family and the female was important. They were good wife material so to speak. In Islam add a good knowlege and APPLICATION of the deen to this you have inshaAllah a very stable marriage. There is Hadith that make reference of this can't get it word for word out of my head tonight. In addition, Nowadays, people marry more so because of lust, not every one, but alot of folks do, that's why marriages are foreclosing left and right like houses.


It is still under debate from various scholars ,historians etc as to the age of Aisha. Allah knows best. However female was married OFF at a young age but not necessarily intimate until a while after.

Salaams
G
sorry about the spelling and grammar. LAZ

Five a day :tti_sister:

i see some people trying to make excuses for other people, in all areas of the world drugs and prostitution pretty much goes hand and hand look @ the growing drug problem in Iran, number one source of funds for Al Qaida. everyone is a case by case basis in why they are doing what they are doing; and there are people who prostitute themselves in order to support their family here as well, how do i know this? because i know some. and to say if someone is getting hymen surgery because they got raped, is being optimistic. there are many women that are having consenual pre-marital sex. because many people in countries where it is third world i doubt have the+5G to shell out for this type of procedure. its obviously middle class and up and having such procedures done.

its getting really annoying how a lot of people think everything shown on the news in the US is lies or a conspiracy to damage islam or the outlook on other countries. Some news sources just present hey look everyone the problems we have here in the US is also problems people have in other parts of the world. the news does present sometimes biasly because it will only show negative and not positive, which the media has done with many groups. but i see more muslims saying that the negatives stories being reported "truly dont even exist" and its a fictional story in order to corrupt because they the middle east is this perfect place. many religious police are involved in prostitution and drugs;

thats why so many people around the world can't even get help from different agencies that provide aid or counseling because people are denying their problems in the own communities or anyone that has been interviewed must be "arab christian" that speaks arabic and its part of the media lie to make the islamic world look bad. this how some of you people on this site sound. it reminds me the way of prison inmates talk about the conspiracies of the government, and how laws are really in place to keep people down and locking people up for crimes, is really a conspiracy to make sure people dont live their lives